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I think you have a good open mind and plan about all this and are on the right track...while I don't agree with a lot you say and most the time read your post staring at the computer wide-eyed and open-mouthed...I do like this view point on dating...
14 year olds going out on dinner dates? No way.. way too young. What the heck happen to just group of friends going bowling or something? Kids are in far too much of a hurry to grow up
The sumissive part is something that can be taken many ways. Either literally or figuratively. The passage from Ephesians is a very common one and I'm sure most are familiar with it, so I won't bother posting the entire text, you can look it up.
I have always taken the passage to mean that the wife must submit herself to her husband as he is the head of the household and to this end her love supports the husband and allows him to fullfill his role which is to love his wife as Christ loved the Church. What this means to me is that the husband must love his wife above all others and be willing to sacrifice his own being for her. When you think about it, the man has the much harder role in this. It's not being submissive in the literal sense or akin to an unequality, but simply highlights that each partner has a specific traditional role to play in a loving and supportive marriage. Afterall marriage is a symbiotic relationship and no partner is individually stronger than the other. They rise and fall together.
I know that different people interpret the passage differently, but I find it a very meaningful and beautiful statement. I can see where aidxen is coming from in his interpretation of the passage and the role of the man in supporting his wife and why he feels that it is an important lesson to learn early.
However, submissiveness that is forced or expected and not done willingly from the perspective of a strong independent person cannot fully meet the role of wife as far as I see it. Your daughter learning an early lesson about not needing a man to support her, but also learning the true role of a wife through your teachings will be better prepared to choose the proper man to enter into marriage with and will be able to submit out of a desire to fullfill her role, not because it is what's required of her. There is certainly a beauty in making the choice and I think that is what is intended by the passage.
I know that this is more of a philosophical discussion, but it is obvious that the OP is approaching his ideas on this from a perspective rooted in religion. This is why something as seemingly insignificant as who should pay for dinner at 14 can have larger consequences and these first dates no matter how trivial are the ones that set the standard.
Personally, I would prefer my daughters to go "Dutch" when they are younger to learn that they are not dependent on a man to support them, but they also need to be educted at the same time regarding exactly what the traditional roles mean so they can begin to put into context the type of men that they should be looking for.
I want to end this by saying that I am not a deeply religious person and while politically conservative I tend to be very liberal on social issues. However, I do believe that traditions and religion have a lot to teach us about our relationships and roles in them.
Can they hold hands? Can they kiss? How about going further? Depends on what is meant by a date. Most guys would want to get to third base after couple of dates. I think 14 is too young because she aint capable of caring for a child yet.
Can they hold hands? Can they kiss? How about going further? Depends on what is meant by a date. Most guys would want to get to third base after couple of dates. I think 14 is too young because she aint capable of caring for a child yet.
The sumissive part is something that can be taken many ways.....
....
.... I do believe that traditions and religion have a lot to teach us about our relationships and roles in them.
Very well put. The whole post (I trimmed it simply to save space.
Thankyou.
Quote:
Originally Posted by northlakemetro
Can they hold hands? Can they kiss? How about going further? Depends on what is meant by a date. Most guys would want to get to third base after couple of dates. I think 14 is too young because she aint capable of caring for a child yet.
A very valid point and if we had taken the 'no dating at 14' approach would have been so much easier. By allowing the date, I have opened the discussion up.
So first an update. Earlier this week, the boy phoned and we had a pleasant chat and then I spoke to his mum. It is all on for tonight (Our Saturday night).
OK back to kissing. So this is a difficult thing to decide on the 'the line'. Now some things are definately off limits. Sex for starters. Hands on breasts or between legs. Kissing is very intimate. Holding hands is a sign of togetherness. So in my view holding hands is fine. So kissing and touching have been a subject of thought and discussion.
There is also another aspect that for some would not exist and that is that as I alluded to earlier, we want her to be submitted to her husband. That means following his lead. Now if we set a set of limits on her and the boy is not aware of those limits then that is going to be very hard on her as she will be torn between conflicting instructions if that makes sense. By that I mean if we have told her no kissing and he trys to kiss her. What should she do. Now obviously that same thinking can be extended to rape. The conflict that she faces is does she resist or just give in. Anyway that discussion can go on forever.
So last night (our Friday evening), the boy's mum dropped in and said hello and took our daughter to youth group. They are not a church family but the boy has decided he would like to go to youth group. (Funny that). But we used the time for two things. Firstly to get to know the other family and the second to explain the rules of behaviour to him. (Oh by the way no kissing on the lips on this first date.) Mind you I think we don't have too much to worry on that score. He is a nice kid but I think half scared to death by the whole thing. Also the 'restraunt' is actually the local pizza shop. They have half a dozen tables where you can eat your pizza although most of their business is take away.
woo hoo. My 14yo daughter has been invited out to dinner by her boyfriend of 2 weeks.
Here is what we are doing but I mentioned this at work and got a variety of responses from one person saying no way would they allow their 14yo daughter to have a 1 on 1 date with a boy under any circumstances to the other extreme where a person said that they didn't care. What would you do.
This is what we are doing. I have told my daughter that she must get the boy to call and ask my permission and that when he calls that he must explain the plan. Like who is driving, where is the diner, who is paying, how are they getting home. Then after he has spoken with me then I wish to speak to one of his parents. (I actually know that the plan is for his parents to drive but I want to meet them first to find out what they are like)
What would you do?
(Oh btw, unless there is a real show stopper, then she will be allowed to go)
I have always been of the opinion that dating should be reserved for older kids. Personally, I did not date until I was 18 and did not miss it at all. Certainly, even in the most permissive of homes, I would never let a child that young go out in anything but a group setting *with* at least one chaperone with the group at all times. But I guess I am old fashioned. But when I was a kid 37 percent of all pregnancies were not unwed mothers either.
IMO saying a 14 year old is "to young" for a date is like saying a 10 year old is "to young" for a scary movie. Some are, some aren't. It's your job as a parent to actually evaluate your own child and decide where yours falls.
Definitely. I remember two girls in our dorm during freshman year in college who both became pregnant by the end of second semester. Even back then, I thought the fact that BOTH of them had parents who forbid them from dating until a certain age was a factor. They never had any experience or knew what to expect around boys/young men.
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