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Yes, there's First Class, but most people can't afford it. Do you have any idea what that really costs?
Yes, I know what it costs. I fly it. And I know that today it costs what Economy cost a decade ago.
There is no God-given right to cheap airline tickets.
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And excuse me, but airline seats are fine for the average person... those of us who know when to put down the knife and fork. We sit comfortably in those airline seats, but only when we don't have to share them.
No, they are not. See the link I posted above about safety concerns. The average male passenger flying today exceeds the weight limit the seats have been designed to handle.
And many safety experts have grave concerns about the increasingly-common seat pitches of 29-30" when it comes to evacuation of planes in real crashes. The test evacuations the plane manufacturers perform don't resemble real life at all: the fake "passengers" don't represent a representative cross-section of the public and they know they are about to be asked to leave the plane quickly and are psychologically prepared to do so.
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"The obese are no more a threat than the elderly". That's a nice try, but all of us will become elderly at some point. That's just life.
So what? They still pose a hazard, so by your logic they shouldn't fly. How do you like the thought finding yourself barred from an important form of public transportation in the future?
Public transportation needs to serve the public. That includes the 1/3 of the public who are obese, and the other 1/3 who are overweight.
You are traveling distances 10x faster than a car for not much more than gas, lunch and a night in a cheap motel. FFS, talk about a first world problem, the seat isn't like your f'g lazyboy. It doesn't need to be - it's only for a couple GD hours.
Wtf is wrong with you complainers? think about it. The people like this couple abuse this amazing form of transportation, the seats for everyone who is close to reasonable weight are f'g fine.
Whoa. Did you forget to take the meds this morning? It's not that serious.
I haven't flown economy class in probably 7-8 years. But when I'm turning left into first class or business I always cringe at how small the economy seats look.
No, the real problem is that the traveling public as a whole isn't willing to spend a bit more on tickets to ensure that the space in an Economy seat will be adequate for nearly everyone. The want Cheap Uber Alles; well this is the result of that decision. It's the inevitable results of seating space getting smaller while the public gets larger.
If you want to be comfortable, buy a First class ticket. Pretty much everyone fits in those seats, and you won't risk being uncomfortably squashed by your seatmate. But stop expecting to get something you didn't pay for.
The obese are no more a threat than the elderly, the physically handicapped, those who don't speak English, those traveling with small kids, and (worst of all) those who will stop to get their carryon out of the overhead bin before exiting the plane. You are on public transportation when you take a commercial flight, and that means you are going to be sharing it with the public.
I disagree. The elderly and the physical handicapped not to mention children might be a safety threat if seated in an exit row but not during a normal flight. In contrast, anything (or body) that restricts your ability to move or stretch in the already minimal allotted seat space increases the risk of DVTs.
Flight attendants now discourage "aisle walks" even on wide body jets during transatlantic flights - not that exiting your seat isn't also made awkward by row mates who have difficult first extricating themselves.
At a minimum, the profoundly obese who cannot fit within the arm rests pose a direct bodily threat to the spines and joints of their fellow passengers.
It's all fun and games until it happens to you. People should not have to deal with people spilling into their seat and looming large into their personal space.
Like I said in my previous post - I was effectively pinned in my seat by a rather obese person (300+ lbs). Her butt, leg, back, and shoulder overlapped into my space. I could not lean forward. I was uncomfortably squished into the aisle arm rest as she took up part of my seat. It was impossible to put down the shared arm rest due to her size. Thankfully, another seat was available on the long distance flight. It would have been a very miserable situation if I had to stay in my original seat.
The airlines should require an extra ticket for morbidly obese people. They should not expect a passenger to share their seat with another passenger.
I disagree. The elderly and the physical handicapped not to mention children might be a safety threat if seated in an exit row but not during a normal flight. In contrast, anything (or body) that restricts your ability to move or stretch in the already minimal allotted seat space increases the risk of DVTs.
Flight attendants now discourage "aisle walks" even on wide body jets during transatlantic flights - not that exiting your seat isn't also made awkward by row mates who have difficult first extricating themselves.
Many of the elderly have great problems with mobility; they struggle to get in and out of their seats, and cannot move quickly in the event of an emergency. And just how is someone confined to a wheelchair supposed to get out of their seat? And yet, these people can fly. By Javacoffee's logic, they shouldn't be allowed on the plane - but she will exempt them because she can imagine herself one day joining their ranks. Her "concern' has nothing to do with actual safety and everything to do with discriminatory attitudes concerning overweight people.
I agree that discouraging aisle walks, especially on long-haul flights, is completely insane. But the problem is made even worse by the ever-decreasing seat pitch. It's simply harder for anyone to move from their seat to the aisle when the space between seats is 29" than it is when the space is 33" or more, so people are more reluctant to get up unless they really have to.
Oh, I forgot to say: of course the very portly need to buy that extra seat. I agree with you there! But there's no way to insure that they will. And they don't for exactly the same reason Javacoffee is squalling about my statement that people who care about being comfortable should pony up for First class: it costs too much.
This whole situation is a classic Tragedy of the Commons. Everyone would be better off if the Economy seats were larger, because these "I was squished!" incidents would drop dramatically (notice how you don't hear about these things happening in the cabin where the seat width is 20-22"?), but it would raise ticket prices by 25% or so. So instead most people (regardless of their weight) vote with their wallets for the smaller, cheaper option and hope things work out OK, and most of the time it does - but boy do they get upset when it doesn't!
I disagree. The elderly and the physical handicapped not to mention children might be a safety threat if seated in an exit row but not during a normal flight. In contrast, anything (or body) that restricts your ability to move or stretch in the already minimal allotted seat space increases the risk of DVTs.
Flight attendants now discourage "aisle walks" even on wide body jets during transatlantic flights - not that exiting your seat isn't also made awkward by row mates who have difficult first extricating themselves.
At a minimum, the profoundly obese who cannot fit within the arm rests pose a direct bodily threat to the spines and joints of their fellow passengers.
They really do need to buy that extra seat.
Do they discourage it or forbid it? Certainly I could see people suing if they get blood clots from being forced in their seats for so much time. People have to stop being such wusses and take care of themselves. Get up and walk/stretch/stand when you need to - make the other people move to let you by, or crawl over them- there are medical guidelines about this. And wear compression stockings.
Do they discourage it or forbid it? Certainly I could see people suing if they get blood clots from being forced in their seats for so much time. People have to stop being such wusses and take care of themselves. Get up and walk/stretch/stand when you need to - make the other people move to let you by, or crawl over them- there are medical guidelines about this. And wear compression stockings.
It depends on the flight crew and the airlines with the recent trend to keep passengers in their seats.
A couple of times recently there's been an announcement to stay in your seat period. What's been happening on a regular basis is the use of the fasten-seat-belt sign for longer periods when there is minimal turbulence. Making a dash for the restroom under these circumstances is overlooked. But it prevents the casual walking, or gatherings in the rear.
On the long international flights, there are parents with young children about and those who appear to be in bodily discomfort. It's pretty clear why a very tall person might be. But to keep the aisle clear most as requested do try to stay seated. In earlier periods, there was much more socializing in the rear and within-cabin movement.
Whoa. Did you forget to take the meds this morning? It's not that serious.
I haven't flown economy class in probably 7-8 years. But when I'm turning left into first class or business I always cringe at how small the economy seats look.
The language was a bit too colorful perhaps, but I can't believe how petty some posters here are. The seats are fine for the price and the incredible bang for buck they get from an airplane ride vs any other form of transportation. The only ones who should have to pay for 1st class seating are the obese and giants, who can't fit in them without intruding on their neighbors' space. That this simple, clear cut issue turned into so many pages of squabling is pretty amazing.
The airlines should require an extra ticket for morbidly obese people. They should not expect a passenger to share their seat with another passenger.
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Originally Posted by Aredhel
They DO require it. Did that help you?
There's also supposed to be an arm-chair down rule, which is mandated for safety.
Who would enforce these - particularly once the passengers are on the plane? Many no longer check luggage for a domestic flight. The gate agents and the flight attendants at the door are under pressure for on-time departures. The only person who has advance notice of the potential problem is the overweight passenger.
Even the fellow passenger may take their seat but not completely realize the implications until a short time later as physical discomfort sets in. By that time, the flight doors are closed and the plane is taxing for take-off.
Many flights, particularly domestic, are full although I've had this occur - not to the extent that I described on that 1 hour flight in this thread - on a 12-hour flight from Delhi to Amsterdam. There I did request a seat change. Flight full.
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