Is a gunfree USA a better place? (arsenal, stats, deaths)
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It makes perfect sense. Obsessive people are boring, and while obsessing over coffee just makes you unusual, those who obsess over firearms can and do have an effect on those who don't have this peculiarity.
How.
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Example- single issue voting. Candidate Smith is a well qualified, experienced lawmaker endorsed by many legitimate organizations-he favors a cooling off period and background check for handgun purchases. Candidate Jones is a newcomer to politics, questionable qualifications and a sketchy past-he favors a repeal of all handgun laws. Guess who the NRA will endorse and who the NRA members will vote for? Don't say it doesn't happen-I've seen it time and time again. I don't like single issue voting from the handgun banning nuts, either.
This is just an invented story, anecdotal strawman. If one candidate wanted to ban the import of Columbian coffee because it doesn't have the same flavors as Hawaiian Java, and another candidate didn't, I'm sure the coffee nuts would be all over it and barring us from enjoying a nice strong roast from the Drug capital of the world.
You don't surprise me: You see the gun as the problem, not the dangerous people that are using them--the criminals, the alienated youth. Someone who is a "gun-nut" is just as peculiar and careful about their firearms as any other aficionado of any other collecting hobby.
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Guns are just a tool, albeit a potentially dangerous one,
and I have no problem with guns. But I do have a problem with those who can't see what this "gun culture" has done to America and who fight any kind of attempt to put into place some common sense laws. You're against a cooling off period and a background check for a handgun purchase? Really?
It robs people of the right to defend themselves. Waiting three days to a week to purchase a handgun for self-defense is hazardous to those who need it in that time. The cliche "battered wife" is cliche because it's true.
And those who are intent on killing people that day are not going to wait around. Private sellers don't require background checks or cooling off periods. Neither do trunkslammers, or friends and neighbors.
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You don't see anything wrong with open carry?
Yeah, I do. Open carry makes you a target--people should be carrying concealed.
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America is becoming a nation of big mouthed, tough guy paranoids, and maybe I'm out of step with society because I don't share this paranoia. So be it.
Paranoia? I think people are unhappy with their constitutional rights being whittled away. The problem isn't firearms, it's the poor education we have in the U.S. It's the sensationalist media we have literally reporting every robbery, every murder, and making the world seem more dangerous than it really is. You want lower crime rates? Invested in the education of our children, especially those of low-income families who can't afford private schools and where property taxes ensures their public schools are underfunded. Invest in alternatives to prison. Don't support sensationalism prevalent by the likes of CNN, Fox, and others.
Paranoia? It's the sensationalist media we have literally reporting every robbery, every murder, and making the world seem more dangerous than it really is.
Thanks. We don't often get such blatantly obvious self-contradictions to play with.
This was actually very funny, Konrad.
Paranoid people. Right?
Paranoia is the inability to function because of a delusion that you're being persecuted.
When the government, and by government I mean liberal left groups(not all of you, I know, I'm fairly liberal myself) are doing everything they can to make sure you don't have access to your constitutional right to own firearms, it isn't a delusion.
That is to say that paranoid people have enough trouble leaving their homes. The vast majority of gun owners, and those fighting for gun rights, are able to leave their homes.
Konraden-I agree with a lot of your final paragraph. The "Patriot Act" (an ironic name if there ever was one) is a prime example of rights being taken away. And I agree that the firearm itself isn't the problem, but that's like saying gasoline and matches by themselves aren't a problem. Unfortunately, when humans are included in the equation, they become a problem.
The rest of your post could have come from an NRA handbook. I've heard all the arguments against reasonable gun laws and they all fail to convince me, but if having 20 handguns is what makes you feel all safe and cozy, knock yourself out.
When the government, and by government I mean liberal left groups(not all of you, I know, I'm fairly liberal myself) are doing everything they can to make sure you don't have access to your constitutional right to own firearms, it isn't a delusion.
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I've asked this about 100 times on various forums, and have yet to receive a reply. Maybe this time I'll get lucky.
Show me one citation of one American Liberal who has ever advocated that all private citizens should be denied their constitutional right to own any firearms.
Now who is delusional and paranoid?
par·a·noi·a
2. baseless or excessive suspicion of the motives of others.
Konraden-I agree with a lot of your final paragraph. The "Patriot Act" (an ironic name if there ever was one) is a prime example of rights being taken away. And I agree that the firearm itself isn't the problem, but that's like saying gasoline and matches by themselves aren't a problem. Unfortunately, when humans are included in the equation, they become a problem.
Well, obviously human's are not the problem either, it's the irresponsible use of said gasoline and matches, especially the use of those by arsonists. The criminals, you know.
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The rest of your post could have come from an NRA handbook.
Ironic. I don't even like the NRA, too much religious right bull****, can't stand it. It'd be nice to see them focus on gun rights.
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I've heard all the arguments against reasonable gun laws and they all fail to convince me, but if having 20 handguns is what makes you feel all safe and cozy, knock yourself out.
20 Handguns are meaningless without proper training, but you can't force proper training on people. This is the joy of it being a right not a mandate (as I'm sure jtur88 will agree with me) is that those that do actually own and train with firearms are safer with them. They know safe handling, training with the firearm means that if they should need to use it, they can do so effectively.
You don't really need much training with a shotgun though.
I am for some gun control, but certain laws are ridiculous and absurd. Open carrying is perfectly fine. Personally, it probably makes you a target, but there is nothing wrong with someone carrying openly. Police officers and security guards do it all the time, and they are required to do so. Citizens that carry do so by choice. You don't do something by choice unless you're comfortable doing it.
And with Concealed Carry, I'm actually happy licensing that because it weeds out the morons. CCW holders are far less likely to commit crimes (something like 5x less likely IIRC).
I've asked this about 100 times on various forums, and have yet to receive a reply. Maybe this time I'll get lucky.
Show me one citation of one American Liberal who has ever advocated that all private citizens should be denied their constitutional right to own any firearms.
Now who is delusional and paranoid?
Handgun Control Inc., I.E. the Brady Campaign, The Coalition for Gun Free America. You've never heard of them?
Oh, and my roommate, an American Liberal, thinks all guns should be banned.
Handgun Control Inc., I.E. the Brady Campaign, The Coalition for Gun Free America. You've never heard of them?
Oh, and my roommate, an American Liberal, thinks all guns should be banned.
I just went to the first two, and could find nothing in those sites that advocated the general denial of the rights of Amerians to bear arms, nor the confiscation of all firearms from all private citizens. Google: No results found for "The Coalition for Gun Free America", does not exist under that name. Maybe you can supply me with a link so I can check it out.
Please get help. Paranoia is a serious psychiatric condition, but it can be treated.
Handgun Control Inc., I.E. the Brady Campaign, The Coalition for Gun Free America. You've never heard of them?
Oh, and my roommate, an American Liberal, thinks all guns should be banned.
Offer to take him out for a day at the range. Teach him how to operate a firearm and all of the rules, written and unwritten, for the safe operation of said firearm.
A .22 caliber rifle is a good one, because the ammo is cheap, recoil isn't an issue, and long guns are easier to be on target with than handguns.
If he's open minded, he might change from being completely anti-gun. Resist the temptation to be argumentative with him, just take him out and show him the fun that can be had with guns.
If he's dead set against it, not much you can do to force him. But you can usually catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.
"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government."
George Washington
Last edited by nan5623; 04-02-2010 at 11:44 AM..
Reason: touch up
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