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Charleston’s not cheap, but for the past 20 years it has grown at a fast rate. Transplants from up north list lower taxes, warmer weather, and the beauty of the area a lot, like most of them. I have heard it so much it doesn’t seem anecdotal. Another reason, of course, is they got a job here or transferred. And also retirement.
You seem to believe that COL is the literal only reason people move to Houston, DFW, or Charlotte. That is somewhat hard to believe based on my encounters here. It is of course a significant reason. I don't question that. My goal is to combine a list of reasons. Saying it is solely COL comes across as extremely dismissive especially since several people who have made the move contradict that.
I also say this because there are lots of places up north bleeding African Americans that are not expensive, have great amenities, and have large black populations. Is it simply that people don't like cold weather? Perhaps, I don't know.
And two of the three people we re-located are single no kids. If you can't make it in Boston or Philadelphia on 120K single no kids, yes its a personal problem. Or perhaps warm weather and suburban lifestyles are a huge part of it.
You are making perfect sense to me. But going back and forth with some of these posters who view everything through an obvious bias is pointless and futile. Relocating from the NE to the SE had little to do with COL, but had everything to do with a superior quality of life, for me and my family.
You are making perfect sense to me. But going back and forth with some of these posters who view everything through an obvious bias is pointless and futile. Relocating from the NE to the SE had little to do with COL, but had everything to do with a superior quality of life, for me and my family.
And me as well but you know that NE bias on these forums. I can say since the pandemic the amount of black visitors visiting Houston is astronomical. Houston has sorta of become a city to visit and have a good time.
At any rate, Texas has always had a large black population along with the a strong culture and at one point a booming economy. So black people moving to Texas really isn’t that hard to believe outside of just a lower cost of living at one point. And whoa people don’t want to live on top of each other and buy houses with space and land. I don’t see how this is all so hard to believe. And we all know about Atlanta being the black mecca and gay mecca as well.
... how many people wanna tell you, a Houstonian, they moved to your city because they couldn't afford it back home? That's generally not what people are going to say, its embarrassing (and I feel like moreso in a work setting) and there's some stigma behind that. You have to take anecdotes like that with a grain of salt.
Almost everyone is gonna say "yea I wanted to" once they get down to Houston. Not "my rent went up 40% or my tax bill jumped". No, they're going to say "I was looking for a change." Yea... a change in rent or mortgage. Or they simply wanted a bigger home. It can be a thousand things, but the #1 predictor of where people will move is where they can afford. Everything else is second to that.
Nah, generally Black people from expensive cities have no problem letting you know up front "It's too damn expensive to live in such and such anymore." That's one of the things I hear often from Black Transplants followed by other reasons. I never followed up with questions like, "What's the number 1 reason you moved from such and such". People don't talk like that in real life. And I don't think people generally measure their reasons for moving like that either.
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Originally Posted by BostonBornMassMade
Representation/Culture[/B ]-I found Philly to have far more African Americans downtown than Chicago. I found Downtown Chicago to be whiter than I thought it would be you could really feel how its 28% black (feels more like 8% downtown) and Philly is more like 41%. The segregation there is real. I also don't think people who live in those cities are very concerned about what goes on downtown because most of us don't go downtown that often- there are many neighborhoods in all these cities. A lot of the people I hear who move for culture tend to come from suburban areas of Boston or Philadelphia and really at least in Boston's case know nothing about the black culture within the city or are intimidated by it to an extent. It seems that the poorer African American neighborhoods arent how people understand or identify black areas of southern cities. They don't carry the same damaging infamy. They are aware they can find HBCUS and upwardly suburban black populations in the south much more easily. The northern inner cities, at least in the Northeast have a wide myriad of pro-black or other general "black" organizations, facilities etc. It certainly feels like a much bigger part of your identity in northern cities than in southern cities IMO so I don't relate to this. Up in Baltimore, Philly, NYC, NYC and Roxbury, black people have a lot of Pan-African flags, Kwanzaa banners, Black this Black that, five percenters, nation of Islam, 52 blocks practitioners throughout the black neighborhood. The suburbs are very different and much more isolating especially in Boston orto a lesser extent Philly.
In general, I enjoy the cultural niches (and eyes, segregation that goes along with it), history, and the feeling of striving and scrapping in the Northeast. Many Americans do not. The US South is a pretty unique region in the world in its layout whereas the Northeast is a bit more typical of much of there rest of the world.
As a Pan African myself I can speak on this. I think there's an overrepresentation of Black people in the south as being more docile, Christian and less conscious than Black people in the Northeast. Now I can't speak on Boston but I can speak a little on Philly, NYC and Baltimore.
From my experience, NYC is noticeably distinct from any other city I've been to when it comes to Black representation from all philosophical and political backgrounds. In Philly and Newark as well it's definitely noticeable not as much as NYC but it's there. Baltimore I didn't really notice it as much as the other areas I mention but I'm pretty sure it's there.
But in my honest opinion, Atlanta felt much more diverse on all cultural aspect of Blackness than any other city I've been to not named New York even in the Northeast. I use to run into them Sa Neter TV cats, 5 percenters, NOI, Nuwaubian spooks all the damn time in Atlanta.
Houston while not as rich as Atlanta(which I would consider behind NYC) is distinct enough as well. I mean you got your N.O.I, new Black Panther Party chapter here, Juneteenth flags, Pan African crowds, Sankofa Caravan, there's no shortage of that especially in neighborhoods like 3rd Ward, Acres Home and 5th Ward. You even got people I strongly disagree with like Young Pharaoh, Dane Calloway and even Amanda Seals who live in Houston now.
But Black folks in the south generally are more unapologetic Black and varied than what people outside the south give them credit for. Trust me as someone who again is Pan African and an activist who can go toe to toe with anybody from anywhere when it comes to that "conscious" **** and helped get people like Umar Johnson and Tariq Nasheed( before I realized they were scammers) and Ashra Kwesi(who lives in Dallas) to speak at the Shrine of the Black Madonna and other Pan African stables here in Houston I know all about the perceptions and what not. And yes I think you can find some of the most docile Black folks in the south but also some of the most revolutionary minded Black folks in the South at the same time.
You seem to believe that COL is the literal only reason people move to Houston, DFW, or Charlotte. That is somewhat hard to believe based on my encounters here. It is of course a significant reason. I don't question that. My goal is to combine a list of reasons. Saying it is solely COL comes across as extremely dismissive especially since several people who have made the move contradict that.
I also say this because there are lots of places up north bleeding African Americans that are not expensive, have great amenities, and have large black populations. Is it simply that people don't like cold weather? Perhaps, I don't know.
And two of the three people we re-located are single no kids. If you can't make it in Boston or Philadelphia on 120K single no kids, yes its a personal problem. Or perhaps warm weather and suburban lifestyles are a huge part of it.
I agree with you 100%. And don’t something like COL cancel itself out with the fact that jobs are well known to pay less down South than they do up North.
And what does COL even entail; that’s one of the most overrated things ever. Your phone bill is going to be the same wherever you are. If you’re in Texas, your property taxes is going to be higher even if your income tax is lower. I find it all evens itself out in the end.
Cept for NYC, everything is way expensive; I don’t see how poor people live up there, bedsides a completely subsidized life.
Another thing, a lot of our judgement is clouded because some of us are “urbanist”. In my experience, most black people don’t care about the type of things people on this board value, when it comes to the cities.
Naw.. Brooklyn Jo is right. In the Bos-Wash corridor most people i know move south primarily often solely due to COL. Same with the white people
Atlanta and Dalls arent expensive to someone from New York.. Its still hella cheap compared to what were used to. People share the "expensive" listings from ATL and you wanna just pat em on the back and say "brother, you have no idea.."
It like how I have a friend in Chicago always telling me about how "high" rent is in Chicago. I gotta feign the empathy.
You're agreeing with me whether you realize it or not. Those people are limiting their potential Southern destinations to major metropolitan areas with strong job growth and cultural cachet. That tends to be understood and thus not explicitly mentioned--which means they are just as important criteria as lower COL, if not more so. I learned a while ago that "down South" for folks in the DMV/Baltimore who speak of moving there really just means Charlotte or Raleigh, and COL is typically mentioned in the same breath as other positive QOL factors and their trajectories as nice places to live. If they just want cheap cost of living and nothing else, they'd be talking about Hickory or Kinston.
And you know warmer weather is absolutely part of the equation and has been ever since AC was invented. Those moving to my home state of SC are flooding the coast, which means it's more than cheapness they want.
It's similar to the folks moving from NY and CA to the South for political reasons and cite conservative politics and COL as their most important driving factors. They never wind up in the states that are actually the cheapest and most conservative like MS and LA but instead metropolitan TX and FL. It's simply understood and unspoken that only major metropolitan areas are candidates--which demonstrates just how high of a priority those factors are.
Now I will say it's possible that Northerners' perceptions of the South haven't actually caught up to reality in terms of COL. There's no shortage of surprise for many when they actually do move to Atlanta, DFW, Charlotte, etc, especially when they get sticker shock from the hidden costs often obscured by lower taxes.
Little things like African Americans being forced to drive everywhere and suburbs being less valuable than cities play a part.
A six figure white person in a city can walk to all their amenities while a black person in the burbs has to drive and deal with car expenses. A white persons small condo in the city will also appreciate faster than a black persons 200K Mimi McMansion in the suburbs.
Black folks expenses in the suburbs mostly rise while the corporate white man in downtown or an urban community decreases while their salary increases.
You’re talking about young people. The mature African Americans move down south mainly for COL and they have connections there which is why they choose it over the Midwest.
Nah, generally Black people from expensive cities have no problem letting you know up front "It's too damn expensive to live in such and such anymore." That's one of the things I hear often from Black Transplants followed by other reasons. I never followed up with questions like, "What's the number 1 reason you moved from such and such". People don't talk like that in real life. And I don't think people generally measure their reasons for moving like that either.
As a Pan African myself I can speak on this. I think there's an overrepresentation of Black people in the south as being more docile, Christian and less conscious than Black people in the Northeast. Now I can't speak on Boston but I can speak a little on Philly, NYC and Baltimore.
From my experience, NYC is noticeably distinct from any other city I've been to when it comes to Black representation from all philosophical and political backgrounds. In Philly and Newark as well it's definitely noticeable not as much as NYC but it's there. Baltimore I didn't really notice it as much as the other areas I mention but I'm pretty sure it's there.
But in my honest opinion, Atlanta felt much more diverse on all cultural aspect of Blackness than any other city I've been to not named New York even in the Northeast. I use to run into them Sa Neter TV cats, 5 percenters, NOI, Nuwaubian spooks all the damn time in Atlanta.
Houston while not as rich as Atlanta(which I would consider behind NYC) is distinct enough as well. I mean you got your N.O.I, new Black Panther Party chapter here, Juneteenth flags, Pan African crowds, Sankofa Caravan, there's no shortage of that especially in neighborhoods like 3rd Ward, Acres Home and 5th Ward. You even got people I strongly disagree with like Young Pharaoh, Dane Calloway and even Amanda Seals who live in Houston now.
But Black folks in the south generally are more unapologetic Black and varied than what people outside the south give them credit for. Trust me as someone who again is Pan African and an activist who can go toe to toe with anybody from anywhere when it comes to that "conscious" **** and helped get people like Umar Johnson and Tariq Nasheed( before I realized they were scammers) and Ashra Kwesi(who lives in Dallas) to speak at the Shrine of the Black Madonna and other Pan African stables here in Houston I know all about the perceptions and what not. And yes I think you can find some of the most docile Black folks in the south but also some of the most revolutionary minded Black folks in the South at the same time.
I don’t want to say there docile but it’s different in that your not defined by your blackness as much when you’re there which is part of the appeal for people. You can just be and be in any space and so you don’t have to have the blackness aspect or the rigid segregation aspect at the front of mind. When you’re not as “boxed” in so to speak it flows. I wouldn’t say Balck southerners are docile in the face of oppression in jjst speaking about how you can move in space and in town. You’re not as coded into that because blackness is sort of the broader southern culture in the cities suburbs and rural areas.
I do think the idea that Black capitalism and the talented tenth will save the masses of poor negroes is prevalent in the south compared to the north though, it is something I am not a fan of. There’s a lot of complicit ness with what are hurtful and oppressive politics and attitudes towards policing. I suppose that’s more everywhere now (really in the trunk era) but I wouldn’t be telling my truth if I didn’t say I hadn’t noticed a more slightly conservative black vibe emanating from the south east that I am not totally comfortable with. Higher rates of volunteerism in the army (objectively, people in the south are much much more likely to join the army than those in the northeast- of the top 500 counties for army recruitment in 2018, only 2 were in the northeastern states on the western border or PA and northern border of NY) and the prominence of the black bourgeoise give me pause. But I think for most people those are not practical concerns at all, just logical responses to the dominant US capitol system we are forced to live under. I consider both to be somewhat insidious in their relation to uplifting black people (but in a political person, for sure- I’m aware)
Last edited by BostonBornMassMade; 05-12-2023 at 07:29 AM..
I went to college in act and met a Jamaican American from the Bronx who’s mother had moved to Florida. He’s now in dental school in Philly as he had been for 3/4 and he posted this last night
“I’m sorry but everything is better down south (minus the gun control) from the people, to the weather, to the attitudes, everything. Yea, I’m fully done with the Northeast. Everytime I come home as I mature that’s affirmed more and more…”
So that’s his answer. Everything is just better down there.
He posted that from Tampa… and I got to admit- I love Florida, it’s the -#1 southern state I would move to, probably the Orlando or Tampa area. I love it down there mostly for the weather, affordability, palm trees, sunshine, beaches and fun-oriented culture in general.
I remember seeing new construction 2 bedroom apartment for $450 dollars as I drove by Orange Groves and a Public in Clermont. It was vibey. Then I went to the pool in mid-January. I also remember $3 cici pizza buffet billboards and that's when I really knew it was super different. I was like "$3 buffet how is that even a part of life, anywhere, at any point?"
Last edited by BostonBornMassMade; 05-12-2023 at 07:41 AM..
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