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Location: About 10 miles north of Pittsburgh International
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(few people are still involved in gangs by 30, essentially no one except very high-ranking gang bosses are by 40).
Not trying to be a smartass, but asking because I'm genuinely curious--Is that more a result of the process of maturation, or the process of attrition?
Not trying to be a smartass, but asking because I'm genuinely curious--Is that more a result of the process of maturation, or the process of attrition?
I'm sure that both factors contribute.
If someone avoids a trip to the penitentiary, the graveyard or the nursing home, they'll wise up given enough time.
Low level drug pushers really don't make very much money for all the aggravation they go through.
Not trying to be a smartass, but asking because I'm genuinely curious--Is that more a result of the process of maturation, or the process of attrition?
Obviously, a great deal of gangbangers kill themselves off (if not through shootings, then through drugs, car accidents, etc).
Nonetheless, studies I have read on violent criminals show there are basically two types. The vast majority (90%) are nonviolent as children and nonviolent by early middle age. It's just from puberty to around 30 they cause tons of trouble. These people are, psychologically speaking, basically normal, it's just that unlike us they grew up in a culture where "taking things into your own hands" was expected, even if it meant murdering someone due to a beef. The last 10% are typically those who tortured animals and the like as children. They do not become nonviolent when they get past young adulthood. They're basically naturally violent psychopaths.
To me, this is overall a great sign. It means if we worked on the root of violence in Black and Latino communities (which comes down to distrust of the American system of law and order in general, and the police and courts in specific - not that there aren't some valid reasons), we could eliminate gang violence. We'd still have sick predatory f*cks to deal with, but there's a lot less of them, and they're just as likely to show up anywhere.
This is why I don't think East Liberty is ready to be recommended as a place to live to anyone but urban pioneers .
It's a visit during the daytime sort of place for most people at this point.
While I disagree, having suburbanites thinking this for 2-3 more years will give me enough time to acquire a few more properties in this area before prices increase too much for me to afford to.
While I disagree, having suburbanites thinking this for 2-3 more years will give me enough time to acquire a few more properties in this area before prices increase too much for me to afford to.
Anyone with vested interest would of course disagree. I do think investors in East Liberty will do pretty well as long as they don't mind waiting 15-20 years for a return.
Anyone with vested interest would of course disagree. I do think investors in East Liberty will do pretty well as long as they don't mind waiting 15-20 years for a return.
I've done really well in the last 5 years with the main focus there being the last 2 years. I Had some financing holdups after the 2008 crash, but the last 2 years have been good. 2013 will be even better because of private investors. There's a lot more competition now though.
Not trying to be a smartass, but asking because I'm genuinely curious--Is that more a result of the process of maturation, or the process of attrition?
-Today gangs in Pittsburgh typically don't have single leaders & a following chain of hierarchy. Currently most of the original founders/member(s) aka OG's of most gangs are dead/locked up, but are known as legends.
-However, they do have some sense of structure: the members with most power are in their mid 20's-30's aka OG's, and amongst their age pool the big shots are the most feared/respected individuals. While fear/respect is gained through having a reputation for acquiring large sums of fast money or by committing many notable acts of violence. OG's (original gangsters) have the power to call war on other sets. Following leaders are street soldiers aka G's or Trappers from the ages of 14-23. They are mainly drug dealers and they occasionally do dog fights/car theft as a side. They have the power to extort/harm non affiliated drug dealers, shoot rivals during times of war, sell where ever they please to sell, and do what ever they want to do as long as it doesn't bring unwanted repercussions from the police. Next are little gangsters aka LG's, they are 10-14... Their role is to be look outs, thieves, and occasionally drug dealers. The only members who are exempt from being commited drug dealers are "Muscles", "Riddaz", and rappers. Body guards to leading members ("Muscles") jobs are to be big/intimidating and have a reputation for violence, most of the time these individuals are tall & fat. Though not all tall/fat members are "Muscles" as this is rare, and is only in the organized gangs. "Riddaz" are killers, they may deal drugs, but they are they people who fire semi-automatic assault rifles when "beef is on", as most street soldiers just posses hand guns. Rappers rap as a side job and sell drugs as a main job, but its ok for them to divid more on rapping theman selling dope.
-Many leading members get indicted or get arrested on multiple lengthy charges, they're mid 20's-mid 30's... Some high ranking gang members wise up as I Like Spam stated. Then ironically they often become anti-violence activist, as more often than not that's the only job that they can get due to their criminal record's.
-Rarely do active members reach 40, because they are out of style and younger members believe that they can't relate to them, as most are from the ages of 15-25 (so a 40yr old who's been commuting crime's since he was 15 seems ancient). As a result a 40yr old gang member doesn't receive legit loyalty from his younger affiliated peers, and is likely to be ratted out or turned on (killed) by his own "homies"...
-However former gang members don't always clean up their act's (especially the ones on drugs)... They often still support gang activity in their hood by: influcencing/coaxing younger gang members to commit retaliation shootings and flying the bandanas, or they either slow down to just selling weed or hand guns. These people are called "Old Heads", but not all "Old Heads", are former gang members (an Old Head can be a middle age white man for the matter).
-Also gang members locked up in the Fort/Greensburg/Hunington/etc have little to no control over what happens in the streets. Yet when individuals come out they leave prison with a mentality of a phyisopathic, and as individuals, single handedly prevoke gang wars.
Last edited by Uptown kid; 03-30-2013 at 10:13 PM..
Obviously, a great deal of gangbangers kill themselves off (if not through shootings, then through drugs, car accidents, etc).
Nonetheless, studies I have read on violent criminals show there are basically two types. The vast majority (90%) are nonviolent as children and nonviolent by early middle age. It's just from puberty to around 30 they cause tons of trouble. These people are, psychologically speaking, basically normal, it's just that unlike us they grew up in a culture where "taking things into your own hands" was expected, even if it meant murdering someone due to a beef. The last 10% are typically those who tortured animals and the like as children. They do not become nonviolent when they get past young adulthood. They're basically naturally violent psychopaths.
To me, this is overall a great sign. It means if we worked on the root of violence in Black and Latino communities (which comes down to distrust of the American system of law and order in general, and the police and courts in specific - not that there aren't some valid reasons), we could eliminate gang violence. We'd still have sick predatory f*cks to deal with, but there's a lot less of them, and they're just as likely to show up anywhere.
Gangs in Pittsburgh typically don't have single leaders & a following chain of hierarchy. Currently most of the original founders/member(s) aka OG's of most gangs are dead. However they do have some sense of structure: the members with most power are in their mid 20's-30's, and amongst their age pool the big shots are the most feared/respected individuals. While fear/respect is gained through having a reputation for acquiring large sums of fast money or by committing many notable acts of violence. Many leading members get indicted or arrested on multiple lengthy charges, or get get in their 20's-30's... Some high ranking gang members wise up as I Like Spam stated. Then ironically they often become anti-violence activist as more often than not, that's the only job that they can get due to their criminal record's.
-Rarely do active members reach 40, because they are out of style and younger members believe they can't relate to them, as most are from the ages of 15-25. As a result a 40yr old gang member doesn't receive true loyalty from his younger affiliated peers and is likely to be ratted out or turned on (killed) by his own "homies"...
-However former gang members don't always clean up their acts (especially the ones on drugs)... They often still support gang activity in their hood by: influcencing/coaxing younger gang members to commit retaliation shootings and flying the bandanas, or slow down to just selling weed. These people are called old heads, but not all "old heads", are former gang members (an old head can be a middle age white man for the matter)
-Also gang members locked up in the Fort/Greensburg/Hunington/etc have little to no control over what happens in the streets. Yet when individuals come out they leave prison with a mentality of a phyisopathic, and as individuals or prevoke gang wars.
This is the first time in a very long time that I have heard about violent neighborhoods and the Hill was not mentioned. I wonder if it has anything to do with the closing of the projects throughout the city and the young thugs are trying to stake their claims in new neighborhoods.
This is the first time in a very long time that I have heard about violent neighborhoods and the Hill was not mentioned. I wonder if it has anything to do with the closing of the projects throughout the city and the young thugs are trying to stake their claims in new neighborhoods.
Actually the Hill leads all neighborhoods in recent homicides as it has well over 31 which Homewood's number. I'm guessing 35, but I'll have to count. It's not in the body bag because its not adjacent to those neighborhoods.
Unlike Garfield, Larimer/bordering East Liberty, Lincoln, Homewood, Centeal Wilkinsburg, in the Hill you can be a drug dealer and not be a gang member. In fact for years the heirarcy of the drug trade in the Hill was:
1) non-affiliated mini-kingpins & their crews
2) lossely organized gangs/sets of the Hill Districk Bloods: Bedford Avenue Bloods, Bentley Drive Gang, Chauncey Drive Bloods, Down Low Blood Gang, Flackside Blood Gang (500 Burrows Street Bloods, 2400 Mad Circle Gang, 300 Rob'it'son Court Gang originally, but then mixed with other groups like Weedside Blood Gang, Whylie Avenue Bloods & 135 Bloods in Middle Hill), Gute Block Gang, Reed Rude Boyz, Webster Avenue Bloods
3) non-affiliated low level drug dealers, who more often than often are not from the Hill
And all coexisted in the Hill excluding groups in the housing projects as they claimed turf. Problems only came up when people found out that they were: shorted in a drug deal, robbed or snitched on. And that's how it pretty much is today, but its more off an "anything goes" environment. Probably due to the long time, the top level, mini-kingpins got indicted in 2012 and because as you stated most of the original projects (where most of the Hill's gangs formed in) are now dust.
The Body Bagg is a totally different dynamic in exclusion of Northern East Liberty/SW Penn Hills (but even hybrid gangs have their boundaries/designated corners).
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. I wonder if it has anything to do with the closing of the projects throughout the city and the young thugs are trying to stake their claims in new neighborhoods.
