BLM and Police officers would have common ground if they'd just talk to each other (parade, statistics)
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Once everyone gets a good debate going, it's difficult to inject facts, but, Walter Williams had an excellent column today on this matter. Blacks vs. Police – Walter E. Williams
He pointed-out some specific facts regarding the actual number of police shootings this year (737 people have been shot and killed by police this year in the United States. Of that number, there were 329 whites, 165 blacks, 112 Hispanics, 24 members of other races and 107 people whose race was unknown). He further highlighted the 4,379 shootings and 806 murders in Chicago alone, the majority of which are black on black shootings, of which only about 12-percent are solved. (The inference that there is very little cooperation in the black community to solve these shootings).
Finally, Williams pointed-out that a glaring problem with the BLM movement, is the tendency to try to depict people like Baltimore’s Freddie Gray, Ferguson’s Michael Brown and Florida’s Trayvon Martin as 'heros.' Along these lines, I have a jpg photo (I couldn't post?) of a protester carrying a large sign: "No mother should have to fear for her son's life -- every time he robs a store." - I certainly hope this wasn't serious, but, it does somewhat seem to represent the attitude of BLM protesters, which is why they aren't taken more seriously.
That was a great article. Pretty much makes all of my talking points and then some. As a law abiding black make who had to work hard to achieve what I have, I despise the low life portion of black society simply b/c they make life harder for me when I get pulled over, wanna move into a nice area, ect......but yet as the article stated, these individuals are often painted as heroes and it's a joke.
After seeing BLM and all they represent, I just go by my own personal slogan of "Good Black Lives Matter". Absolutely no love for those who choose to waste the one life they have by being destructive.
The Chicago stats are always insane BTW. Cops should just stop responding to calls in certain neighborhoods, or at the very least, take their time.
However with all that said, I would like to see the police be pro-active and hold town-halls to explain when they can use deadly force, and to explain the difference as to when a cop needs to be fired or needs to be in prison. It's rarely the latter but the average person doesn't seem to be able to separate the two.
The sad thing is that white criminals are more targeted and more often shot by police than black criminals. I am guessing this is from the fear of riots if a black criminal ever gets shot.
There was a white unarmed meth addict who got shot seven times by an officer in Huntington Beach recently, who even said "No, no!".
If this happened to a black man there would've been riots immediately.
I think in general the police does a good job, but they can definitely cut down on the shootings a bit. Many times the perpetrator will point a gun at them, then it is perfectly justified. But the better thing would be to wait for backup and slowly take the suspect down, just like they do in other countries.
The sad thing is that white criminals are more targeted and more often shot by police than black criminals. I am guessing this is from the fear of riots if a black criminal ever gets shot.
There was a white unarmed meth addict who got shot seven times by an officer in Huntington Beach recently, who even said "No, no!".
If this happened to a black man there would've been riots immediately.
I think in general the police does a good job, but they can definitely cut down on the shootings a bit. Many times the perpetrator will point a gun at them, then it is perfectly justified. But the better thing would be to wait for backup and slowly take the suspect down, just like they do in other countries.
I know you are being respectful but I'll say you really don't understand LE and the inner workings if you say this. I've been in LE since 79 and have been all over the world training other LE and what you've stated is not often true.
And this part of your quote is what I'm referring to.
"But the better thing would be to wait for backup and slowly take the suspect down"
Two of my good friends were shot/killed in the LOD. One being one of my best friends. Neither had this option. Another had to shoot a 17-year old wielding a shotgun. He didn't have this option. I came within a hair of shooting a 14-year old with my shotgun as he came at me asking me if I was going to kill him if he pointed his gun at me. He stopped just as I was starting to apply pressure to the trigger. I didn't have the option you suggested. My point is that events happening in the real world are happening in real time with very little, if any, time to slow things down and say "let's step back and rethink this through so we don't have to shoot them."
I really wish more people would seek out their local PD's and see who offers a Citizen's Police Academy (CPA) and sign up for it. I always handled the K9 night and I got to know several of the participants over time. So many finished up and freely admitted they had no real clue how real police work was and what it took to do the job. I'm talking very educated people.
What people fail to realize is that police rarely get to deal with polite and nice law abiding citizens. I've said this a thousand times, but a police force is reactive. They get called out to deal with the problems that normal people in society don't want to deal with.
When you get that meth head selling drugs to school kids, they have to deal with him.
When someone gets robbed, they have to deal with the thief and with the citizen berating them for not finding the thief fast enough.
When there is a domestic dispute/fight, they have to go out and play mediator.
When there is a shooting, they have to find the shooter.
Day in and out these people have to get up in the morning and kiss their families goodbye knowing that it could very well be the last time. Really think on this before responding. How would anyone who is adamant that cops are bad in general fair if you had to do the same thing? How would you hold up replaying the scenes of a murder, or wresting someone down who is going for your gun, or replaying the daily scenes of violence and anger through your head?
Police see almost nothing but the negative sides of society and have to deal with it. It is very easy for an armchair quarterback to tell them what they are doing wrong but not many will get up and do anything about it. If you want to change something, join the police academy and see it for yourselves.
My stepfather was shot in the head in the parking lot of Bruno's in Hattiesburg, Mississippi in the early 90's for responding to a robbery call. He and his partner got out as the guy was running from the store. The guy shot my stepdad's partner, took his gun, and shot my stepdad in the head over $30 worth of food that he stole. He lived through it, but had to take an early retirement from PTSD over the incident.
Doing that sort of job hardens people. If it didn't they couldn't continue to do it. Yet people complain without knowing why a cop is making the call that they're making. We rarely know all of the circumstances of an event. Then when we find them out people still try to say that there were other options. The only option when you're faced with an aggressor is not to die. The rest fades into the background to be criticized and picked apart by the same armchair quarterbacks later on.
If a cop is routinely called out to a certain area to deal with the same individuals, and knows that more times than not the calls end in a physical confrontation do you not think they will begin to treat every call as if it were dangerous? As a child, most of us learned that when you touch a hot stove it burns you. So you learn very quickly how to react to a stove and check it before you touch it. You're ready to draw your hand back quickly in the event that it is hot. The same applies to a cop. It's human nature to become very cautious and ready to react to a situation that historically has been troublesome. Don't forget that cops are humans just like the rest of us... except if they get their reactions wrong it could be their last.
I know you are being respectful but I'll say you really don't understand LE and the inner workings if you say this. I've been in LE since 79 and have been all over the world training other LE and what you've stated is not often true.
Not when the suspect has a gun by the way, then as I said it is fully justified shooting to kill. But many times the perp will be unarmed or just armed with a knife, baseball bat or something similar (usually someone mentally ill or high on drugs), and instead of waiting for backup so that they can try tazing etc, they will often attack right away (and shoot the suspect) - or at least this is what we see on videos.
Lets take the Huntington Beach shooting above as an example. What if instead of starting to fight with the scrawny meth head, he would call in backup and 6 officers would surround him. Then, three officers can point their gun at him in case he does anything of substantial risk of danger to the officers or bystanders. The other three officers can taze him at the same time. Once they have him on the ground, they can disarm the suspect of whatever weapon they have (except if they have a gun). That's how they do it in countries like Brazil, South Africa and Thailand, countries with a lot of crime and gun violence. They have substantially less police shootings compared to the US.
Is it perhaps a lack of funds that causes this to not be an option? Or why are officers constantly showing up and fighting with suspects alone and not calling for backup?
I am very much on the right of the political spectrum and if a hardened criminal dies then I guess that's good in most cases. But many people who die due to police shootings did not deserve it. They may deserve a year in jail, but not death. These greeting dogs are a good example:
Police see almost nothing but the negative sides of society and have to deal with it. It is very easy for an armchair quarterback to tell them what they are doing wrong but not many will get up and do anything about it. If you want to change something, join the police academy and see it for yourselves.
But nobody is forcing you to be a police officer. And it's not like you don't get paid for it. You chose that line of work. If you don't want to put your life on the line, you should've done something else. Therefore I don't think it's an excuse to say you shoot first because you want to go home to your family. It's not like you are a civilian who got attacked.
Your job is to keep the streets safe for everyone, even people with mental illnesses or teenagers acting tough in front of their buddies. You need a very cool head to do that and many officers obviously don't seem to have that. I guess paying the police more but have a tougher selection process would solve a lot of problems.
Last edited by JayVanderbilt; 10-05-2017 at 08:56 AM..
Several centuries too late for "talk". A slapped face never forgets and blacks have been slapped since the first slave was brought to this continent.
Unfortunately, all white people are painted with the same brush of racism just as blacks are painted with that brush. Where is there room for "talk"?
White people died by the hundreds of thousands to end slavery. White people were instrumental in the founding of the NAACP. White people also rode on the "freedom" buses into the south where some died for it. Yet all that counts for nothing in the big picture.
Far too late for talking. More likely to intensify.
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