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Because no chronically homeless in Los Angeles are addicts....
Where do you live? You seem to know nothing about the realities of the homeless in L.A. in 2018.
It's hard to have a conversation with someone who has such a pompous attitude about them, who spouts "data" but can't back it up, and claims that anyone who disagrees with him must "know nothing" about the topic.
Nope, but I am tired of seeing people who think they are so perfect, and high and mighty, and of course sporting the whole "it will never happen to me!".
Ok, someone is one of the aforementioned hipster d-bags, let's just call him "Joe". Joe has has a lovely expensive apartment in San Francisco, drinks those $8 lattes, spends $20 on a plate of hummus, has an iPhone X...ok you get the point. It is present time, 2018.
Now what happens to Joe in say, 5 years? It's now 2023, and Joe is flooded with money, and he is living larger than ever before. Unfortunately, Joe is feeling stressed out. The weeks pass, and Joe is feeling more and more pressure. He just learned that his tech company is downsizing, and he may get the axe. Joe
has all of these bills to pay, and thanks to his super high rent (and those expensive latees/hummus plates), Joe did not have much saved for a rainy day. "OK, I'll cut back on those frivolous items", Joe thinks to himself.
A couple months have passed, and though Joe is no longer drinking or eating expensive food, and has
resorted to going to ::shudders:: Safeway, he is shocked and dismayed that he is still far from having enough saved up, his rent and other expensive still chomping away at his paycheck, like Pac-Man on steroids. Even worse, Joe has gotten laid off. He got some severance pay, but it won't last long!
Over the next couple of months, Joe goes job hunting. He knows he can't just go to Mc Donalds, because a whole month's paycheck there will only pay a small fraction of his rent. He can't rent anywhere else in the city on that Mc Donalds salary, because, um, there is nowhere cheap enough to rent. So Joe tries to get a job with another tech company.
Unfortunately for Joe, he is long in the tooth at the old age of 30, at least that is how the dot-coms all over San Fran see him. They want fresh blood, preferably no one older than 23, because they can mold young, eager, and naive blood in their image, and make them nice compliant dron....I mean "workers". They don't want the older, wiser, more hardened veterans who may demand better pay, or worse, move up in the company ranks, and possibly even REPLACE those on top
So Joe keeps looking and looking without success. With his reserves running out fast, he is desperate for a job- any job at this point. He becomes a bagger for Kroger, after going to hundreds of places, and sending in that many job applications, he winds up as a lowly bagger for a supermarket. His reserves for his rent runs out and he loses his apartment, and most of what he owns, because he cant afford the moving/storage unit fees for his stuff. He is an only child, and his mom and dad are very indifferent to his plight. They are the kind of parents that believe in everyone should pick themselves up by their boot straps, and if they fail, it's their fault. They are not about to have him living with them again!
With his home gone, as well as his furniture, and most of his possessions, he is now forced to stay in a homeless shelter in the Tenderloin. He has to pass drug addicts, prostitutes, crazy men screaming at invisible men, not to mention drug pushers when he leaves the shelter every morning, and returns at night.
5 months pass, and Joe is getting no where fast. He has enough for bus fare, and his own food, but he needs to be real careful, because if "they", know he has any money, he is a very likely target for robbery. Not just outside of the shelter, but inside as well. Unfortunately, one day he did get robbed, and mis-fortune had it was by someone INSIDE the shelter. He was sleeping on his mat in the middle of the night, when he was awoken by a fellow 'resident' who was holding a big knife to his face that he managed to slip by security. "Shut up, or I will kill you! Hand over your money now!" the robber growled in such a hushed voice as not to wake anyone else up or tip off staff. Rather than be gutted for the $10 he had in his pocket, Joe handed the robber the money. "If you tell anyone, I will FIND you!" were the robber's parting words.
after the shock and fear wore off, Joe slipped out of the shelter when nobody was looking, and has never gone back.
Joe finally snaps. He takes what little money he has left, and decides that he no longer cares. "What's the point?" Joe asks himself "I can't get a real job, I can't get an apartment, I can't even afford a junker at this point!" Joe goes to the liquor store, and drinks his misery away on the street. Joe's spirits are crushed, he is so depressed and broken he no longer shows up at his Kroger bagging job, so they decide to consider him AWOL and terminate him with no notification, calls or anything, as they can't get in touch with him anyway.
Joe is now just another drunk, "crazy" man on the street, at least that is what our society says.
(of course, individual situations/lives are highly variable, but this is a very possible scenario)
Joe should have moved to Phoenix, Austin or Seattle big tech hubs right when he was laid off. You can't survive in SF unemployed. Joe was stupid
Yup, Joe was the topical millennial that thought just because he wanted to live in San Francisco that somehow the world would bend to his will so it could happen. Joe had a ton of options and pissed then away.
Yup, Joe was the topical millennial that thought just because he wanted to live in San Francisco that somehow the world would bend to his will so it could happen. Joe had a ton of options and pissed then away.
Well San Fran was a place to have a good career and make his dream. No, he didn't expect the world to bend to his will. But take his Grandfather Jerry who struggled aswell but during a time when the gap between rich and poor was not so severe. When cities were more affordable.
No, no one is expecting to be handed keys to being rich. Just a place at the starting line so they can pull themselves up by the boot straps.
In other words, Joe is willing to pull himself up by his bootstraps. But the bootstraps cost an arm and a leg and he wants more than to just be manager at some big box store in Bumfugg nowhere.
Well San Fran was a place to have a good career and make his dream. No, he didn't expect the world to bend to his will. But take his Grandfather Jerry who struggled aswell but during a time when the gap between rich and poor was not so severe. When cities were more affordable.
No, no one is expecting to be handed keys to being rich. Just a place at the starting line so they can pull themselves up by the boot straps.
In other words, Joe is willing to pull himself up by his bootstraps. But the bootstraps cost an arm and a leg and he wants more than to just be manager at some big box store in Bumfugg nowhere.
So anywhere outside SF is bumfugg no where? What's wrong with being a mgr?? You and Joe sound very much a like. Step outside your elitist box... there's plenty of places where the rich/poor gap isn't big. Geez I hate millennials
Will someone explain to me what is wrong with building lagre camps out in the desert to house these people? These camps would have full time staff to attend to all the homeless people's needs. There would be medical facilities, mental health counseling, Sources for education, job counseling. and most of all, a roof over their head. The money is there, it was voted on, so instead of the money going into politicians pockets, let's use it as it was designed to do.
This business of moving them from one riverbed location to another one, has got to stop.
Bob.
Why would they want to move to large camps in the desert? And what desert, Death Valley? Most of what you are calling deserts in So. Cal actually have towns and communities and would no more welcome a large homeless camp than would the people who live in LA
Anyone who watches the news locally knows there is a tremendous presence of homeless people along the Santa Ana river in Orange county, and there are plans underway to clear out these encampments.
That will do nothing but send them to a different part of the river, upstream, or down stream.
Many of these people for sure are illegal aliens from the south.
Ice knows these encampments are there , so why do they not create a sweep of the area, and deport many of these people?
I believe an effort by cities, and the state to build, and fund camps through out the state, as well as ice rounding up these illegal homeless, would do a tremendous amount of good to ease the homeless situation in California.
Bob.
FFS you can't round up homeless people and put them in camps, last time we looked we still had a constitution and you can't confine someone against their will without very good reason and being homeless is not a very good reason
Location: West Los Angeles and Rancho Palos Verdes
13,583 posts, read 15,664,868 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy
FFS you can't round up homeless people and put them in camps, last time we looked we still had a constitution and you can't confine someone against their will without very good reason and being homeless is not a very good reason
Put them where you want to put them; however, they cannot:
1. Obstruct public sidewalks with tents, shopping carts, etc.
2. Loiter
3. Disturb the peace
4. Urinate in public
5. Defecate in public
6. Trespass on private property
7. Trespass on public property outside of normal operational hours
8. Commit burglary or robbery
9. Threaten others with acts of violence
10. Engage in acts of violence against others
If they cannot refrain from doing any of those things, then they most certainly belong in camps, because that's how lawful societies work in the civilized world. We take people out of public circulation until they learn to behave according to the rules which we have established for the good of the general public.
Put them where you want to put them; however, they cannot:
1. Obstruct public sidewalks with tents, shopping carts, etc.
2. Loiter
3. Disturb the peace
4. Urinate in public
5. Defecate in public
6. Trespass on private property
7. Trespass on public property outside of normal operational hours
8. Commit burglary or robbery
9. Threaten others with acts of violence
10. Engage in acts of violence against others
If they cannot refrain from doing any of those things, then they most certainly belong in camps, because that's how lawful societies work in the civilized world. We take people out of public circulation until they learn to behave according to the rules which we have established for the good of the general public.
You certainly can arrest the homeless for all sorts of reasons, you just need to double the size of the Police Dept. to do it. And even if you arrest them, only the last 3 issues you listed would result in involuntary confinement in jail or prison. But the other issues would result in a citation and nothing else and none of those issues would make a person eligible for involuntary confinement, and that's not just my opinion, it's an accurate analysis of existing case law. Being homeless is not a crime no matter how much you wish it was.
What you can do is create tent cities, put a guard at the entrance with a metal detector to keep guns and large knives out. Provide showers and porta potties and let the residents do what they want. Give each resident a photo ID and don't allow anyone in without one. If they destroy property or harm another resident kick them out. Cheap effective solution that would eliminate most of the problems you listed.
Most of the recent problems in Sweden are due to immigrants not assilmating into Swedish culture.
Why are the Swedes, in fact the Scandinavians, so accommodating to immigrants? Immigrants do what they want and the governments of EScandinavia do nothing. There will come a day that will destroy the country.
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