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Whether the students that were arrested were specifically protesting Wall Street, I don't know and I don't care. They were on the same site as OWS encampments that had been there for weeks, and in light of some of the recent events in nearby Oakland, it was one of the top UC officials herself who summoned the police to take down the camp. That was what they were called in there to do, and that's what they set out to do.
I repeat, the students in this case could have avoided this. They were within their constitutional liberties to protest peacefully, and lawfully, and in a way that would be without disruption to the public, but the UC executives felt that this situation was increasingly unstable, so they called in police to ask students to comply with requests to leave. At that point, the students deliberately refused to comply with a reasonable request. They chose to confront police and experience the consequences. Pepper spray was used not on one protester but to disperse and subdue a crowd of protesters who were already openly defiant of police power.
I'm sorry, but the fact is, the students asked for it. They got what they wanted. I think it's pathetic that you're outraged by this.
Once again proving you have no idea what you're talking about.
The students were nowhere near, let alone on the same site as OWS encampments that had been there for weeks. They were on the UC Davis CAMPUS in the QUAD.
Nor did the UC "Executives" think the situation was unstable, "increasingly" or not. The Chancellor felt that overnight camping on campus was a safety concern for the students because all the buildings were locked at night and there was no access to water or facilities.
They weren't in the streets blocking traffic. They weren't preventing access to businesses. They weren't disturbing the peace in people's neighborhoods.
By the time the police arrived most of the tents had already been dismantled as per the chancellor's instructions.
Your contradiction that the students were both within their rights to protest but that they could have avoided this by not protesting is absurd on its face.
The kids who ended up sitting on the ground with their backs to police and their heads bowed down were not in need of being "subdued". And the police are prohibited from using pepper spray under such circumstances, whether you think these students deserved it or not.
I think it's not only pathetic, but frightening that you aren't outraged by this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkatt
It appears the students were in fact given a lawful order to disperse, and they were warned several time of the impending pepper spray. So you are in fact in the right on this issue and the other person inaccurate. A lawful order was provided, along with adequate warning of the use of force, and pepper spray, use of minimal force is in fact called for.
As has been pointed out repeatedly in this thread, pepper spray is not "minimal" force. It is legally defined as "intermediate" force and is prohibited from being used under the circumstances it was, even with advanced warning.
um...how about arrest them. Pepper spray to me is the same as if they took out a baton and smashed their faces in. What did cops do before there was pepper spray? The people were peacefully sitting there so throw the plastic handcuffs on and carry them away. That's what they did anyway after they were pepper sprayed. Why is that so hard for cops to do nowadays?
and to clarify my position, I am all for cops using Pepper spray if they are in immediate danger or to control an escalating event such as a riot. If you watched the daily show yesterday, Jon Stewart said it best in that pepper spray is now the default action for nothing more than a nuisance event. Unfortunately these events will keep happening until a cop is convicted of assault and fired.
The kids on the sidewalk were trying to encircle the tent camp To block the police from gaining access to the camp
strike 1. This is not passive or peaceful.
They were inciting the crowed.
Strike 2
They were illegally blocking the sidewalk and refusing a lawful order to disperse.
strike 3.
They resisted police, actively or passively they still resisted.
Your out of the game.
Taken into custody. 99'9 of all people who are arrested are FIRST taken into custody.
It is up to the cop to and when he reads the Miranda rights.
It could be right there and then or it could be just before booking.
They inter locked arms and a police officer attempted to take them into "CUSTODY" they resisted the officers attempt to do so..
They the protesters incited the crowed.
Game over.
CA penal code.
408. Every person who participates in any riot or unlawful assembly is guilty of a misdemeanor.
409. Every person remaining present at the place of any riot, rout, or unlawful assembly, after the same has been lawfully warned to disperse, except public officers and persons assisting them in attempting to disperse the same, is guilty of a misdemeanor.
416. (a) If two or more persons assemble for the purpose of disturbing the public peace, or committing any unlawful act, and do not disperse on being desired or commanded so to do by a public officer, the persons so offending are severally guilty of a misdemeanor.
420. Every person who unlawfully prevents, hinders, or obstructs any person from peaceably entering upon or establishing a settlement or residence on any tract of public land of the United States within the State of California, subject to settlement or entry under any of the public land laws of the United States; or who unlawfully hinders, prevents, or obstructs free passage over or through the public lands of the United States within the State of California, for the purpose of entry, settlement, or residence, as aforesaid, is guilty of a misdemeanor.
420.1. Anyone who willfully and knowingly prevents, hinders, or obstructs any person from entering, passing over, or leaving land in which that person enjoys, either personally or as an agent, guest, licensee, successor-in-interest, or contractor, a right to enter, use, cross, or inspect the property pursuant to an easement, covenant, license, profit, or other interest in the land, is guilty of an infraction punishable by a fine not to exceed five hundred dollars ($500),
In addition, the California Penal Code § 835 (a) provides that: “Any peace officer who has reasonable cause to believe that the person to be arrestedhas committed a public offense may use reasonable force to (1) effect the arrest, (2)prevent escape or (3) overcome resistance. A peace officer, who makes or attempts tomake an arrest, need not retreat or desist from his efforts by reason of resistance orthreatened resistance of the person being arrested; nor shall such officer be deemed anaggressor or lose his right to self-defense by the use of reasonable force to effect thearrest or to prevent escape or toovercome resistance.”
Passive Resistance – Physical actions that do not prevent the officer’s attempt to control, for example, an individual subject who remains in a sitting, standing, limp or prone position with no physical contact (e.g. locked arms) with other individuals. An individual in handcuffs meets the definition of passive resistance if: (a) the individual is in a sitting, standing or prone position and is not engaged in any motion intended to injure, resist, or remove the handcuffs; or (b) the individual is walking (but not running) with the accompaniment of an officer. An individual who, while sitting or standing, has locked arms with another individualis not engaged in passive resistance but is engaged in proactive action to obstruct. An individual subject who has previously engaged in passive resistance or other passive behavior such as walking, as an individual, but who subsequently engages in behavior such as flailing, kicking, elbowing, head-butting, biting, shoving, jerking, or other action that an officer interprets as a threat or actual act of active resistance is no longer considered to be engaging in passive resistance.
Spray'em.
Were done here book the whole bunch.
Take them in to custody, then arrest them.
Handcuffing and placing someone in a squad car is not an arrest but it could be. It's at the officers discretion.
Last edited by snofarmer; 11-29-2011 at 09:11 AM..
"I expected to be arrested and not assaulted," freshman student Ian Lee said. Lee said he would have preferred to be physically removed from the quad.
Genetics Professor Ken Burtis said the officers should have kept requesting the students leave but not use force."I think if there is truly a safety issue something should be done," Burtis said. He added that he didn't believe that was the case during Friday's protest.
While the occupation of the quad grew Monday night, members of the UC student government held an emergency meeting to vote on several resolutions. Those resolutions call on changes in policies, additional training of officers, and the resignation of the chancellor if she does not comply with their demands.
Protesters Put Up More Than 60 Tents On UC Davis Quad - Sacramento News Story - KCRA Sacramento (http://www.kcra.com/r/29829305/detail.html - broken link)
Now we can see some of the lunacy, at least, and where (who) they get it from.
Quote:
To the UC Davis Campus Community:
I am writing to tell you about events that occurred Friday afternoon at UC Davis relating to a group of protestors who chose to set up an encampment on the quad Thursday as part of a week of peaceful demonstrations on our campus that coincided with many other occupy movements at universities throughout the country.
The group did not respond to requests from administration and campus police to comply with campus rules that exist to protect the health and safety of our campus community. The group was informed in writing this morning that the encampment violated regulations designed to protect the health and safety of students, staff and faculty. The group was further informed that if they did not dismantle the encampment, it would have to be removed.
Following our requests, several of the group chose to dismantle their tents this afternoon and we are grateful for their actions. However a number of protestors refused our warning, offering us no option but to ask the police to assist in their removal. We are saddened to report that during this activity, 10 protestors were arrested and pepper spray was used. We will be reviewing the details of the incident.
We appreciate and strongly defend the rights of all our students, faculty and staff to robust and respectful dialogue as a fundamental tenet of our great academic institution. At the same time, we have a responsibility to our entire campus community, including the parents who have entrusted their students to us, to ensure that all can live, learn and work in a safe and secure environment. We were aware that some of those involved in the recent demonstrations on campus were not members of the UC Davis community and this required us to be even more vigilant about the safety of our students, faculty and staff. We take this responsibility very seriously.
While we have appreciated the peaceful and respectful tone of the demonstrations during the week, the encampment raised serious health and safety concerns, and the resources required to supervise this encampment could not be sustained, especially in these very tight economic times when our resources must support our core academic mission.
We deeply regret that many of the protestors today chose not to work with our campus staff and police to remove the encampment as requested. We are even more saddened by the events that subsequently transpired to facilitate their removal.
We appreciate the substantive dialogue the students have begun here on campus as part of this week.s activities, and we want to offer appropriate opportunities to express opinions, advance the discussion and suggest solutions as part of the time-honored university tradition. We invite our entire campus community to consider the topics related to the occupy movement you would like to discuss and we pledge to work with you to develop a series of discussion forums throughout our campus.
I ask all members of the campus community for their support in ensuring a safe environment for all members of our campus community. We hope you will actively support us in accomplishing this objective.
I am writing to you today as one who deeply appreciates and defends robust and respectful dialogue as a fundamental tenet of our great academic institution and our Principles of Community.
I sympathize with the profound frustrations so many of you have expressed during the past few days. These are truly difficult times. The current economic conditions, state budget cuts and the financial burden of rising tuition present tremendous challenges for all of us. We join you in your desire to advocate for increased state support for our university so that we can continue to provide access to the excellent education that distinguishes us as one of our nation’s leading public universities.
However, we also have a responsibility to our entire campus community, including the parents who have entrusted their students to us, to ensure that all can live, learn and work in a safe, secure environment without disruption. We take this responsibility seriously. We are accountable for what occurs on our campus. Campus policies generously support free speech, but do include limited time, place and manner regulations to protect health, safety and the ability of students, staff, and faculty to accomplish the University mission. If an unfortunate incident occurs as a result of violations of these limited regulations, we are all responsible.
We are aware that many of those involved in the recent demonstrations on campus are not members of the UC Davis community. This requires us to be even more vigilant about the safety of our students, faculty and staff. While we have appreciated the peaceful and respectful tone of the demonstrations to date, the current encampment raises serious health, safety and legal concerns, and the resources we require to supervise this encampment cannot be sustained, especially in these very tight economic times. Our resources must support our core mission to educate all of our students.
We appreciate the substantive dialogue you have begun here, and we want to offer you appropriate opportunities to express opinions, advance the discussion and offer solutions as part of the time-honored university tradition. We invite you to consider the topics you would like to present and we will work with you to sponsor a series of forums throughout our campus.
I must now ask that all tents be peacefully removed by 3:00 p.m. today in the interest of safety, respect for our campus environment and in accordance with our Principles of Community.
We look forward to a positive outcome today and to continued productive and peaceful discourse moving forward.
and to clarify my position, I am all for cops using Pepper spray if they are in immediate danger or to control an escalating event such as a riot. If you watched the daily show yesterday, Jon Stewart said it best in that pepper spray is now the default action for nothing more than a nuisance event. Unfortunately these events will keep happening until a cop is convicted of assault and fired.
Agreed. Don't you think the people would have moved out of the area if, instead of being blinded by OC spray, they'd been confronted with a stink bomb? After all, people who are blinded, in pain, vomiting, etc. generally have a hard time getting around.
The people who are in favor of using weaponry against peaceful protest are ... you know, I have no words. It's reprehensible, hurting people for passive action.
And if the police warned you repeatedly on video that if the posters in this thread didn't refrain from posting they'd shoot all of you, this justifies them?
This thread is an excellent object lesson. Grand plans of schooling whom overseas over a 'democracy' they won't defend, or lead by example, at home. Too bad Monty Python isn't around anymore.
Typical of a Lefty here. Go right to the extreme with shooting everyone. You guys are getting more pathetic by the day as your agenda and propaganda gets more and more exposed. I bet YOU guys, the Lefties, will be the ones to shoot people, not the police.
um...how about arrest them. Pepper spray to me is the same as if they took out a baton and smashed their faces in. What did cops do before there was pepper spray? The people were peacefully sitting there so throw the plastic handcuffs on and carry them away. That's what they did anyway after they were pepper sprayed. Why is that so hard for cops to do nowadays?
Holy mackerel people. See this? Pepper spray is equal to smashing their faces in?????? I've heard it all now. What a whiny bunch of children there are that support this movement. Did anyone here that guy cry when his "people's Library" was being dismantled? What sissies these people are.
In Toronto we cleared out the protestors by patiently waiting them out and being reasonable..with out incident and with out any damned pepper spray...Why is it that Americans are so impatient with their young and those they consider odd or a threat? What's the hurry to show the lower ones who is boss? These agressive and impatient actions demonstrate a very fearful and mindless leadership. These are your kids for God's sake - thank God that some of the youth are thinking for themselves - Instead of utlitizing the energy of youth - you spray it in the face like young people who are the future are dogs....Someone has to state that corruption - greed..corporate and banking disloyality are not to be tolerated...Better to have a kid with spirit - than some weasil that goes with the flow ...in a river of crap.
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