$4 gas (Boston, Seekonk, Lincoln: to rent, low cost, vehicles)

[matrix5k]

Originally Posted by BostonMike7

I agree with you 100% but the vehicles I want right not do not have an PHEV option. So while we might go BEV as a secondary vehicle in the near future, i don't mind sticking with ICE for now.

My wife is the type that looks at a vehicle like it's an appliance. He requirements are AWD, A/C and a radio and she's happy. She couldn't tell the difference between a Honda or Mercedes out on the road.

I on the other hand am a picky SOB.

Which vehicles do you want? In a few years there will be many more choices.

[matrix5k]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

This is our plan of record. My car tows the boat, drives to Colorado, does the Lowes and dump runs, and does the Vermont winter drive a lot. I drive a 6 cylinder Outback and I’m waiting for a turbo Outback to show up that’s already 15 days beyond the original port date. I’d buy a PHEV if one existed that met my requirements. My wife’s plan is to replace her garage queen S80 with an EV. Her longest drive in years was 120 miles. It would be unusual for her to ever have a 200 mile day.

There are quite a few PHEV SUVs out now or coming soon:
Toyota Rav4 Prime
Ford Escape
Jeep Wrangler 4xe
Jeep Grand Cherokee 4xe
Hyundai Tucson
Hyundai Santa Fe
Kia Sorrento
Mitsubishi Outlander

For your wife, Volvo has the BEV XC40 Recharge but it may be too small. They plan on making BEV versions of XC60 and XC90. There are currently PHEV versions of XC40, XC60 and XC90.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by matrix5k

There are quite a few PHEV SUVs out now or coming soon:
Toyota Rav4 Prime
Ford Escape
Jeep Wrangler 4xe
Jeep Grand Cherokee 4xe
Hyundai Tucson
Hyundai Santa Fe
Kia Sorrento
Mitsubishi Outlander

For your wife, Volvo has the BEV XC40 Recharge but it may be too small. They plan on making BEV versions of XC60 and XC90. There are currently PHEV versions of XC40, XC60 and XC90.

One of my requirements is 3,500 pound towing capacity. That eliminates all but the jeeps. The Wrangler is a toy that drives like farm equipment. The Grand Cherokee is absurdly priced for what it is and comes with that famed Chrysler reliability. No thanks. I’ll stick with my appliance car in the top trim level.

We had an XC60 as a loaner for a couple of weeks. It was kind of uninspired compared to her S80. My wife vacillates between European sedans and giant pickup trucks

[BostonMike7]

Originally Posted by matrix5k

Which vehicles do you want? In a few years there will be many more choices.

I need a 3-row vehicle with min 5000LB towing for towing a car on a trailer. I know there are a few vehicles that get close but there's a few superficial things I don't like about them just due to my tastes and brand preferences.

I'm looking at an Explorer ST right now. I figure one more purchase cycle with an ICE vehicle and in 7+ years or so we will take a real hard look at what's on the market then. I don't think i'll need 3-row then, so i'll have more options.

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by BostonMike7

I'm looking at an Explorer ST right now. I figure one more purchase cycle with an ICE vehicle and in 7+ years or so we will take a real hard look at what's on the market then. I don't think i'll need 3-row then, so i'll have more options.

I've got ~2 more years with the current ICE and I've said for a while this will most likely be my last before going fully EV. I think I could do a Model 3 or Y (long range) today, but I'm still a little nervous about pulling the trigger.

Ultimately, the biggest hesitation is winter driving range. We spend 1-2 weekends per month in either Western Maine (170 miles) or the Mad River Valley in Vermont (200 miles). We often do both without stopping. It would be no problem on a full charge in the summer, but both of those drives are tight even with a full charge when it's below freezing, and the range gets progressively worse the further below 32 it goes (and I did several drives when it was around 0 this past winter, so it's the norm form December-March). There are chargers spread comfortably along the route, and we could certainly split the drive if we need to. But I don't love the idea of stressing about a rapidly depleting battery bar in sub-zero conditions. I'll ultimately do it, but I'd love to see some more range improvement over the next few years.

[matrix5k]

Hopefully in a few years they'll figure out solid state batteries or some other new technology. Lithium has too many cons for the average person.

I always liked the idea of hydrogen but the Toyota Mirai was a flop due to lack of fuel stations. Imagine gas with no stinky emissions and twice the range, that's hydrogen.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by matrix5k

I always liked the idea of hydrogen but the Toyota Mirai was a flop due to lack of fuel stations. Imagine gas with no stinky emissions and twice the range, that's hydrogen.

So was the Hindenburg. LOL

[porterhouse]

Originally Posted by lrfox

IUltimately, the biggest hesitation is winter driving range. We spend 1-2 weekends per month in either Western Maine (170 miles) or the Mad River Valley in Vermont (200 miles). We often do both without stopping. It would be no problem on a full charge in the summer, but both of those drives are tight even with a full charge when it's below freezing

Boston to the MRV isn’t just tight in a Tesla in the winter, it isn’t doable with current battery capabilities unless it’s an unseasonably warm day. I don’t even like stopping for my kids to use the bathroom. Forget about waiting for a charger. Also, unless you own a property at your destination, have fun competing with the other EV drivers for limited chargers. We considered EVs for similar use cases and it just isn’t practical with the current generation of vehicles.

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by porterhouse

Boston to the MRV isn’t just tight in a Tesla in the winter, it isn’t doable with current battery capabilities unless it’s an unseasonably warm day. I don’t even like stopping for my kids to use the bathroom. Forget about waiting for a charger. Also, unless you own a property at your destination, have fun competing with the other EV drivers for limited chargers. We considered EVs for similar use cases and it just isn’t practical with the current generation of vehicles.

Yeah, based on some of the cold weather tests I've seen, the range of the Y (Long Range) dips to around 200 miles at 32 degrees. Realistically a lot of our winter drives are even colder which means the range would dip even further. I'm also not the type to feel comfortable driving with only a few miles left on the charge. So mid-drive stops during the winter are an inevitability if we go this route.

That said, I'm not sure that's a deal breaker for us. We don't have kids, and while we don't love the idea of stopping, I do think we could work it into our drives. We actually stop in Portland pretty regularly for dinner and/or a brewery on the way to/from Maine. It's a pretty natural mid way point and with an EV, it would just become even more routine. For the MRV (which we usually do nonstop), we have to get a bit more creative. We're probably looking at West Lebanon (I wish there was a charger at Big Fatty's/River Roost across the river). Charging at the destination doesn't worry me too much. We recently built our cabin in Maine with the idea of adding a wall charger later. Our MRV destination is the in-law's house, so we'd need consider adding a wall charger to the garage (we've had this discussion already). If not, the ski area has a pretty big bank of superchargers.

[porterhouse]

That’s good. You sound more relaxed about it than most people i know. Stopping doesn’t sound like a big deal until it becomes a necessity. It helps to have flexibility when you depart. Be prepared to wait at the West Lebanon or Berlin superchargers during peak travel times.