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One aspect of cultural relevance that I haven’t seen many people in this thread talk about is musical impact. This is an area where Chicago is an absolute heavyweight. There are so many pioneers spanning many different genres that developed their musical careers in Chicago. Not to mention the influence of things like Pitchfork (before they were owned by Condé Nast) and Lollapalooza. It doesn’t have the clout that NYC/LA has, but it’s certainly way ahead of Boston in this regard.
Chicago recently became a rap heavyweight. And that’s not even really true. It bubbles before their Drill movement was taken over by- you guessed it New York. And that’s where it been at home ever since Prior to 2012 I knew more artist from Boston than Chicago.
In 2012 the only artist I knew from Chicago were Twista Kanye and Common: only one of which makes hits.
Where as Boston has had New Edition Aerosmith Donna Summer Tavares and New Kids on the Block.
I really don’t know any non rap Chicago artists. But I must acknowledge it’s history as a Jazz capital again like 80 years ago..although Boston’s jazz scene was underrated.
Chicago has an edge but NYC is wayy wayy ahead of it.
I won't comment on musicians in Chicago vs Boston, because I can't name many Chicago artists... but I will on Music Festivals
Boston Calling is the equivalent to Lollapalooza. New York's is Gov Ball+EZoo
1.Lollapalooza
-Big Gap-
2. Gov Ball
3. Boston Calling
-The biggest Gap
4. E Zoo
Bruh Boston Calling is not *actually* popular. Its claim to fame is how everyone tries. It’s lineup every single year It’s claim to fame is how everyone tries. It’s lineup every single year for being boring and still an old.
Not at all like Lollapalooza it’s highkey a niche event for white college age LOCAL people. Nowhere near as racially diverse, big or nationally appealing as Lollapalooza. Probably closer to electric zoo for real…
Not a super important point, but the metropolitan area population of LA didn't pass that of Chicago until 1960 and didn't have a substantial lead in population until the 1980 census which in the decade and half leading up to it saw dense US urban centers see some rather, uh, turbulent times.
The 1940 census passing of the city of Chicago in city limits term had a lot to do with LA having annexed a massive amount of land in the decades prior that included a lot of existing towns and made for a Los Angeles city that was and is much larger than Chicago by land area. Surely Bostonians are familiar with this concept as Boston is a rather "small" city by dint of its small municipal land area.
My point isn’t LA was bigger/better whatever in 1940 but to push back on the notion LA was some flash in the pan city that only “that generation” would care about. It has been a top 5 city for over 90 years now.
1. Lollapalooza - 400k
2. Governors Ball - 100k
3. Electric Zoo - 90k
4. Boston Calling - 40k
Seems like Boston Calling is at the bottom of this pack in terms of relevancy. Although it’s kind of hard to compare Electric Zoo to these other ones because that one is slightly more niche.
Yeah E-Zoo will not be coming back after the last 2 years.
I hen I said equivalent, I meant like… the event style. But you basically reworded what I wrote.
Second city was called second city by Chicagoans. Just cause Boston is called “the Hub of the Universe” does not mean it actually is.
The second city term was coined by a New Yorker, dopey, not a Chicagoan. And "Hub of the Universe" was and will never be as widely popular of a term as Second city was unless you're basing it on some dumb social media data. We're talking about common knowledge here. Boston isn't nearly as widely known outside of Sports and Harvard as you're painfully trying to make it out to be. It's just not. Futhermore, Boston is in its glory days now in terms of popular culture and what people know about it. This is all a new phenomenon since Y2K, well maybe Goodwill Hunting a few years before Y2K but that's it.
The second city term was coined by a New Yorker, dopey, not a Chicagoan. And "Hub of the Universe" was and will never be as widely popular of a term as Second city was unless you're basing it on some dumb social media data. We're talking about common knowledge here. Boston isn't nearly as widely known outside of Sports and Harvard as you're painfully trying to make it out to be. It's just not. Futhermore, Boston is in its glory days now in terms of popular culture and what people know about it. This is all a new phenomenon since Y2K, well maybe Goodwill Hunting a few years before Y2K but that's it.
That’s *25 years* that’s not a blip.
I think we’ve established that in 1987 or whatever this was more of a debate but Chicago has declined and Boston has gone up since then
Chicago recently became a rap heavyweight. And that’s not even really true. It bubbles before their Drill movement was taken over by- you guessed it New York. And that’s where it been at home ever since Prior to 2012 I knew more artist from Boston than Chicago.
In 2012 the only artist I knew from Chicago were Twista Kanye and Common: only one of which makes hits.
Where as Boston has had New Edition Aerosmith Donna Summer Tavares and New Kids on the Block.
I really don’t know any non rap Chicago artists. But I must acknowledge it’s history as a Jazz capital again like 80 years ago..although Boston’s jazz scene was underrated.
Chicago has an edge but NYC is wayy wayy ahead of it.
The only artists you mentioned that really had any long-lasting musical impact are Donna Summer and New Edition. And Donna Summer wasn’t a Boston musical artist. She just happened to grow up there. Her music career took place entirely in NYC.
So many important groundbreaking artists developed their career in Chicago including Muddy Waters, Sam Cooke, Kanye, Liz Phair, Chaka Khan, Tortoise, Wilco, Frankie Knuckles, Steve Albini, etc…
House music originated in Chicago. There are few cultural movements in music that have a legacy as influential as house music. Nearly all popular music genres today are influenced in some way by 70-80s house.
Pitchfork Magazine (as much as people hate to admit it) were highly influential in the indie music scene. Before the acquisition by Condé Nast, a single Pitchfork review could literally make or break an up-and-coming artist. This is another example of why Chicago has had an outsized impact on the music landscape at large.
The only artists you mentioned that really had any long-lasting musical impact are Donna Summer and New Edition. And Donna Summer wasn’t a Boston musical artist. She just happened to grow up there. Her music career took place entirely in NYC.
So many important groundbreaking artists developed their career in Chicago including Muddy Waters, Sam Cooke, Kanye, Liz Phair, Chaka Khan, Tortoise, Wilco, Frankie Knuckles, Steve Albini, etc…
House music originated in Chicago. There are few cultural movements in music that have a legacy as influential as house music. Nearly all popular music genres today are influenced in some way by 70-80s house.
Pitchfork Magazine (as much as people hate to admit it) were highly influential in the indie music scene. Before the acquisition by Condé Nast, a single Pitchfork review could literally make or break an up-and-coming artist. This is another example of why Chicago has had an outsized impact on the music landscape at large.
Brining up someone who died in 1964 is kind of the point we are trying to make. Chicago *was* part of the Big 3 but there is no big 3 anymore. Chicago has fallen back pretty significantly to the pack.
Kanye, Chaka Khan etc any “modern” artists are just people from Chicago people haven’t been making music in Chicago for like 40 years.
Also New Kids of the block basically invented the modern Boy Band so they’re pretty important
Doesn’t change the fact that rent is controlled in the units I’m walking about.
State got rid of down 51-49 in 1994 via state wide ballot referendum. There were 3 three jurisdictions in Massachusetts with rent control Brookline Cambridge in Boston, and they all voted heavily in favor of it by 2 to 1 margins. Quite frankly it was a racist classes valid question put forth by developers we had a much stronger and more wealthy lobby, than did urban renters. There was also an aspect of middle-class white folks who wanted to be able to move into more units in the city.
It's very specific in New York City, and very different from other cities as I've seen. What are the still existing rent control guidelines you're referring to you said are in place today and akin to what I mentioned?
My point isn’t LA was bigger/better whatever in 1940 but to push back on the notion LA was some flash in the pan city that only “that generation” would care about. It has been a top 5 city for over 90 years now.
It doesn't seem like he was referring to LA is a flash in a pan city that only "that generation" would care about. I must've missed something.
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