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Disclaimer: Please stay on topic as much as you can. I don't want this to be yet another gay marriage thread or an abortion thread. Oh for the record, I consider myself to Libertarian and this is no way an insult to either Dems or Repubs :P
Republicans tend to believe we should be in control of own life. We need to take as much responsibility in our own lives and the government should have very little to do with our own lives.
Democrats tend to side with the idea of a more larger government run society. No I don't mean communism or socialism, please don't head that way either :P..
With that said, I find it weird that Republicans are so against gay marriage and abortion? We can all agree that both debates we can all have our own personal opinion on the matters. That's fine. But why would Republicans want to deny abortions and gays a privilege to marry? It seems as if with these two situations, they are ok with the government controlling people's lives?
Republicans (for the most part) believe in a free market, believe in less government for less taxes so we can keep most of our money, they believe in the absolute freedom of speech, they believe people should be allowed to bare arms. They would never want these rights (or many other things) to be taken away so "the government doesn't control it", yet.. these 2 issues are something republicans are totally ok with the government being in control of.
Why is that?
you cant use republican and democrat because the reality is both are political parties and are subject to change.... that is a fact unfortunately.
I think your confusing with left and right ideals.
there are charts and quizes out there that can help you decide where you fit in on all of this..
And I am not going to articulate it the way it should be but..
think of it this way... right leaning conservatives want government involvement in moral and social issues like abortion and what can be said on the radio, laws against drugs, ect.
Left side liberals want goverment involvement in social economic issues like welfare, public health care, government education ect. ect..
think Communism, is the combination of both values and government controls everything
and liberatarian as being less government all around and of course anarchists want no government..
most people consider themselves somwhere in the the center.. a little bit of both..
I have taking many quizes and lean in the liberatarian close to center spectrum..
I am sick of government controlling things where individuals should have the choice.. but..
for me.... Abortion.. is not one of them.. to truly understand what it is your doing its just wrong! whether or not you want laws... its just wrong!! And I think people abuse it and it's kind of sick that people WANT the right to do it under any circumstances..
And there is a lot of confusion and ignorance surrounding all of this... we have devided ourselves on what we WANT from government where we should be coming together or on what we DONT WANT from goverment... Just because I am a liberatarian and dont want public health care people assume I am a conservative... but I am not... I also dont want laws against drugs and the trillions of dollars wasted fighting something so stupid.
Last edited by flycessna; 01-14-2011 at 07:18 AM..
Disclaimer: Please stay on topic as much as you can. I don't want this to be yet another gay marriage thread or an abortion thread. Oh for the record, I consider myself to Libertarian and this is no way an insult to either Dems or Repubs :P
Republicans tend to believe we should be in control of own life. We need to take as much responsibility in our own lives and the government should have very little to do with our own lives.
Democrats tend to side with the idea of a more larger government run society. No I don't mean communism or socialism, please don't head that way either :P
..With that said, I find it weird that Republicans are so against gay marriage and abortion? We can all agree that both debates we can all have our own personal opinion on the matters. That's fine. But why would Republicans want to deny abortions and gays a privilege to marry? It seems as if with these two situations, they are ok with the government controlling people's lives?
Republicans (for the most part) believe in a free market, believe in less government for less taxes so we can keep most of our money, they believe in the absolute freedom of speech, they believe people should be allowed to bare arms. They would never want these rights (or many other things) to be taken away so "the government doesn't control it", yet.. these 2 issues are something republicans are totally ok with the government being in control of.
Why is that?
It is fairly simple, Repubs do want less government control on THEIR lives but want to control YOUR life as thye see fit. They are against gay marriage because of their religious beliefs or because they are homophobic or both, they do not want to grant the same rights to gays that hetros enjoy and in fact they wanted to pass an ammendment to the Constitution to ensure they could never get that right, how nuts is that. Being anti-abortion is also driven by religious beliefs and in some cases just a belief that life begins at inception. Not all Repubs are anti-abortion just as not all Dems favor the right to chose. The reality is when the right says they want less government they mean no Liberals and only one Party, theirs. A classic example was Bush saying he was a strong supporter of states rights but when CA legalized pot for medical use the stated he would have the Feds arrest people for what the state said was legal. He also was the leader of the movement to ban gay marriage through ammending the Constitution in attempt to override and state actions. I will add that the Dems can also be overbearing with using the government to force their ideals but when it comes to comparing the two I trust the Dems a bit more with my individual rights.
Casper
Disclaimer: Please stay on topic as much as you can. I don't want this to be yet another gay marriage thread or an abortion thread. Oh for the record, I consider myself to Libertarian and this is no way an insult to either Dems or Repubs :P
Republicans tend to believe we should be in control of own life. We need to take as much responsibility in our own lives and the government should have very little to do with our own lives.
Democrats tend to side with the idea of a more larger government run society. No I don't mean communism or socialism, please don't head that way either :P
..With that said, I find it weird that Republicans are so against gay marriage and abortion? We can all agree that both debates we can all have our own personal opinion on the matters. That's fine. But why would Republicans want to deny abortions and gays a privilege to marry? It seems as if with these two situations, they are ok with the government controlling people's lives?
Republicans (for the most part) believe in a free market, believe in less government for less taxes so we can keep most of our money, they believe in the absolute freedom of speech, they believe people should be allowed to bare arms. They would never want these rights (or many other things) to be taken away so "the government doesn't control it", yet.. these 2 issues are something republicans are totally ok with the government being in control of.
Why is that?
First of all, we are NOT against "gay" marriages, per se, but, rather, same-sex marriages. If two homosexuals want to get married, it is fine with us, as long as they abid by the same rules as hetrosexuals, one of wich is "man and woman".
Now, the reason.
The family unit is the basic building block of society. It is basically, parents and children - not always "and children", but usually.
The cement that binds that group, i.e. the family, is marriage - an institution that exists for the beneift of society, not for the indiividuals per se. Two people of the same sex cannot produce, on their own, children, nor can they provide both the male and female perspectives and impressionings that make fully-rounded children growing into adulthood.
Accordingly, society does not get strengthened by binding under the law two people of the same sex, and many thousands of years of society experience indicates that same-sex unions are not to be encouraged, much less sanctified by legal endorsement called marriage..
In other, much shorter, words, it is NOT in societies best interest to do so.
Abortion is opposed simply because it amounts to in-uterine infanticide, or MURDER. It isn't any more complicated than that, nor does it have anything whatsoever to do with bedrooms or any other room in a house, apartment, mansion, motel, hotel or pup tent.
To be factually accurate, it was a Republican (Bob Barr) who introduced the Defense Of Marriage Act. The Republican-led Congress passed it in 1996. And Bill Clinton signed it into law.
To be even more accurate, yes it was introduced by Bob Barr, but it was passed overwhelmingly in both houses of Congress (85–14: Senate / 342–67 House) which means (since the Republicans only held a small margin of seats) that a majority of Democrats also voted in favour of it.
It was then ruled unconstitutional by a Federal District Court Judge in July of 2010.
Guess who's Attorney General appealed that ruling in October 2010???
It is fairly simple, Repubs do want less government control on THEIR lives but want to control YOUR life as thye see fit. They are against gay marriage because of their religious beliefs or because they are homophobic or both, they do not want to grant the same rights to gays that hetros enjoy and in fact they wanted to pass an ammendment to the Constitution to ensure they could never get that right, how nuts is that. Being anti-abortion is also driven by religious beliefs and in some cases just a belief that life begins at inception. Not all Repubs are anti-abortion just as not all Dems favor the right to chose. The reality is when the right says they want less government they mean no Liberals and only one Party, theirs. A classic example was Bush saying he was a strong supporter of states rights but when CA legalized pot for medical use the stated he would have the Feds arrest people for what the state said was legal. He also was the leader of the movement to ban gay marriage through ammending the Constitution in attempt to override and state actions. I will add that the Dems can also be overbearing with using the government to force their ideals but when it comes to comparing the two I trust the Dems a bit more with my individual rights.
Casper
That's a nonsensical argument because it assumes that only Democrats vote in elections. Obviously, every state has a mix of voters. Democrats aren't even a majority in any state, as far as I know.
Conservatives want less government regulation of BUSSINSS and more government regulation of individuals.
Liberals want more government regulation of business and less government regulation of individuals.
Conservatives like cops, the FBI, drug laws, laws against abortion, laws against gays getting married, etc. It's liberals who don't.
Conservatives don't like welfare programs, LINK cards, anti-trust laws, laws about where a business can dump toxic waste, etc. It's liberals who want more of these kinds of laws.
As regards marriage, you're right. Republicans adhere to the Judaeo-Christian ideal that marriage is between a man and a woman. Now there are other societies where marriage is defined differently and all kinds of arrangements are called marriages, including polygamy, child brides, even marriage between people and animals. When you untether marriage from its foundation in the Judaeo-Christian ethic you invite that kind of chaos that, inevitably, harms the weakest in society, namely women and children.
The bolded assumes there never were marriages before there were Jews and/or Christians and that other cultures around the world never had marriage. This Christian finds that assumption to be not only ridiculous, but demeaning to others, thus distinctly unChristian.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimMe
As regards abortion, it's a simple matter of the Constitution. The 14th Amendment guarantees each person equal protection of the laws. The first duty of government is to protect life. We don't allow a spouse to off his or her spouse that has for some reason become inconvenient. Neither should a woman be allowed to kill her child because carrying it for nine months is inconvenient.
NO, the first duty of government in this country is to protect the rights of the living, in this case, the rights of the woman. As for that last remark, you really don't know any woman's reasoning behind her decision to abort, as that is no one's business but hers. For those I've known who have had an abortion (including myself) "convenience" had nothing whatsoever to do with it.
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