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We were never one nation. Ukrainian is not even intelligible to Russians, mostly, so it cannot be called a dialect. Serbs and Croats are different nations even with mutually intelligible languages.
Have you ever heard that languages evolve? They never stay constant. A thousand years ago Russian, Ukrainian and Belarusian were for the most part dialects of the same language. Moscow was a settlement built by Kieven Rus (its real name was Рѹ́сьскаѧ землѧ (Rus'kaya zemlya/Russian land/ land of the Rus)) Ukraine is to Russia what the U.K. Is to the US. The scenario with the eastern Slavs is somewhat similar to that of the German tribes, they failed to all unite early on and now you have two German states, Germany and Austria who basically speak different languages and even then there are huge differences within Germany thanks to all the hundreds of German kingdoms that existed a couple hundred years ago.
Have you ever heard that languages evolve? They never stay constant.
Irrelevant.
Everything evolves, including the species.
Quote:
A thousand years ago Russian, Ukrainian and Belarusian were for the most part dialects of the same language. Moscow was a settlement built by Kieven Rus (its real name was Рѹ́сьскаѧ землѧ (Rus'kaya zemlya/Russian land/ land of the Rus))
Have you ever heard that languages evolve? They never stay constant. A thousand years ago Russian, Ukrainian and Belarusian were for the most part dialects of the same language. Moscow was a settlement built by Kieven Rus (its real name was Рѹ́сьскаѧ землѧ (Rus'kaya zemlya/Russian land/ land of the Rus)) Ukraine is to Russia what the U.K. Is to the US. The scenario with the eastern Slavs is somewhat similar to that of the German tribes, they failed to all unite early on and now you have two German states, Germany and Austria who basically speak different languages and even then there are huge differences within Germany thanks to all the hundreds of German kingdoms that existed a couple hundred years ago.
Except that Russian language you speak was created by the learned caste (of mostly non Russian origin) and imposed on the Russians and non Russians alike by homogenizing power of state which assimilated and homogenized humongous chunks of non slavic population into Russian collective while making up history and insane "purity" claims along the way. Forceful, poorly regurgitated imposition not evolution is a russian birth mark. A caricature of both 1000 years hisory and 70 years old war is stll alive and fresh in the neo Russian mind, and that is just a mass psychosis of some sort.
You miss understood me, Russia is a product of Kieven Rus, just as much as Ukraine and Belarus. But that's where all three started from.
It is just too bad that Kievan Rus is a product of imagination not a full fledged civilization of some sort. It did little except temporarily uniting a hodge podge of various people (many non slavic) into a fluid entity paying tribute in stuff and blood to the lineage of the foreign invadors who were constantly feuding between themselves. The entity imported greek religion and learned men before vanishing for good. Much what we associate with Kievan Rus is a later days Russian forgery designed to stake a claim for the real estate..
Last edited by RememberMee; 02-09-2017 at 01:54 PM..
It is just too bad that Kievan Rus is a product of imagination not a full fledged civilization of some sort. It did little except temporarily uniting a hodge podge of various people (many non slavic) into a fluid entity paying tribute in stuff and blood to the lineage of the foreign invadors who were constantly feuding between themselves. The entity imported greek religion and learned men before vanishing for good. Much what we associate with Kievan Rus is a later days Russian forgery.
That's kind of what I was alluding too, Kieven Rus is the Slavic version of the Holy Roman Empire. It was a confederacy made up of a bunch of kingdoms trying to recreate the glory of the Roman Empire and both failed miserably at it. But still the majority of the German kingdoms ended up uniting under one nation as Germany with a few outliers such as Austria and Switzerland, and then the majority of Rus kingdoms are now part of Russia with a few outliers, Ukraine and Belarus. Russia and Ukraine should remain separate since they have grown to far apart just like Germany and Austria but that doesn't mean the cultural connections should be forgotten either.
That's kind of what I was alluding too, Kieven Rus is the Slavic version of the Holy Roman Empire. It was a confederacy made up of a bunch of kingdoms trying to recreate the glory of the Roman Empire and both failed miserably at it. But still the majority of the German kingdoms ended up uniting under one nation as Germany with a few outliers such as Austria and Switzerland, and then the majority of Rus kingdoms are now part of Russia with a few outliers, Ukraine and Belarus. Russia and Ukraine should remain separate since they have grown to far apart just like Germany and Austria but that doesn't mean the cultural connections should be forgotten either.
Kyivan Rus is just one part of our history. It actually goes further back. Kyiv was founded in the 5th century.
The symbol of the Ukrainian people, the Tryzub, has been found by archeologists dating back at least to the 1st century AD in the present territory of Ukraine. We know that it meant something to our ancestors even 2000 years ago, just as it means something to us today. Its ultimate origin is unknown. Anyway, my point is, the earliest beginnings of the Ukrainian Nation predate even the Kyivan Rus.
Kyivan Rus is just one part of our history. It actually goes further back. Kyiv was founded in the 5th century.
The symbol of the Ukrainian people, the Tryzub, has been found by archeologists dating back at least to the 1st century AD in the present territory of Ukraine. We know that it meant something to our ancestors even 2000 years ago, just as it means something to us today. Its ultimate origin is unknown. Anyway, my point is, the earliest beginnings of the Ukrainian Nation predate even the Kyivan Rus.
It could very well be from the Greek culture too before the time of Christ. The trident is not an uncommon implement from our past. All prehistoric river based cultures used them for fishing. The tribes of the Columbia and Snake rivers here in Americas north west used them to spear salmon.
I can't see the Tryzub as evidence of a singular Ukrainian culture as far back as then. It all started with the Ruriks. 2000 years ago 300000 people existed on earth, the majority of them in and around the temperate climates such as the Mediterranean. I doubt then the people of the lands north of the Black Sea even had a concept of nationhood. It was most likely clan and tribal. Don't place your standards on them when thinking about this. Their lives had absolutely nothing in common with yours in any way.
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