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I didn't say it wasn't serious. You seem to think that the "pain" you are feeling in healthcare is somehow more "special" "important" whatever than what the rest of us are enduring.
That makes you an elitist.
Okay, I am not the OP....I am not feeling any pain. I just understand the issue and was expressing my sympathy. Felt others were being a bit critical...like you are right now.
I think you are reading to deeply into my posts. I was letting the OP know that it would be foolish to give away training of a needed skill, especially without benefits and low pay. Yeah, you are right! I'm special, important and an elitist...okay.
Okay, I am not the OP....I am not feeling any pain. I just understand the issue and was expressing my sympathy. Felt others were being a bit critical...like you are right now.
I think you are reading to deeply into my posts. I was letting the OP know that it would be foolish to give away training of a needed skill, especially without benefits and low pay. Yeah, you are right! I'm special, important and an elitist...okay.
Just go back and re-read your post supporting him and then your subsequent posts.
They speak for themselves. You may think of them as just supporting him. What you also did was to place yourselves above the rest of us. Perhaps not intentional, but it is there nonetheless to my reading.
I didn't read through everything but wanted to point something out that I've seen when looking for a job.
I have over 13 years of increasing experience in my line of work (nothing special, I'm an admin assistant). At my last job, I was topped out on the pay scale. I knew people making more than me and less than me. Executive Assistants usually made more than me.
Regardless that i moved out of the state, what I learned is this...even with increased experience, I would still have to start at the BOTTOM of my range of experience. Which meant, instant pay cut (about $15k less than what I was making). One bad thing about staying in one place too long. Anyhow, I tried to go for EA positions (figuring more pay), but honestly, pay in this field is all over the place. So, even with my experience, and all my extra talents that come with my experience, I still had to take a hefty $22k pay cut.
Like you, I took what I could. And I think that is the problem. Employers are paying some very low wages because someone will take it. Especially for the "requirements" they're looking for. Even when I look at jobs looking for 5-8 years experience, with knowing everything under the sun, they still want to only pay about $25k less than what I was making at my last job. I even saw salaries drop the longer I was unemployed. Crazy.
Unfortunately, you left your crappy job at a bad time. Employers can pay little because someone, like you, will take it because they NEED an income. ANY income. And the more people take the low pay, well, the "average" is going to drop....and there you have it. Lower paying jobs. So, most likely, you probably won't find anything paying you what you were getting. Maybe on the low end of your range, but not the high end.
I understand some companies can't afford to pay more, but those that can, and don't, well, I don't feel sorry for them when they get a high rate of turnover.
Just my two cents. I knew I'd have to take a pay cut. I didn't think it would be $22k's worth. Oh, and that was the "lower end" of the cut.
I feel your pain, I lost my job in 06/2012. Moved back to my home state. Hubby lost his job 05/2012. We took it as a sign to return to our families.
A few months after we got back hubby found a job, a few months after that I did. Both of us are making more money than ever but for myself, I'm still being low-balled for my industry and my education/experience. Won't get into it, but I am. I know the company probably thinks I'm being paid fair, but even my boss knows I'm not and I'm working 2 pay grades above my position.
I'm pregnant now or I'd continue looking for work. I'm expecting a promotion this year so we'll see.
I work at a University career center and often deal with the students/alums who are frustrated with their search or their available opportunities. I always tell them that job searching is like house hunting: you're VERY RARELY going to find the perfect job in the perfect location with the perfect salary. You may have to compromise a little, which it sounds like you're doing. Doesn't mean you can't move on to something better. Think of this as a stepping stone to your next job. It's certainly moving you in the right direction as opposed to staying in neutral for a longer period of time.
I know a friend who has refused to compromise even if it means more money. He doesn't want to move and live some place else, and he does not plan on altering his stance any time soon. He's been unemployed for maybe two years, but you got love his conviction.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lsquallhart
Lot's of things to reply to so let's take this one by one.
When did I blame anybody for anything? I've always said this is more my ego at play than anything. I've only blamed myself. I do feel that companies are taking advantage of workers these days by lowering wages and not investing in talent. I personally feel that's the truth. Otherwise I think this is a bad assessment of what I wrote. Thanks for the constructive input though.
The reason she is in court is a response to things she has done to the employees, and they are protecting themselves. She is in two court cases with former employees because of slander. She is (actually was, because that case is now over) in the third court proceedings with a former employee because she tried to say that this person was not laid off . . . when they 100% were. I had to act as a witness in this case. That case was ruled in favor of the employee.
It takes a special type of person to try and take away your unemployment benefits.
One of these people retired, and the other two are now employed again, one of them landed a job with a higher title.
So they do not need any luck, but thanks for the advice.
This assumes that I know I would only be unemployed for a "relatively" short time . . . I had no idea how long I would be out of the game. I also stated that I did not cash out the FULL AMOUNT of my retirement. I cashed out a partial amount, and I still have the rest, a pension, and come to think of it, I have another 401k from a previous job.
Right now I am left with 7,000 in the bank. I had to pay rent for a while and all expenses until my friend said I could crash at his place.
Lol. See above. Or, people can keep assuming I do not know how to handle money. I've had a retirement account since I was 19 years old. Can everyone say the same? The largest part of my problem was working in an emotionally violent environment. I've never had a job where I've had to work so hard to remain healthy in body and mind. I've worked in Trauma 1 hospitals for the majority of my career. I'm used to handling stress. This type of work environment even I could not handle . . . and obviously most of my peers could not as well.
So that was my "major problem". A retirement account meant nothing to me at that point of my life. I have no regrets.
I am a man.
I cashed out a partial amount because I had to. I do live in Boston which is very expensive. 20k may take you far in Phoenix Arizona (I used to live there), but it will go fast in other areas.
Bingo.
Silly statement. This isn't about the pay cut. As I said, this is about the fact that I'm being low balled, because that's what they can get away with. They aren't investing in an employee. They're taking advantage. Money has VERY little to do with this.
If I was working a job that made 10 dollars an hour but I felt I was being paid fairly against my peers, then I would be happy with that wage. This is about principle.
But to say "you shouldn't have quit". Well I definitely should have. I ended up having to see a psychologist because of this job as I was suffering from a severe depression at the end of my career there. I was told that my depression was not due to a chemical imbalance, but due to failure to thrive in a hostile work environment. The suggestion I was given by my primary care physician and my therapist was to leave my position.
I could have used this information to apply for unemployment, leaving work due to health reasons. Why didn't I ? Look at the information I stated above. All those court cases . . . all that drama . . . and the biggest thing. I would have potentially lost some VERY VERY good references at a job I was at for 5 years, and I am fairly young. I had to make a choice. Apply for unemployment. Or do this on my own and keep a good reference. This hospital I worked for is one of the best in the WORLD . . . (yes world . . . not just the USA).
If we're thinking as far as investment, there was a reason I did the things that I did. Nothing in this world is black and white.
Fair enough. Simple enough. However, I am in contact with two managers who are my references in the field (working at other hospitals obviously), and when I discussed with them what I should be expecting, they both said "Around 35 an hour" and they both stated they pay 33-37 an hour for techs. My own research on glass door shows 33.5-36.00 an hour.
So taking the research into consideration, and not just the assumption of supply and demand, but basing my salary requirements on market value . . .
I was lowballed.
Extremely good question, and I do have an answer for this. I didnt want to include this in my original post for fear that maybe employers read this board. I know, paranoia . . . but I mean the way things are these days. Anyway I work in a VERY niche field of medical imaging. There are probably only maybe . . . 150 people in the USA that do what I did as a career. (no I'm not talking about Cat Scan obviously).
I am a 3D Imaging Technologist. I have been for the past 6 years. I've taken a position in Cat Scan, because there are not many jobs in 3D. It's a pretty rare thing. That said, the position I interviewed for asked me if I could teach them how to do 3Ds so they can stop sending out their scans for reformats. I told them I would be more than willing to.
So now I'm working as a CT Tech, but I'm also starting to be somewhat of a consultant. They want me to teach their staff and their doctors how to do something they currently cannot do . . and something they SPEND MONEY ON. So if I teach them how to do things, they will be able to stop sending out scans, and they will be spending LESS money. A LOT less money.
When I wrote my counter offer, I said that I hoped this would be reflected in my pay.
It hasn't.
I've come to accept that.
"Do you possess extra skills or abilities that no one else has?"
Yes. Yes I do.
Thanks for the replies.
The other techs that work there are probably paid $10/hour so you are most definitely not being lowballed. Your skills are why you are being paid over three times as much!
kharing, Thanks for fighting the good fight but many people on this thread are here to either make a point, or find holes in my story or give reasons why my low ball offer isn't a low ball offer . . . when it is. ::shrug:: In a large part I think that's what most of this discussion has turned into. Nit picking and fighting, for whatever strange reason. That's public forums for you.
ieee488. You have been the most elitist and arrogant person to grace this thread, so please do not call others out when you feel they are doing the same. It's extremely hypocritical. You act as if you want to give people advice and insight, but when you do, you are offensive and ready for attack. If you truly were someone who wanted to help others and give financial advice, you would be humble and pleasant. Now you're onto attacking people personally. I do not understand what you are getting out of this thread. Obviously there are places you can be with people of your intelligence level and according to you that is not here. So why are you bothering?
But as kharing stated, with healthcare there's more of a reason to invest in your workers overall, because they're taking care of people, and mistakes can cause lives. My career isn't as dangerous to a patient as let's say nursing or paramedic, but I do have a lot of responsibility. Anybody in healthcare does. Small mistakes can add up to disaster quickly. So I think the shock of not investing in your employees is just "felt" more. The last hospital I worked for built a brand new 20 story building, and then said they had to lay off 300 people and not give any raises that year. So business is good enough to build a whole new tower and surgical suites but again . . . you decide not to invest in your most important asset?
Those who have said it's not unique, you are correct. It's not. Everyone is getting lower salaries and more work, but we should all be upset about it. We shouldn't be saying "you aren't special, welcome to the club." We should be concerned, that when you have that heart attack or that stroke, that you're being taken care of by underpaid, under appreciated, and over worked professionals, and that's a problem. For everyone.
Now. There has a been a lot of nit picking and negativity since I made this thread, and the responses I've made to it have been too much. I haven't really taken the moment to thank people for sharing their stories. I dont mind if you think I'm a crybaby about my salary. In a way I totally was. I own that. I've now taken a deep breath, looked at the positive, and I'm happy I can get back into the work force and move forward. I'm glad people have shared their similar stories, and let me know . . . well "that you aint special". Apparently a lot of people are working for less and many have struggled in different ways, but they're all very similar. That's why I made this post. I needed to vent, and hear what has happened to others. Was my case special? Obviously it was not.
However, this whole talking about my 401k choices, and whether or not my offer was lowball, is quite frankly silly to me. One thing about myself is I do my research, and I have my network and contacts. I am an extremely well informed individual. You do not have to take my word that I was low balled, but that's the facts. Feel free to read the rest of the thread to find information that not only I cited, but other people have cited to try and prove me wrong. It all leads to the point that I was in fact . . . low balled. That's what this is about.
I have a feeling there are a lot of employers here who are on the defensive. If you are here and reading this I just have a message for you. The biggest problem with today's job market is that you are not willing to invest in your most important asset. People. I have seen jobs in my field open for 6 months. There are jobs I have applied for that are STILL looking for people. Two of these jobs I interviewed for a month ago. The fact is, employers want overly qualified people for the lowest pay possible, yet many people are refusing to take those jobs. Start investing in people again, and you'll stop having to sift through 70 applications per job and we'll stop having to jump through 1,000 hoops to land something. The economy is not an excuse to trash your most important investment.
To all of those who are now working with less, kudos to you for having the ability to take responsibility and do what you have to do. To those who have shared their stories, thank you I truly appreciate it. To those of you still looking for a job, I truly send you my best wishes. It's so tiring to apply and interview day after day and hear nothing. I'm really rooting for you all.
I think this thread has run it's course and I wont be posting further here. Hopefully everyone got something from it.
Here's how you should see it. Before you quit, if you received this offer...would you have accepted it? You probably wouldn't because you thought you can make comp pay but lets say you know you can't...would you have accepted it?
Is the extra income you were making worth the stress?
You hated that job. You basically said "F this" and left.
Work, maybe in a year or two you can get a raise. Theres nothing worst than working at a place you hate. And in your heart, the pay wasn't good enough for you do deal with it. For example, if you were making $60 an hour...you likely would have shut up and accepted whatever because of the pay.
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