I Pledge Allegiance to the Flag, of........................... (California, declaration, percentage)
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I bet they never did. But kids are highly susceptible to peer pressure, and they were probably told that they "had to" do it. Very few kids have the self-confidence to think through their behavior and do what runs against the grain of all the rest of the class. And people who create these kinds of rituals know that, and use it skillfully to reinforce conformity.
What you read as coerced conformity, I read as a challenge to responsibility. It's absolutely astonishing to me that we could get such different impressions from the same twenty-three words.
"I pledge allegiance to my flag and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
Last edited by formercalifornian; 04-24-2010 at 09:07 PM..
What you read as coerced conformity, I read as a challenge to responsibility. It's absolutely astonishing to me that we could get such different impressions from the same twenty-three words.
"I pledge allegiance to my flag and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
If the fact that two people can interpret something differently "astonishes" you, you're in the wrong forum. And that fact that I astonish you does not by itself make me wrong. You left out "under God". I refuse to be "coerced" to put my hand on my heart and acknowledge your God. Or anybody else's.
If the fact that two people can interpret something differently "astonishes" you, you're in the wrong forum. And that fact that I astonish you does not by itself make me wrong. You left out "under God". I refuse to be "coerced" to put my hand on my heart and acknowledge your God. Or anybody else's.
Please don't put words in my mouth.
As to the phrase "under God," I was quoting the original 1892 Bellamy pledge. I didn't leave anything out.
What you read as coerced conformity, I read as a challenge to responsibility. It's absolutely astonishing to me that we could get such different impressions from the same twenty-three words.
"I pledge allegiance to my flag and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
I see no need to pledge allegiance to any group that doesn't act in my best interests.
When I was in school (early 90s to early 2000s) I never felt comfortable "pledging" to the flag. So, I quietly stood there, and didn't say it. I wasn't ever told I had to--nor was I ever harassed for not saying it. Pretty much a non-issue.
So today I was in a conversation with my girlfriend about when we were in school we would say the Pledge of Allegiance every morning from 6 years old to 18.
I remembered that we wouldnt question saying the pledge nor would it feel any different than the normal routine of eating breakfast or taking a shower. It was just so repetitious!
And after talking about it, looking back from my viewpoint now as an older and a little wiser adult, see that what we were doing all those years from childhood to young adults really looked like we were being BRAINWASHED. And I say that from the idea that if we were to look at say Russia, or Iran, or Cuba doing this we would certainly say something like, "Wow, they really brainwash them early on to devote themselves to their cause."
Then I got to thinking further that as the free society that we are do we really need to do this? I mean I love my country, and Im pretty sure that so far id rather be here than in the Congo, or South America. Shouldnt we teach our children and people to love their country and pledge allegiance to it by their on free will instead of telling them and forcing them to do so?!?!
I dont know if im right about this, but looking back at it all I just get this creepy feeling about it.
So here is the debate, albeit not necessarily a great one: Should we be forcing school children to say the Pledge of Allegiance every morning or let them make up their own minds?
Don't be dumb. No offense but, that is a very simplistic and naive worldview. You're assuming that the world wants to hold hands and sing "We Are the World." That would be nice and all but the reality is that men (nations) want to dominate! They want to steal your gold, your money, your power, your energy, your land, whatever you have and keep it for themselves and their own. So in man's struggle for preeminence, I say the USA's pledge of allegiance, falls right in line.
If the fact that two people can interpret something differently "astonishes" you, you're in the wrong forum. And that fact that I astonish you does not by itself make me wrong. You left out "under God". I refuse to be "coerced" to put my hand on my heart and acknowledge your God. Or anybody else's.
Then you may also want to give away all your American money, since it clearly states "In God We Trust" on all your green and coin. You would be a hypocrite of that statement if you insist on holding on to it.
Let me know where I can pick it up when you wash your hand of it.
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