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I havent read through all the post here but i have something to say. Mt pittie has been attacked twice by labs. In both cases the dogs did whatever they had to do to get to my little one. The first time was in california a couple years back & the second time was this past friday by my house in short hills (nj). My dog was doing his thing and the lab just ran up and attacked him. I interfered and because i did so i have a fractured hand and a couple bite marks on my hand as well FROM THE LAB. My dog did nothing AT ALL except cry and then ran home (yes all the way home) and to be honest im glad he did because if he didnt then who knows what would have been said. Do you really think someone is going to believe my dog did not fight back NOT. I just let it go because i was afraid if it was even reported it would have some negative reflections on my guy. When i went to the er they did ask alot of questions about if i new the dog or would reconize it & i had to lie & say no. What im trying to say is things shouldnt be like this for us, but because of ignorant people on both ends of this debate, it is. You have the dumb A$$e$ like michael vick ( hope he's enjoying his new year in the pokey) Moderator cut: rude I dont understand why we just cant find a middle ground like mandatory neuter and spaying dont allow little 16yr old boys and girls to walk a dog thats bigger than them on a retrectable leash. I can go on & on but people only want to talk about the ban because thats what they want. They dont want any other options. And thats unfortunate for them because they will never know the spirit of the pittie But i am one of the fortunate ones that will wakeup to it everyday & i thank god for that!!!!!
Sorry about some of the mispells above. I havent taken vicadin since my appendix was taken out 8yrs ago and thats what they gave me for my hand. I guess it has an affect on my spelling. SORRY
Last edited by Sam I Am; 01-01-2008 at 03:55 AM..
Reason: addendum
I havent read through all the post here but i have something to say. Mt pittie has been attacked twice by labs. In both cases the dogs did whatever they had to do to get to my little one. The first time was in california a couple years back & the second time was this past friday by my house in short hills (nj). My dog was doing his thing and the lab just ran up and attacked him. I interfered and because i did so i have a fractured hand and a couple bite marks on my hand as well FROM THE LAB. My dog did nothing AT ALL except cry and then ran home (yes all the way home) and to be honest im glad he did because if he didnt then who knows what would have been said. Do you really think someone is going to believe my dog did not fight back NOT. I just let it go because i was afraid if it was even reported it would have some negative reflections on my guy. When i went to the er they did ask alot of questions about if i new the dog or would reconize it & i had to lie & say no. What im trying to say is things shouldnt be like this for us, but because of ignorant people on both ends of this debate, it is. You have the dumb A$$e$ like michael vick ( hope he's enjoying his new year in the pokey) Moderator cut: rude I dont understand why we just cant find a middle ground like mandatory neuter and spaying dont allow little 16yr old boys and girls to walk a dog thats bigger than them on a retrectable leash. I can go on & on but people only want to talk about the ban because thats what they want. They dont want any other options. And thats unfortunate for them because they will never know the spirit of the pittie But i am one of the fortunate ones that will wakeup to it everyday & i thank god for that!!!!!
Sorry about some of the mispells above. I havent taken vicadin since my appendix was taken out 8yrs ago and thats what they gave me for my hand. I guess it has an affect on my spelling. SORRY
We had a one of the Lab/ Shepherd mixes that use to live across the street from us run into our yard one day a while back, and attack our male APBT, Brooklyn. Brooklyn was on a leash and the other dog wasn't, so Brooklyn really couldn't even stand up for himself! In the end, Brooklyn had a hole in his head where the Lab/ Shepherd mix had bit him and a few other scratches, and the Lab/ Shepherd mix got away without a single scratch! I was so mad, but we didn't report it or do anything about it because Brooklyn is an APBT and the dog that attacked him was a Lab/ Shepherd mix. And you know how that probably would have gone! Now, looking back on the situation, I'm so glad Brooklyn didn't get to fight back because if he would have hurt that dog, even though the dog ran into our yard and attacked our leashed dog, he would have been in serious trouble! It is sad that we have to go through this crap! We should be able to report stuff like this and not have to be scared to death that somehow our dogs will be blamed for it! That is horrible that you and your pitty had to go through that, I'm sorry! I'm glad that it wasn't any worse than it was though.
I havent read through all the post here but i have something to say. Mt pittie has been attacked twice by labs. In both cases the dogs did whatever they had to do to get to my little one. The first time was in california a couple years back & the second time was this past friday by my house in short hills (nj). My dog was doing his thing and the lab just ran up and attacked him. I interfered and because i did so i have a fractured hand and a couple bite marks on my hand as well FROM THE LAB. My dog did nothing AT ALL except cry and then ran home (yes all the way home) and to be honest im glad he did because if he didnt then who knows what would have been said. Do you really think someone is going to believe my dog did not fight back NOT. I just let it go because i was afraid if it was even reported it would have some negative reflections on my guy. When i went to the er they did ask alot of questions about if i new the dog or would reconize it & i had to lie & say no. What im trying to say is things shouldnt be like this for us, but because of ignorant people on both ends of this debate, it is. You have the dumb A$$e$ like michael vick ( hope he's enjoying his new year in the pokey) Moderator cut: rude I dont understand why we just cant find a middle ground like mandatory neuter and spaying dont allow little 16yr old boys and girls to walk a dog thats bigger than them on a retrectable leash. I can go on & on but people only want to talk about the ban because thats what they want. They dont want any other options. And thats unfortunate for them because they will never know the spirit of the pittie But i am one of the fortunate ones that will wakeup to it everyday & i thank god for that!!!!!
Sorry about some of the mispells above. I havent taken vicadin since my appendix was taken out 8yrs ago and thats what they gave me for my hand. I guess it has an affect on my spelling. SORRY
I'm very sorry this happened to you and your dog. I hate when other breeds fight because they will often bite you, tricky situation. A female we adopted out was also attacked by a Lab. It wasn't reported either. I hope you feel better soon and heal up fine!
This is probably the only part I'm not 100% on.....
I dont understand why we just cant find a middle ground like mandatory neuter and spaying dont allow little 16yr old boys and girls to walk a dog thats bigger than them on a retrectable leash.
Mandatory spay/neuter is a form of BSL and it will cause breed extinction. This has been done in other countries and while you get to keep your dog now in about say 10yrs that breed is fazed out.
I believe in the laws we already have in most places, which require licensing, rabies and usually spay/neuter unless you have a kennel license and go through inspection. The problem is that these laws are not enforced in many areas. If they were I'm sure there would be a lot less problems. People should check out there local laws and see what they already have and much they are enforced or not. Here if you own more then 3 intact dogs you need a kennel license (even if you don't breed) this is rarely enforced. If you sell even just 1 pup/dog, trade that pup/dog or collect some type of fee/compensation you need a kennel license. Yet so many people don't and obviously don't have their dogs s/n because they are advertising pups. They don't have them licensed because the city would know they were intact and then they'd be in trouble. People are still byb and having accidental litters no one is enforcing them. Bad breeding, bad owners would be less and shelters wouldn't be full if these laws were enforced that already exist.
I wouldn't call 16yr old little. I don't think little kids should walk dogs unsupervised usually. Especially not Pit Bulls, even though the dog isn't bigger then them it is stronger. Too many things could happen, even if its not from the dog I just don't trust say a 10yr old walking all over without supervision in many places. I don't like retractable leads when some people use them. Most people don't use them "properly" and allow their rude/aggressive dogs to walk ahead of them or all over with no control. They are fine in certain instances but not in your regularly walking down the sidewalk setting when people don't have them retracted. If they are used right then they are fine to use, even a teenager should know when they can let the lead out or not. I wouldn't consider 16yr olds to be little or incapable of walking a dog whether its a Pit or large breed. Most 16yr old boys are bigger then me (taller and weight more), probably even stronger. They can have jobs, drive cars, I would hope they could walk a dog. I walked them at 16 and younger without incident. One girl I knew had a couple Champs around that age and she of course conditioned and walked them every day herself. Handled and showed them as well.
Its all about being responsible! That is what we need responsibility. I've seen 12yrs old who were smarter on dogs and with more common sense then some 32yr olds. Its sad! Because those older people can be parents and raise their kids to be the same irresponsible dog owners and its a cycle. Some of these people shouldn't own dogs or have kids because they don't know how to care for them. They are a big problem in our society!!
This is probably the only part I'm not 100% on.....
I dont understand why we just cant find a middle ground like mandatory neuter and spaying dont allow little 16yr old boys and girls to walk a dog thats bigger than them on a retrectable leash.
Mandatory spay/neuter is a form of BSL and it will cause breed extinction. This has been done in other countries and while you get to keep your dog now in about say 10yrs that breed is fazed out.
I don't think that any breed will ever completely die out. Certainly the animal shelters are filled with unwanted and abandoned pit bulls or pit bull mixes as it is. Anyway, all of over the world and in the US, there are way too many unwanted dogs, cats and other pets for there ever to be a lack of any breed. Show me a breed that is in endanger of dying out and consider that all breeds are in a constant state of development.
What about mandatory spay and neutering unless a state licensed breeder is involved? Each AKC or purebred group can organize and come up with a way of deciding who is a proper responsible dog breeder and then weed out the backyard puppy mill breeders. And if you can't find other fellow same breed owners and breeders to vouch for you, then something is clearly wrong with your kennel.
I don't think that any breed will ever completely die out. Certainly the animal shelters are filled with unwanted and abandoned pit bulls or pit bull mixes as it is. Anyway, all of over the world and in the US, there are way too many unwanted dogs, cats and other pets for there ever to be a lack of any breed. Show me a breed that is in endanger of dying out and consider that all breeds are in a constant state of development.
What about mandatory spay and neutering unless a state licensed breeder is involved? Each AKC or purebred group can organize and come up with a way of deciding who is a proper responsible dog breeder and then weed out the backyard puppy mill breeders. And if you can't find other fellow same breed owners and breeders to vouch for you, then something is clearly wrong with your kennel.
It doesn't matter if there were 5 billion in shelters (which of course there isn't). That is for the time being If all s/n then they will die out. That only makes sense, if they can't procreate then they can't reproduce therefore would obviously become extinct. If all Pit Bulls are s/n how are there to be more? The same would go for any other breed. It doesn't matter if there is an over abundance of Pits they can only live so long, they are not immortal. I would think this an easy concept, there would at first be a lack of them and then total extinction.
In UK and Holland there are virtually no APBT. I believe in Holland they still have AST/SBT and UK they also have SBT. The only ones there were illegally smuggled in or from an illegal breeding which would be very rare. Which means that while a scarce few might exist those people were breaking the law to do so, if everyone was obeying the law they would be extinct in those places. If we have the man. s/n for APBTs here the same thing would happen.
"Show me a breed that is in endanger of dying out and consider that all breeds are in a constant state of development."
What does this mean? That breeds are changing? Or that breeds continue to reproduce?
Your 2nd paragraph is pretty much what already happens. To an extent and it would be great if its enforced. As AKC has a policy on mills and there are COE breeders also but they don't have the will nor desire to police all breeders. Good registries try to keep some integrity within the breeds - breed clubs, breed standards, pedigree verification, DNA for studs, ect but they don't mind if you don't show or if you breed a sub quality dog. Dog and litter registration is what keeps their business going, its what brings in the money for them to continue with what they are doing.
You would also have to put an end to things like ConKC (and all the other sham registries) since they are mostly a reg. for puppy millers and bybs and then they might claim that this cuts into their rights guaranteed to them through US freedoms of independent business. If they are no longer allowed register dogs/litters then they would be put out of business.
All states have breeder required license already. Check with your state, call the department of ag or something. Counties and cities have their own ordinances for breeding which is sometimes stricter then state. People just ignore the laws and don't the license. So what you are proposes is a good idea but already exist. I already stated in my area what exist but yet its not enforced. Even if you don't breed (here) you still need a kennel license if your dogs are intact. So even if you show but don't breed or whatever you are required to have a kennel license by law. People don't follow it though. The problem is that people like you think up a good idea but then no one enforces or there is not enough money, time, man power to enforce it. Where I lived before was like #1 or #2 in the country for puppy mills. While these people were breaking many laws, no kennel license, starving animals, dogs in need of medical treatment, ect, ect. With things like that going on it is hard to enforce laws against small scale bybs who only have 1 or 2 dogs and just as hard to stop the irresponsible pet owners with accidental litters.
They are putting effort into stopping the people committing horrible neglect and cruelty and don't have time to enforce those who are taking decent care of their dogs but still breeding illegally (without kennel license/inspection). There time is also spent on inspections, although depending on where they are it can be more often spent on cruelty cases. I believe the guy here (state one) said he does an inspection like 1 every month or so but gets complaints, mill and cruelty/neglect cases weekly.
There are already so many good laws which either are not enforced or almost can't be enforced due to over whelming number. DH said look in the newspaper and go to all those peoples homes. Because most of those people don't have a KL and are still breeding even though its against the law. Those same people don't have their dogs licensed through the city either because then they would obviously know the dogs were not s/n. The thing is they don't have time I guess to just grab the newspaper every week and go to all those peoples homes. They've got a lot of other more serious cases on their hands. There are bigger fish to fry so to speak.
If the laws could/would be enforced things would already be so much better for dogs. There wouldn't be all these dogs in shelters, bybs wouldn't be able to breed and accidental litters wouldn't happen because those pets would be s/n. I know one poor dog which has had 5 litters with who knows what because she is an unspayed pet, it sucks. I would think after the first time owners would learn they can't leave a female in heat outside unsupervised or that they should just get her spayed rather then dealing with all those pups. Some of these owners hate having pups to deal with yet don't do anything to prevent it, they just complain after the fact.
Are your pit bulls AKC registered? I would think because there a good examples of the breed and then there are too many poor examples or mixes, those inferior dogs should be weeded out. Any pit bull with poor body conformation or a bad temperament should be removed from the gene pool. Any true pit bull lover should only want to buy pit bulls with a documented lineage of their good breeding.
Do you take any of your dogs to the AKC pedigreed dog shows? Do they have any championship ribbons? And what makes you think that your dogs are worth being bred?
And no matter what the laws are, we will never run out of pit bulls. So stop having nightmares over that. Geesh.
Of course the purebred breeds are always changing. Good legitimate breeders pick certain breeding pairs deliberately to produce litters of puppies with certain traits that they want to promote or enhance. And any poor examples that are produced are deemed "pet quality" only and they make sure to have those dogs spayed or neutered so they cannot reproduce. A good breeder does not make puppies just because they are sentimental and want a younger version of their favorite pet or just to make extra money selling inferior dogs.
Ways that purebred breeds have changed would be if you just compare a Victorian era pug dog with a modern one.
If you really love your pit bull breeds, you should want to join a pit bull breed group and all of you take the initiative to self regulate amongst yourselves. Breed your dogs properly so that they have milder temperaments and make sure all pit bull owners own their dogs responsibly. Don't scold us for fearing your dogs. I'd rather be careful than gamble getting some huge medical bills over some attack. Again, I am not just suspicious of pit bulls, but several of the large muscular breeds. And to be honest, chow chows scare me more, but fortunately for me, there are not currently a popular breed to own. I haven't seen a chow chow in person for at least a decade.
Miu your post seems a bit off. No offense. You have taken my reply as now that I am some how defending byb? Where did I say that I breed and think that a byb is ok? I never said I am either a byb or believe that it is ok. I really don't wish people to think that of me.
I only explained the truth of why things are this way. I have talked with the state a few times and DH too, they always have the same thing to say. Not enough time to get everyone, small byb are at the bottom of the list. Their concerns are with puppy mills and they must do the inspections for people who do have KLs.
I also said you had a GOOD IDEA.
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Originally Posted by miu
Are your pit bulls AKC registered? I would think because there a good examples of the breed and then there are too many poor examples or mixes, those inferior dogs should be weeded out. Any pit bull with poor body conformation or a bad temperament should be removed from the gene pool. Any true pit bull lover should only want to buy pit bulls with a documented lineage of their good breeding.
No APBTs are not AKC recognized, therefore they are not AKC registered. Neither is Cane Corso or Boerboel. The inferior dogs should be culled out, the problem is that again the registries don't police. They allow crappy dogs to be reg. bred and reproduce. I often wish that things here were like in some other countries you can't have a reg. litter unless the parents are proven and healthy. Here as long as the parents are reg. the litter can be. Even if the dog is given limited reg. by the breeder the buyer just goes to ConKC or some other sham reg. and sells the pups with those papers.
Breeding certain breeds are about more then just conformation and temperament, in a lot of breeds (APBTs included) working ability is very important as well. The requirements posted on this board for GSDs would be one example of that. It is required for those dogs to even be able to be bred/reg. and all that they to have the total package in Germany. Here you can breed your timid GSD with HD and poor conformation if you wish, same with Pits any breed. In a lot of other countries they have requirements like this. I know again this is America but since it is the registries could have strict requires IF THEY WANTED.
You last sentence is so untrue. Of course thats just my opinion. I consider PBM to be a true Pit lover (although I've never met her), she seems to have great concern for our breed, is very responsible and takes great care of her dogs. She doesn't care that one of her dogs came from unknown breeding and was left abandoned. She doesn't care that one came from a loser byb and doesn't have a pedigree either. I find actually that many people people say only stuck ups want a dog with paper/pedigree. They are accused of not really loving dogs because they only want a pedigreed dog. Whether it is a Pit Bull or other breed, they say you should love your dog for being a dog and not because it has some fancy papers. I don't agree with that either. They don't understand the importance that good breeders play. Whether someone doesn't care about their dogs pedigree or cares greatly about their dogs pedigree shouldn't dictate whether they are a true breed or dog lover.
I guess I can't say I fully disagree. I think in a way they "should" only want one like that if they are buying from a breeder (and not rescuing). Its just that they don't, I hear a lot of people say they don't care about pedigrees or showing, they just want a pet with a good temperament. They don't realize that you have a much higher chance of getting a dog with a stable temperament from a reputable breeder. Some people support byb because they either don't know the difference - they see a byb pup and a wellbred pup - they think why pay more when its the "same thing". They don't know the quality difference in terms of health/temperament problems. The other way they think is they don't want a show dog, they just want a pet so buy from a byb at a lesser cost. It is because they need to be educated, many people who I know that bought from bybs that later found out there is a difference now will never buy from another byb. They will rescue or only buy from a real breeder. I think a little education can go a long way.
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Do you take any of your dogs to the AKC pedigreed dog shows? Do they have any championship ribbons? And what makes you think that your dogs are worth being bred?
No since they are not AKC recognized they can't compete.
No they have ribbons, trophies, medals and champion certificates.
Well this isn't about me. So I'm a little confused that you turned this around into whether I'm a byb or not. I have no problem following my county and state laws on breeding and housing dogs. Some of my dogs are not worth being bred in the least. They are fosters looking for forever homes or permanent rescues. The others I think are worth being bred because they are healthy, best of show winners/champions, working dogs, have the correct temperament for the breed, high drives, energy, trainable and are versatile in what jobs they work in. They live up to what the breed should be and are some of the best representations you could probably find today. It is about bettering and preserving the true APBT. Most of the "Pit Bulls" you see today are overly large, some even deformed with structure problems, minor to major health problems, are not functional workers and don't meet the conformation of an APBT. There are also many mixed "Pit Bulls" being called purebred. Which are being bred for the wrong reasons with problems.
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And no matter what the laws are, we will never run out of pit bulls. So stop having nightmares over that. Geesh.
That will only be because of illegal breeding though. So it will still be dangerous to keep them let alone breed them. Landing you fines and jail time. I'm not having "nightmares" about it. It has already happened in other countries.
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Of course the purebred breeds are always changing. Good legitimate breeders pick certain breeding pairs deliberately to produce litters of puppies with certain traits that they want to promote or enhance. And any poor examples that are produced are deemed "pet quality" only and they make sure to have those dogs spayed or neutered so they cannot reproduce. A good breeder does not make puppies just because they are sentimental and want a younger version of their favorite pet or just to make extra money selling inferior dogs.
Ways that purebred breeds have changed would be if you just compare a Victorian era pug dog with a modern one.
What does breeds changing have to do with byb vs good breeders? Yeah good breeders pair up 2 dogs they find compatible who are breed quality and cull those who are not.
What do breeds changing have to do with bybs who breed because they want a pup “just like molly” have to do with each other? Often they are disappointed because the pups usually don’t turn out just their dog.
So what does the changing of breeds have to do with a breed not being wiped?
Breeds change over time from development until present days, jobs are changed, standards are revised, ect This doesn’t seem related to mandatory s/n.
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If you really love your pit bull breeds, you should want to join a pit bull breed group and all of you take the initiative to self regulate amongst yourselves. Breed your dogs properly so that they have milder temperaments and make sure all pit bull owners own their dogs responsibly.
So now people only love their dogs if they buy a registered dog and join a breed group?
When did I say I wasn’t taking part in the club any longer anyway?
What you are proposing isn’t possible. There is no way a group can make sure all Pit Bull owners are responsible. This is America where people have freedoms to do what they want, including neglecting their dogs up to the point of what the law allows. They don’t have to train or socialize the dog, they don’t have to buy from a reputable breeder, they don't have to play with the dog and keep it happy. Should I put a gun to their head and tell them to s/n their pet quality dogs, put to sleep their dogs of bad temperament, train their pups to be good adults? I nor other members have control over what the large number of Pit Bull owners do. The law only states that they need to be feed, watered and have adequate shelter and also must be given medical treatment if needed. Anything else is their personal choice and I can’t make sure they do anything. No more then I can make sure all Scout drivers are responsible when driving and don’t do anything stupid. That they don’t off road in places where its not allowed, don’t do dangerous climbs and don’t put their or others life in danger.
Our breed club regulates within itself. Puppy millers, bybs and those bad reps of the breed are not allowed to join the club (you have to be voted in). One guy while he bred APBTs he also bred a few different breeds including small dogs which were not groomed as they should be. He was told to his face that millers are not allowed. However we can’t do anything about him continuing to breed and we can’t make him responsible. Because his dogs do have dog houses, kennels, water and food. The small dogs were not bad enough to be neglect cases, which is what sucks. You have to wait until they are badly neglected for the AC to do anything about it.
What exactly is a milder temperament? You say breed properly and then define that they should have a milder temperament. I love their temperaments and don’t wish to change them. They are fun loving, clownish, handler sensitive and energetic. How much milder do they need to be?
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Don't scold us for fearing your dogs. I'd rather be careful than gamble getting some huge medical bills over some attack. Again, I am not just suspicious of pit bulls, but several of the large muscular breeds. And to be honest, chow chows scare me more, but fortunately for me, there are not currently a popular breed to own. I haven't seen a chow chow in person for at least a decade.
I didn’t scold you for fearing my dogs or any other? Again this was about mandatory s/n not about breed clubs, fearing dogs, breeding, changing standards, my practices, my responsibilities. If you have a fear of a certain breed I can’t fault you for that. I sympathize with people who are scared of dogs or anything else. Having fear is a natural part of being human I believe. I’m not scolding you for having yours.
Again, I am not just suspicious of pit bulls, but several of the large muscular breeds. And to be honest, chow chows scare me more, but fortunately for me, there are not currently a popular breed to own. I haven't seen a chow chow in person for at least a decade.
Honestly, many of these dogs scare me too. I generally cross the street and walk on the other side. Some are just too unpredictable. Where I used to live, there was a woman with a muscular breed (part pit maybe?) that could never quiet control her dog. The dog was alway pulling and jumping at the other end of her leash. I avoided her.
But then there was this other dog down the block, a female mastiff, which was the silliest thing I ever saw. Every time she saw me and my dog, her entire body started wiggling like a puppy. This dog was huge, but you could tell from her body language a mile away that she was nothing but sweetness. She would act so silly trying to play with my dog. I loved that dog.
Some dogs are difficult and they are paired with the wrong owners. My sister had a pit bull and had no idea how to train or control it. The dog bit and scared people and the most my sister could do was cry about it. No idea. She eventually had to have the dog put down. Very sad.
Honestly, many of these dogs scare me too. I generally cross the street and walk on the other side. Some are just too unpredictable. Where I used to live, there was a woman with a muscular breed (part pit maybe?) that could never quiet control her dog. The dog was alway pulling and jumping at the other end of her leash. I avoided her.
But then there was this other dog down the block, a female mastiff, which was the silliest thing I ever saw. Every time she saw me and my dog, her entire body started wiggling like a puppy. This dog was huge, but you could tell from her body language a mile away that she was nothing but sweetness. She would act so silly trying to play with my dog. I loved that dog.
Lol I can imagine that. Sounds like one of my dogs. Sometimes I think they are going to hit themselves in the face with their own butt...lol
Oh you also make a good point. When the wrong dog is with the wrong owner bad things can happen, sometimes worse and more tragic things then others.
Reading body language is also wise. Many people would not be bit if they read a dogs body language. For that manner many dogs wouldn't be so temperament if people actually recognized the warning signs of a dog with temperament problems.
You can't say a Dog is dangerous just because it does not like other dogs I own a Bulldog AKA Pitbull he is from good lines and yes he is very dog aggressive. He is not a bad dog because of this but if someone can not control a dog that is dog aggressive I can see where some people would be scared. I myself get scared when I see any dog walking its owner or left unleashed. Unlike the people on here if a persons dog runs up on my Bulldog he is not going to greet them with kisses and I won't get between 2 dogs scrapping although I can pick my dog up if a dog lunges at me or my dog he has a right to defend himself. Bulldogs are not a breed for irresponsible owners and as for all dogs should never be outside without a proper leash.
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I was so mad, but we didn't report it or do anything about it because Brooklyn is an APBT and the dog that attacked him was a Lab/ Shepherd mix. And you know how that probably would have gone! 
Now, looking back on the situation, I'm so glad Brooklyn didn't get to fight back because if he would have hurt that dog, even though the dog ran into our yard and attacked our leashed dog, he would have been in serious trouble! 
It is sad that we have to go through this crap! 
