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I have an idea. I don't know how supported it will be nor how interested people are, but it's worth a try. It's about legal immigration. No, not illegal immigration. So let's all do a favor and discuss illegal immigration as little as possible on here. Illegal immigration is a problem too, but doesn't pose the same problem we are to endure.
The media wants your finds to focus on illegal immigration more because it blurs the real problem of an over abundance of United States citizens. That word ''illegal'' is a good example of how stridency sells. Truthfully, once you're here and have a child here or marry a U.S. citizen - you're here for good. There's no such thing as being legal or illegal. Anyone who refutes that idea is simply not wanting to understand reality for what it is.
The issue is legal immigration. The question is should we limit it? And if we do, how do we do this? Now, I don't want anyone to take this thread the wrong way. I know plenty of immigrants who are great people. In fact, many are more educated and classy than Americans. We don't go to their countries at exploding rates though. I don't purpose for any legal immigrant to be deported or deprived of future citizenship rights. For who's already here, they should be treated as people.
However, that is for who we know before March 1st, 2008. What about after? We don't take it so personal for who we haven't met. I know this couldn't be done immediately either. It'd take time, but may be a wise plan. To those who make that irritating quote ''we are a country of immigrants'', you're right. And this country was built by immigrants. But there has to come a time when we end this. Because in the end, we're all Americans and have to cultivate a way so for all of our citizens to live as best as possible. I think we should limit the number because our resources will deplete if we don't. Compensating for people's non-interest of joining the military is not a good enough reason to want more citizens.
The reason why is because we currently have slightly over 303.5 million people. We're projected to have 428 million citizens in 2050. 2050 is projected to be the year when immigration naturally slows down on it's own for several reasons. Here's what I say. Would multiplying our population by slightly a little less than 1.5 be such a wise thing to do? Places like New Jersey seem compacted as they are. Would it look right for Montana to become the next Jersey?
I don't believe it is wise at all. As for all those conservatives out their that actually thinks our current health care system works, whether they like it or not - we'll eventually end up with Universal Health Care. Countries that don't even have much money have it already. We'll eventually catch up to the ideas of plenty of modern-world countries. Plus, through that - I'm sure many immigrants will naturally become uninterested in our country since the medical field will pay less.
What happens when we have more socialized program in the future similar to the EU? We need to ration our resources properly. Our economy is sluggish. People are losing jobs. How do we know there will continue to be enough jobs for everyone? Everyone continues to try to figure out why we see a decline in America. When all said is done, none of you should be surprised at the overpopulation of our country.
Legal immigrants are good people and work hard. However, we just don't have the room for them. At least not poor ones. If we demanded a higher education level and better medical history of our immigrants, we'd naturally lower immigration numbers, have people immediately middle-class residents (rather than waiting a generation) and this would be more cost friendly. We'd be able to focus our money and energy into the plenty of impoverished Americans we have now. Regardless of whether we provide a path to legalization or deport illegal immigrants, one of these options needs to come about soon.
We can't allow people to sit in the gray territory for the rest of their lives. The problem we have now can't be avoided, but future ones could. We have plenty of people that will not just maintain, but allow our population to gradually increase at a healthy rate. Americans average about two babies. That's not bad compared to much of the modern world. If you don't believe me, ask Europeans and people in Montreal for yourself.
I believe that if we did reduce the amount of uneducated immigrants who are allowed in this country along with the ending of the Iraq war, we'd have a lot of money to do great things. Besides reforming health care and fixing illegal immigration, a decade or two from now - we may even be able to create a way for people to get free community college. Than increase it to regular colleges. If there is one country that works greatly for it's Great Britain.
It's too bad we can't continue to follow some of their great ideals. The states already contribute much more. If the federal government provided the rest, it could become more affordably reasonable to go to college. Many who are working-class who are above the status to qualify for Financial AID often purposely go slow and don't finish college. By socializing college education, we'd slowly diminish our large economic divisions.
Real good things could come about if we focus within our own lines. I think this is just one idea that could really do use for our country. I'm going to post a polling question asking what should we do about legal immigration.
I think we should totally stop ALL legal immigration now. WE can't POSSIBLY accomodate all the ILLEGALS coming in, as long as our resources are strained by the "legals". It's just not fair to ANYONE...
A "side benefit" of this is that, seeing the "legals" cut off, and their hopes dashed, MAY serve to 'shame" the illegals into NOT coming, out of sheer embarrassment. If this happens, and we have no immigration at ALL for a year or two, we can then RESUME legal immigration on a 'conditional' basis. The 'legals' will be made to understand that they're welcome here, but if we get overwhelmed by illegals again, we MAY find it neccessary to, once again, "cut off" legal immigration.
Sounds nutty,, perhaps, but MY idea makes as much sense as what we're doing NOW...
I think we should totally stop ALL legal immigration now. WE can't POSSIBLY accomodate all the ILLEGALS coming in, as long as our resources are strained by the "legals". It's just not fair to ANYONE...
A "side benefit" of this is that, seeing the "legals" cut off, and their hopes dashed, MAY serve to 'shame" the illegals into NOT coming, out of sheer embarrassment. If this happens, and we have no immigration at ALL for a year or two, we can then RESUME legal immigration on a 'conditional' basis. The 'legals' will be made to understand that they're welcome here, but if we get overwhelmed by illegals again, we MAY find it neccessary to, once again, "cut off" legal immigration.
Sounds nutty,, perhaps, but MY idea makes as much sense as what we're doing NOW...
Agreed and no you do NOT sound nutty. We desperately need a moratorium on all immigration into the US until:
a) we regain control of our borders;
b) get rid of all illegal aliens via attrition through enforcement and/or physical removal whenever they are encountered;
c) Rescind or amend the 14th amendment so that it is clearly abolishes the anchor baby loophole;
d) Re-evaluate our immigration laws and update them so that they undoubtedly stress that legal immigration is AT OUR DISCRETION and for the sole purpose of fulfilling a need NO AMERICAN is qualified or able to fill.
e) Financially penalize governments that encourage their poverty stricken masses to cross our borders. Penalize the government of said country $1 Million of foreign aid for every illegal alien apprehended in America.
BUILD A 50 FOOT WALL THAT ENCOMPASSES OUR ENTIRE BORDER, POST ARMED NATIONAL GUARD ENFORCEMENT AND A KEEP A SUPPLY OF LIVE ALLIGATORS IN THE RIO GRAND AT ALL TIMES!!!!!
I think we should totally stop ALL legal immigration now. WE can't POSSIBLY accomodate all the ILLEGALS coming in, as long as our resources are strained by the "legals". It's just not fair to ANYONE...
A "side benefit" of this is that, seeing the "legals" cut off, and their hopes dashed, MAY serve to 'shame" the illegals into NOT coming, out of sheer embarrassment. If this happens, and we have no immigration at ALL for a year or two, we can then RESUME legal immigration on a 'conditional' basis. The 'legals' will be made to understand that they're welcome here, but if we get overwhelmed by illegals again, we MAY find it neccessary to, once again, "cut off" legal immigration.
Sounds nutty,, perhaps, but MY idea makes as much sense as what we're doing NOW...
Yes, and naturally that's why I proposed the idea of raising our standards. Similarly to Canada, Western Europe, Jamaica and other countries. We're an advanced nation. Having a time out period would be valuable. It would allow us to evaluate all of our problems. I don't think such an idea will happen though. At least not in the near future.
The illegal immigrants shouldn't have any reason to believe why they should be here under those terms. However, legal immigrants really shouldn't be punished either. Even though there is a difference as to how each immigrant is legally going about themselves, unarguably the results are the same in the end. That's where ''jus soli'' really comes into play. Anyone born in this country is a citizen. The government isn't going to break up families.
I also believe we should continue to allow legal immigration, but ration which countries are aloud to move here. What I mean by that is allowing more Asians, Eastern Europeans and other groups. Allow a similar amount from there to come as Latin America. There are plenty more people in Asia. They aren't as interested in coming here as them and actually respect the U.N. though, so I don't think they'd come at exploding rates.
There are many ways to solving both legal and illegal immigration, but regardless of their legal status upon the status quo - decades from now it won't mean anything. Illegal immigration could be stopped by improving the INS, hiring much more border security and re-distributing much of the workers on the checkpoints on the Canada border to the Mexico border. I don't necessarily know if that big fence idea would work, but it could help. The best thing we could do to avoid that is by deleting the political obstacles and improving relations with the Mexican government.
Legal immigration is more dry cut. I think we should just reduce it. I think the first step we should take it by reducing that by 20%. Than a few years later, raise that percentage. And continue that pattern. I don't expect a stoppage like the United States did in 1924, but that idea could work too. We should primarily include that 20 percent to those who are least educated. It would protect the interests of working-class Americans who don't have the greatest job security.
And although one's education level doesn't determine the person they are, there economic potential is very indicative of the countries economy they'll be residing in. We should limit immigration on those from Mexico. I believe a big problem is that the American government wants the poorest of America as their own middle-class citizens though. It helps stabilize Mexico and help America. One countries poorest is another's decent. It wouldn't surprise me if the U.S. Government was paying off the Mexican government to do this. They probably pay them off to keep their away from their own borders, so they know they could get rid of their citizens. And they obviously are neglecting this, because their bordering situation with Guatemala is well-secured.
''a) we regain control of our borders;''
Indeed, we need to do this.
''b) get rid of all illegal aliens via attrition through enforcement and/or physical removal whenever they are encountered;''
I wish this could be done, but I don't see this being realistic. Not for nothing, but people who work for this government aren't necessarily the most competent. You can't just spot out who's an illegal immigrant. In fact, you can't even know who's an immigrant by looking. If you're illegal, no one knows - unless you've overstayed a visa, which applies to all immigrants who aren't from Mexico. When we speak of illegal immigration, it obviously only covers Mexicans. The fact that we know they're hear even though they're classified as illegal contradicts the whole wording of illegality.
What we need to do is destroy the perks. Get the illegal immigrants right where it hurts. Encourage them not to come here. What I mean by that is, if they have a child who's born in this country under the ''jus soli'' terminology - we take their children from them. I'll get to what you said about the 14th amendment a little later in the post, but obviously this serves as a scapegoat.
I believe that we should revoke children from all criminals, drug-users and non-working people (who are physically capable of doing so). I described this in detail on one of the recent threads I started. It's essential. You're right about the ''anchor babies'', which is ticket to their staying. It's their ticket to indirectly acquiring legalization. Those who cross the border aren't concerned about themselves. Technically if you are illegal, you broke the law.
Therefore, you're a criminal not just under American standards - but international standards.
If our government doesn't take their children from them who were born in our hospitals and are fully documented United States citizens, than our government shows a lack of backbone. The reason why I believe they don't is because they do indeed believe illegal immigration is essential to our country. They want it, but wouldn't tell you that. It helps give us a continually growing Christian population that's adapted to corruption already that will mesh into the American way of life. It helps give us a larger military. And to the government, that's important. If I ever work for our government, I doubt I'll get along with anyone and will probably look like a hypocrite lol
''d) Re-evaluate our immigration laws and update them so that they undoubtedly stress that legal immigration is AT OUR DISCRETION and for the sole purpose of fulfilling a need NO AMERICAN is qualified or able to fill.''
Well, that wording depends on two scenarios. There are plenty of Americans unwilling to pick crops for seven dollars an hour. We need to give higher tax breaks to these companies so they pay more. We need to give stiffer penalties to employers who don't follow these laws. Raising minimum wage would help too. And for educated professions primarily in the technological and medical field, there will always be a need for outsiders. It's not to say that Americans aren't intrigued to do this, but others are more. And we are apart of a global economy that is well inter-connected. Americanism is of little economic value these days.
Our government should make more strict laws. There are plenty of countries in this world that have laws that instate that the money you make there has to stay there. Or in Mexico's circumstance, you can't own land. You could lease, but not own. Technically, if you're from Mexico and legally immigrate here - you could legally buy real-estate the first day you get here. America allows themselves to be internationally economically abused. They create double standard systems. This is especially true for the Chinese who participate in our economy so well, but limit us from ever doing so with them. Sadly and ironically, the American government and businesses have sold their soul to the global market, yet keep so many of their every day citizens isolated simpletons who are isolated from the rest of the world.
''e) Financially penalize governments that encourage their poverty stricken masses to cross our borders. Penalize the government of said country $1 Million of foreign aid for every illegal alien apprehended in America.''
This could work, but I don't actually believe the American government isn't on the side of those foreign governments - primarily Mexico. Our government is corrupt. And the media does the dirty work. They want us to believe that the government is against illegal immigration, but are they really? The media covers this up by telling us American ties with the Mexican government aren't so hot, but they really are. I wouldn't be surprised if America paid Mexico 1 million for every illegal immigrant. It's because they're of much more value to us in the American government's eyes than they are to Mexico's government.
Foreign governments will always use us. They don't care for us. Even if we cut off their aid, they'd have some way of screwing up over too. If you don't believe me, just look at how scared the U.S. Government could become if Hugo Chavez's ''threats'' came true about the oil distribution of his country. If he actually did control his whole economy like he tries to give off to everyone, he might actually have a serious case. He wouldn't do this though because he has Americans right when he wants them.
''BUILD A 50 FOOT WALL THAT ENCOMPASSES OUR ENTIRE BORDER, POST ARMED NATIONAL GUARD ENFORCEMENT AND A KEEP A SUPPLY OF LIVE ALLIGATORS IN THE RIO GRAND AT ALL TIMES!!!!
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Eliminate, not decrease.
