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It is not my job to educate you on facts. Apple and IBM are both headquartered in Raleigh. It not their national headquarters but Raleigh is the home to their east coast business operations.
I-277 limits the downtown core's expasion. Urban planners working for the city of Charlotte will tell you that. It is also not aesthically pleasing.
Again, the absolute counts of restaurants maybe more in Charlotte, but I am discussing quality not quantity.
I am trying to compare a commercially succesful studio artist to a vocalist, song-writer. That's the only analogy I can think of to your Beyonce-Rihanna comparison.
Because a company has operations in cities that aren't their home city doesn't qualify that city to be known as a "headquarters." If that's the case for you, I guess AT&T, Microsoft, IBM, ect are all headquartered in Charlotte as well.
There are countless surface lots in downtown Charlotte currently that will be used for expansion if needed, not to mention development could easily begin across I-277. Raleigh doesn't even have an interstate near it's downtown, so there's the end of that.
Majority of the restaurants that would be on par with downtown Charlotte's would be found at Southpoint or North Hills. Definitely not in downtown.
Rihanna is commercially successful? She releases album after album to stay relevant, much like Raleigh and the boosters about how you have top notch education. As compared to Beyonce, who is obviously more vocally talented, can dance, act, has countless endorsements, has sold more than Rihanna with less albums, and is worth over 5 times the amount Rihanna is worth.
Because a company has operations in cities that aren't their home city doesn't qualify that city to be known as a "headquarters." If that's the case for you, I guess AT&T, Microsoft, IBM, ect are all headquartered in Charlotte as well.
There are countless surface lots in downtown Charlotte currently that will be used for expansion if needed, not to mention development could easily begin across I-277. Raleigh doesn't even have an interstate near it's downtown, so there's the end of that.
Majority of the restaurants that would be on par with downtown Charlotte's would be found at Southpoint or North Hills. Definitely not in downtown.
Rihanna is commercially successful? She releases album after album to stay relevant, much like Raleigh and the boosters about how you have top notch education. As compared to Beyonce, who is obviously more vocally talented, can dance, act, has countless endorsements, has sold more than Rihanna with less albums, and is worth over 5 times the amount Rihanna is worth.
Are you done digging yourself in the hole now?
IBM and Apple are admired companies. It's a prestigious place to work in. Their OPERATING offices are headquarted in Raleigh for the entire east coast. Meaning that software engineers, technology experts, designers and INNOVATORS are living in Raleigh because of it.
Sure, IBM has an office in Charlotte but Raleigh is where teh east coast headquarter is. Charlotte is filled with commercial bank and telecommunications employees while Raleigh is filled with more "creative class" workers. It is a FACT that Raleigh has more creative class workers than Charlotte. WIth mid tier cities in the US (Charlotte and Raleigh included), Raleigh is in the top 10 for the population of creative class workers. San Jose (Sillicon Valley) is number 1. By creative class workers, I mean people who are paid to think. Apple and IMB are examples of creative class employers. Charlotte is where the "rich" people live and Raleigh is where the "intelligent" people live. I hate to put it that way.
Raleigh's downtown has a belt too, I-440. Unlike Charlotte's belt, it is not tightly looped which gives Raleigh plenty of room and space to expand its downtown core. World class cities such as Toronto and San Fransico have BIG belts around downtown core. I-440 does not tightly grip Raleigh like the I-277 does to Charlotte. If you understand urban planning, you would understand the importance of NOT having a tight belt around downtown. It is not good for property value to be on the other side, no one wants to go under a bridge.
Your opinion of "good" restaurants and my opinion of good restaurants are different. My opinion of good restaursnts are "farm to table" restaurants that serve organic, local food. Please educate me but the ONLY good restaurants in downtown Charlotte are Rooster's, Halcyon and Harvest Moon.
I am NOT going to name all of Raleigh downtown restaurants because it is more than just three, but I can assure you Raleigh has 5X more of better quality restaurants than Charlotte, I know because I lived there. I do NOT consider chain restaurants as quality.
Raleigh's downtown has innovative restaursnts like Buku (world street food fare), I am yet to find such innovative place in Charlotte.
I don't know enough about Rihanna and Beyonce. What I am saying is that Raleigh is a singer who is a song writer and a vocalist. Charlotte is a like a bubble gum popstar who depends on studio synthesizers and her looks to sell herself and be commercially successful. They cater to different audience.
We have to admire the two cities for what they are and support their growth. There are different! If it they were not in the same state, they would not be compared. No one compares Boston to Atlanta. The differences between Charlotte and Raleigh are simialr to the differences between Boston and Atlanta.
The cause and effect here is not as easily understandable as you might think. Just because a city has high GDP does NOT mean it would be heaven for the creative class or have a good food scene. Asheville has a lower GDP than Charlotte but Asheville has a much better food scene. This is why I brought Asheville up.
Dallas and Houston have higher GDPs than Toronto. However, the latter is a far superior city. Atlanta has a higher GDP than Portland. However, Portland is much more livable than Atlanta.
The fact that Charlotte has a higher GDP than Raleigh is irrelevant. If Raleigh was going bankrupt and Charlotte's GDP was north of 300 billion, then it would be a relevant argument.
GDP alone does not attract creative class. You have to look at GDP and then look at where it is coming from. For Raleigh it is coming from a great sources (academia, research, healthcare, technology). For Charlotte, it comes from banking and manufacturing.
You're conflating entirely too many things here, including extremely subjective qualities associated with other cities we've never discussed which have NOTHING to do with your central argument. Not only that, but you're setting up straw men as well.
I clearly outlined the cause/effect relationship in Raleigh and you're simply digressing. It's quite obvious that the GDP and growth in Raleigh is directly attributable to the plethora of high-tech, high-wage jobs there which, in themselves, are outgrowths of the presence of the universities in the area. This is what is largely responsible for the presence of the creative class in Raleigh; it were only about a foodie scene, then Asheville would also be a creative class haven but clearly it is not.
Again, GDP and growth, in and of themselves and not in comparison with Charlotte's, are quite central to the reasons you tout Raleigh's superiority over Charlotte despite your attempts to deny such.
Be my guest; go ahead and compare Charlotte's downtown restaurants to (mostly) chains found in two suburban malls. Wow...that's impressive.
I was thinking the same thing. I don't think it is a compliment to say Charlotte's restaurant scene mimics the chains in two suburban malls in Raleigh.
To the person asking about Indy restaurants.... Why yes, there are tons in downtown Raleigh. If you think downtown is full of chains you definitely haven't spent much time there. There are actually quite a few indy places in the suburbs too. I find the same to be true for Charlotte. I can only assume the poster trying to knock the foodie scene doesn't know what they are talking about.
This is the silly pissing match stuff I talked about above. I think it is safe to say people in Raleigh and Charlotte are not forced to suffer the early bird special at Applebee's every night.
Come on people. It's hard to take this stuff seriously at this point.
Be my guest; go ahead and compare Charlotte's downtown restaurants to (mostly) chains found in two suburban malls. Wow...that's impressive.
As you probably already know, SouthernLiving had great things to say about Durham's food scene.....
Quote: With a reverence for life’s everyday pleasures (we’re talking coffee, beer, pizza, and pie here), a passionate mix of chefs, farmers, brewers, bakers, and baristas have quietly transformed Durham into one of the hottest food destinations in the South The South's Tastiest Town: Durham, NC - Southern Living
What you probably didn't know is that SouthernLiving had great things to say about Charlotte's food scene as well...
Quote: Nibble your way through Charlotte, and you’ll taste the New South. Shining on the Piedmont with a modern skyline and brimming with emerging restaurants, this is a city that savors the fresh and thenew The Dish on Charlotte - Southern Living
There is a new addition coming soon to Charlotte's food scene, but first read the following about Cleveland's Chef Rocco Whalen.
Quote: Cleveland may not be the culinary mecca of the Midwest, but there are a handful of great restaurants in the city that could compete respectably anywhere. NYC? Of course. Chicago? You bet. San Francisco? Without a doubt. Chef Rocco Whalen's Fahrenheit, now in its seventh year of wowing guests, impressing visitors, and amazing the media, is one of those great restaurants many cities would die for. Cleveland native Whalen has been at this cooking business ever since, at age 19, he graduated from Pennsylvania Culinary and headed west where he worked for five years in the kitchens of restaurants owned by Wolfgang Puck, often toiling side-by-side with Puck at Spago, Obachin, Granita, and Chinois. Chef Rocco Whalen
^^^Another "Fahrenheit" restaurant will open this fall on the 20th floor of Charlotte's brand new Skye Condos building, but due to the fact that it will be a "second location", that would make it a nasty chain huh?
For what it's worth, Charlotte's food scene has spilled over into the Triangle. I'm sure you've heard of Bad Daddy's in Raleigh's Warehouse District. Well, before Bad Daddy's became a 4-location chain, it was a single Dilworth location in Charlotte called Big Daddy's. No joke, I met former Bobcat's coach Larry Brown at the Dilworth location. The place is THAT popular.
There is another chain with several Triangle locations that started out as a single Charlotte restaurant. According to google maps, there are now 14 or so locations of this particular restaurant inside of I-540. "Some folks" on this thread thinks that the Triangle is more sophisticated than Charlotte when it comes to food choices. Hmmmmmm? If that's the case, then why is Charlotte's Bojangles Chicken and Biscuits on almost every street corner in Raleigh and Durham?
^^^In true southern form, the Triangle loves Chicken N' Biscuits; and there ain't (yes I meant to say ain't) a thing wrong with that. I find it sickening that some folks on this thread chooses to put on a front like Raleigh/Durham is NC's answer to San Fran and Boston. Child please!
For the record, Mickey D's, Burger King, Cook Out and SEVERAL other chains have done quite well in the Triangle. The Triangle did have its own unique grocers at one point, but Wellsprings sold out to Whole Foods (and now Triangle chain-haters act like the Whole Foods chain makes the Triangle "special"). New flash, you guys were "special" when you had your own local organic grocers. Speaking of local grocers, here's a little info on Charlotte's 7th Street Public Market.
YES, Charlotte has a lot of chains too (what large city doesn't), but it's not like chains are the only option. When I read some of the comments on this thread, I'm thinking to myself "OMG, are these people serious or are they that clueless as to what Charlotte literally brings to the table"?
Here is another Charlotte restaurant that Jack Black and Gwyneth Paltrow did a movie scene in.
^^^Pike's is the name of this actual South End restaurant. My wife and I eat there regularly. It's located just one block south of the East/West Blvd light rail station (so getting there without the car is easy). Just two blocks north of Pike's is Price's Chicken Coop. The Travel Channel made mention of Chicken Coop; anyone who is interested can do a Chicken Coop search for reviews.
Please understand that I'm not saying that Charlotte's food scene is "better" than the food scene in the Triangle (such a statement is 100% subjective). I'm just saying that folks are starting to take notice of what Charlotte's growing food scene is all about.
Oh man, that last post made my head hurt. I had to stop reading half way through it(way too many fonts and different colors).
I don't see anybody knocking Charlottes food scene. I also don't see it as a knock against Raleigh that regional chains starting in Charlotte like bad daddys and cowfish branch out to the Triangle. It makes sense that successful businesses open up locations where they know people enjoy good food. (I'm not a fan of fast food so I can't speak about them).
Charlotte and Raleigh both have a great foodie scene.
That being said, I don't have a high opinion of the burgers at Bad Daddy's. I'll take Chuck's in Raleigh or Bull City Burger any day over Bad Daddy's.
Ps - Bad Daddy's is not located in the "warehouse district" in Raleigh. It is in Seaboard station clear on the other side of downtown.
Urby - I'll show you around the burger scene when you visit Raleigh. Also, if you are up this way this weekend there is a food truck Rodeo downtown hosting 70 food trucks.
I recommend the dumplings from Chirba Chirba or a melt from American Meltdown. For desert, get a scoop of the locally salted butter caramel ice cream from the parlour truck.
You can thank me later.
Last edited by North_Raleigh_Guy; 08-07-2013 at 09:07 PM..
I don't see anybody knocking Charlottes food scene.
Open your eyes then because there is one guy who has knocked everything from I-277, to the food scene, to the lack of gays/creative class; you name it, he's knocked it...
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_Raleigh_Guy
Charlotte and Raleigh both have a great foodie scene.
I agree.
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_Raleigh_Guy
That being said, I don't have a high opinion of the burgers at Bad Daddy's. I'll take Chuck's in Raleigh or Bull City Burger any day over Bad Daddy's.
I've only had Bad Daddy's, so I can't comment on which is best.
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_Raleigh_Guy
Ps - Bad Daddy's is not located in the "warehouse district" in Raleigh. It is in Seaboard station clear on the other side of downtown.
I read on some Raleigh blog that it was coming to the Warehouse District. Either I read the blog wrong or my memory is not accurate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_Raleigh_Guy
Urby - I'll show you around the burger scene when you visit Raleigh. Also, if you are up this way this weekend there is a food truck Rodeo downtown hosting 70 food trucks.
I recommend the dumplings from Chirba Chirba or a melt from American Meltdown. For desert, get a scoop of the locally salted butter caramel ice cream from the parlour truck.
You can thank me later.
Is this every weekend or is it a once-a-year thing? I'm too lazy to search for the answer at the moment.
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If that's the case, then why is Charlotte's Bojangles Chicken and Biscuits on almost every street corner in Raleigh and Durham?
