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At least if the US is not good at producing Einsteins, we have done and should continue doing a great job of attracting other peoples' Einsteins.
H-1B visas, baby!!!
It's not that the US isn't good at producing them; it's that the US doesn't want to (at least NOT in the public education system). Why not? Because it's not f-a-i-r that some excel and others don't.
If you send your child to 1st grade without basic reading skills, you've failed your child.
Saw a fascinating documentary on one school who found that they actually were failing their students when they discovered that they had the very tools to predict student failure right in front of their eyes.
According to studies the the principle had read they found that by combing attendance records are several other parameters they could target potential failing students. They found that once they identified those students they could develop strategies to keep these kids in the classroom and moving forward. What made this relevant to the ops latest rant is that they found that many of the at risk children were ether homeless or didn't have any parents at all. I suppose that could be chalked up as parental failure but the fact remains that schools have operated under the idea of loco parentis for years. Schools can and do fail children.
Saw a fascinating documentary on one school who found that they actually were failing their students when they discovered that they had the very tools to predict student failure right in front of their eyes.
According to studies the the principle had read they found that by combing attendance records are several other parameters they could target potential failing students. They found that once they identified those students they could develop strategies to keep these kids in the classroom and moving forward. What made this relevant to the ops latest rant is that they found that many of the at risk children were ether homeless or didn't have any parents at all. I suppose that could be chalked up as parental failure but the fact remains that schools have operated under the idea of loco parentis for years. Schools can and do fail children.
Funny ya mention that. Growing up I had a bud who,s mom was a drinker. She worked 3-4 days a week. Basicly when she felt like going in.
He went to school 4 sometimes 5 days a week, basicly when he felt like going in.
As an adult he never worked a 40 hr week untill after his 35th birthday.
If you send your child to 1st grade without basic reading skills, you've failed your child.
Nonsense. Prior to first grade (Kindergarten) kids are learning their ABC's, vowels and consonants and how to develop the skills necessary to begin the process of learning and understanding how to read and write.
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphamale
If you send your child to school hungry, you've failed your child.
If you send your child to school without the basic tools, (pencils, copy book, erasers, etc.), you've failed your child.
If you send your child to school without having checked their homework, you've failed your child.
If you send your child to school dirty, you've failed your child.
If you send your child to school without a proper nights sleep, you've failed your child.
NO child should ever receive a report card until the 6th grade.....up to that point, the report card should be on the parents. And not based on test grades....it should be based on the things which I mentioned above.
Teachers are under extreme pressure and when they have to take time from other students in order to take care of your irresponsibility, they become less effective.
It could be said that a parent that sends their child to a public school has failed them right from the start, but finances tend to make that choice for them, due to the high costs of private schools.
But the entire structure of education is a total failure, and guarantees that those "responsibilities" you assigned to parents are difficult to impossible to achieve. One of the most glaring is fatigue and lack of sleep. All across this nation during the school year, children are rousted out of bed in the dark hours of early morning, and it matters not when that child goes to bed ... their bodies and minds still want to continue sleeping, because children need way more sleep than adults. Few can say they don't remember the struggle of being harassed out of bed in the early morning hours to hurriedly get "ready" for school ... stuff down some food before their eyes or minds are even awake, and hustled off to the school bus, arriving at school still wanting to be in bed sleeping. That is not an ideal starting point for learning.
Then we want to make them endure an adult level schedule of a full day of learning. Most in the education industry have lost sight of the fact that there is a point of diminishing returns in how much a young child can absorb in any given period ... and right now, the burden is too much for the sleep deprived little ankle biters, bless their little hearts .. they must strive to endure the ignorance of adult professional educators and bureaucrats who's "no child left behind" won't leave their tired little behinds alone, beginning at age 6 until they are 17. During this lengthy period of their early development, they have become the property of the State, and it's poorly conceived education delivery and it's boot-camp mentality, such as the mindset that you have clearly demonstrated. In all of that, the second point is not lost, but ignored ... that is the differences between various children of the same age. This cookie cutter philosophy that treats all children as the same, based on age alone, is an idiotic approach by any reasonable account. Children develop both physically and mentally at differing rates .... one size does not fit all. Everyone should know that, but apparently this is just something that must be ignored ... as there are schedules to maintain.
This is why the old structure of the small school house worked much better than the cattle processing approach that currently defines the public school system today. Young children need a lot of individual attention at those early stages of learning, which is not conducive to the large class concept, and they are not getting it. This individual attention is not just a one way street either ... the teachers need that level of interaction with the individual students to assess their abilities and their grasp of concepts being taught and those individual learning rates that vary widely. Just like adults, children are different in their style of learning too ... some are more visual, while others more auditory ... some more independent, and others more in need of extra one on one interaction. Teachers cannot possibly attain that knowledge of each student among the growing sizes of student classes these days, which more resembles a university lecture setting.
And this is just the tip of the iceberg, but with these issues taken into account ... "home work" ought to be recognized for what it is ... the effort to stuff even more into an already over stuffed, tired little person. It's really a disgrace, and a demonstration of how crazy our system has become, and why the system is failing.
No point in sending my child to school then. I thought schools were supposed to teach reading.
No kidding especially when a lot of us learn phonetics and your child's school might not teach it at all, so your kid will actually be spending first grade being corrected by their teacher for doing it wrong.
Eh, don't really agree with the whole list and really I think parents don't teach their kids to be responsible at a younger age now-a-days.
Firs off wanted to agree about the charter school/school choice post in regards to black children especially. My kid goes to a Charter school, they have VERY low class sizes (less than 10) and they have VERY dedicated, involved teachers and even the kids who come in behind improve at elast one grade level every year since inception in reading, we had a kid in my son's 3rd grade class who couldn't read at all and by the end of the year, he read on a 2nd grade level, still below average but considering he was illiterate and had already been held back, that was phenomenal progress for him and he is at level now in 5th grade.
I think everyone makes too many excuses when it comes to education.
And I will comment specifically on the OP:
If you send your child to 1st grade without basic reading skills, you've failed your child. I don't agree here. Studies have shown that once children reach 3rd-4th grade even if they come to school without much prep work at home that they will catch up in that timeframe. Also do want to agree with other posters since I have young children, that kindergarten is the "new first grade" and in kindergarten they do teach children to read, so you should probably change the first grade portion to kindergarten.
If you send your child to school hungry, you've failed your child. Disagree here as well. I have a kid who is 10. We have food and he has a morning routine but if he doesn't get his butt downstairs on time to eat, he will go to school hungry and he has. I did not fail him, he failed himself by taking over an hour to get dressed. I also have to get dressed and get his 3 year old sister dressed and honestly, he is old enough to get himself something to eat. I think this portion, in regards to older kids is an example of how we are not expecting much of our kids in general. My older brother and I got ourselves breakfast and walked to school by ourselves when we were 6(me) and 7(him). We woke ourselves up, washed up, got dressed, ate, and walked to school. Our mom worked and that was what she told us to do, she taught us how to take care of ourselves. If my son wants to be hungry because he wants to take an hour to wash his face, then he deserves to be hungry IMO.
If you send your child to school without the basic tools, (pencils, copy book, erasers, etc.), you've failed your child. Now-a-days, you send a huge trough of stuff to school because it is expected not everyone will have these things. That is why "school supply" list are hundreds of dollars. Teachers hoarde this stuff, even at my son's school, they always have them so really there is not need to make sure they always have them, also it is up to the child to keep up with his/her things. I expected my son in kindergarten to get his stuff together and make sure he had his stuff. More often than not he did. Of whom much is expected, much is achieved IMO.
If you send your child to school without having checked their homework, you've failed your child. My son is in 5th grade. I no longer check his homework. Studies have shown that for children who are not behind academically, that homework is not beneficial for them. My son is above average in every subject. I also expect him to do his own homework and check his own work. My mom never checked my homework - I didn't have as much of course because back then schools didn't try to prove how "good" they were by giving 9 year olds 2 hours worth of homework everyday - they taught during the school day instead of giving me useless busy work for home. I was in the TAG (talented and gifted) program throughout elementary/jr. high and an Honors/AP path in high school and very rarely had homework, nothing compared to what my son has had to deal with since first grade. And it is not necessary for me to check his homework as a 5th grader. I expect him to take responsibility for his school work and academics and so far he has responded to this expectation as well.
If you send your child to school dirty, you've failed your child. My son is responsible for his own cleanliness as well. He washes his own clothes, irons them too. He also showers himself regularly and brushes his teeth and combs his own hair. His cleanliness is up to him. At his age, if he is stinky, the other kids will tease him so I don't really pay attention to him in that respect. I do make sure he washes his clothes every Saturday morning, but that is a part of his regular chores and I make sure he does all his chores, so I know his clothes are clean. I also know his teeth are clean since I take him to the dentist and he usually doesn't have any issues.
If you send your child to school without a proper nights sleep, you've failed your child. My kids both go to bed at 8:30. Sometimes they want to stay up and play though. My daughter especially likes to "read" (she is 3 so it is cute her reading) to her teddy bears and doll babies after I put her in the bed. My son also likes to read at night. I can't force them to sleep without medicating them. Sometimes, my daughter especially will stay up very late playing in her room and won't have a good day the next day. She is discplined for her misbehavior and reminded that if she goes to sleep she won't have so many problems.
NO child should ever receive a report card until the 6th grade.....up to that point, the report card should be on the parents. And not based on test grades....it should be based on the things which I mentioned above. Funny. But will mention my son doesn't get report cards, he gets "progress reports" and they are detailed reports about what grade level he is on, what skills he has mastered, what he still needs help with, his attitude/behavior in the classroom and at school in general. They also set goals every quarter and give information on the report about whether or not he is reaching his goals. They do get percentage grades on both class work and homework but all the kids have to get 80% or above on everything to ensure they are progressing adequately. I think this method is better than the traditional A-F or GPA grading system since it makes sure that the kids are proficient in everything they need to learn.
Teachers are under extreme pressure and when they have to take time from other students in order to take care of your irresponsibility, they become less effective. Teachers have always been under pressure. They should not have gotten into teaching if they wanted an easy/cush job. I don't think many teachers expect their job to be easy and stress free.
But the entire structure of education is a total failure, and guarantees that those "responsibilities" you assigned to parents are difficult to impossible to achieve. One of the most glaring is fatigue and lack of sleep. All across this nation during the school year, children are rousted out of bed in the dark hours of early morning, and it matters not when that child goes to bed ... their bodies and minds still want to continue sleeping, because children need way more sleep than adults. Few can say they don't remember the struggle of being harassed out of bed in the early morning hours to hurriedly get "ready" for school ... stuff down some food before their eyes or minds are even awake, and hustled off to the school bus, arriving at school still wanting to be in bed sleeping. That is not an ideal starting point for learning.
Then we want to make them endure an adult level schedule of a full day of learning. Most in the education industry have lost sight of the fact that there is a point of diminishing returns in how much a young child can absorb in any given period ... and right now, the burden is too much for the sleep deprived little ankle biters, bless their little hearts .. they must strive to endure the ignorance of adult professional educators and bureaucrats who's "no child left behind" won't leave their tired little behinds alone, beginning at age 6 until they are 17. During this lengthy period of their early development, they have become the property of the State, and it's poorly conceived education delivery and it's boot-camp mentality, such as the mindset that you have clearly demonstrated. In all of that, the second point is not lost, but ignored ... that is the differences between various children of the same age. This cookie cutter philosophy that treats all children as the same, based on age alone, is an idiotic approach by any reasonable account. Children develop both physically and mentally at differing rates .... one size does not fit all. Everyone should know that, but apparently this is just something that must be ignored ... as there are schedules to maintain.
This is why the old structure of the small school house worked much better than the cattle processing approach that currently defines the public school system today. Young children need a lot of individual attention at those early stages of learning, which is not conducive to the large class concept, and they are not getting it. This individual attention is not just a one way street either ... the teachers need that level of interaction with the individual students to assess their abilities and their grasp of concepts being taught and those individual learning rates that vary widely. Just like adults, children are different in their style of learning too ... some are more visual, while others more auditory ... some more independent, and others more in need of extra one on one interaction. Teachers cannot possibly attain that knowledge of each student among the growing sizes of student classes these days, which more resembles a university lecture setting.
And this is just the tip of the iceberg, but with these issues taken into account ... "home work" ought to be recognized for what it is ... the effort to stuff even more into an already over stuffed, tired little person. It's really a disgrace, and a demonstration of how crazy our system has become, and why the system is failing.
And you want to blame the parents?
What an overly dramatized post. You make it seem like it's torture for kids to go to school.
The only time I woke up earlier for public school than I do nowadays (for my professional job) was when I was in IB for high school - only because our buses ran before the normal high school route. My bus stop was at 6:05am. Knowing this, and deciding to stay up until butt'o'clock at night was my own choice. And yeah, I suffered. Wasn't the school's fault. I knew what time I needed to be awake.
Before that? Waking up at 730-8am. That's not ridiculously early. In Japan, most students are already in school by 7am, so that they can clean, study, practice sports, etc. Their kids aren't suffering the kind of atrocious test scores that American kids get.
The difference is the parents. If you have parents who whine, kvetch and moan like a mewling **** about it, the kids pick up on it and will do the same. If you have parents who'll dump frozen marbles in their kid's bed if they're not up and ready to go at a specific time, the kids will start to do it on their own.
Wish they would tell em that in my town . Here they refuse to even consider more then 13 per class. The result, we pay more to teach 3rd graders then a yr at UNH.
There have always been kids in every school or community whose parents were worthless.
It seems to me that the educrats would have devised a method to teach those kids by now.
But, the educrats still blame their failures on parents. Parents blame the schools, and the schools blame the parents. Politicians blame teacher's unions.
When are the people who build their lives around public education going to start doing what they are paid to do?
I'm talking about the people who design curriculum, write textbooks and churn out endless worthless tests that cost a
fortune. Plus the people who run the teaching schools and administrators who run the schools.
Johnny still can't read.
"It seems to me that the educrats would have devised a method to teach those kids by now."
What sickens me is that they get a Master's degree, demand more pay, and get it automatically, and there is no improvement in class grades.
Nonsense. Prior to first grade (Kindergarten) kids are learning their ABC's, vowels and consonants and how to develop the skills necessary to begin the process of learning and understanding how to read and write.
It could be said that a parent that sends their child to a public school has failed them right from the start, but finances tend to make that choice for them, due to the high costs of private schools.
But the entire structure of education is a total failure, and guarantees that those "responsibilities" you assigned to parents are difficult to impossible to achieve. One of the most glaring is fatigue and lack of sleep. All across this nation during the school year, children are rousted out of bed in the dark hours of early morning, and it matters not when that child goes to bed ... their bodies and minds still want to continue sleeping, because children need way more sleep than adults. Few can say they don't remember the struggle of being harassed out of bed in the early morning hours to hurriedly get "ready" for school ... stuff down some food before their eyes or minds are even awake, and hustled off to the school bus, arriving at school still wanting to be in bed sleeping. That is not an ideal starting point for learning.
Then we want to make them endure an adult level schedule of a full day of learning. Most in the education industry have lost sight of the fact that there is a point of diminishing returns in how much a young child can absorb in any given period ... and right now, the burden is too much for the sleep deprived little ankle biters, bless their little hearts .. they must strive to endure the ignorance of adult professional educators and bureaucrats who's "no child left behind" won't leave their tired little behinds alone, beginning at age 6 until they are 17. During this lengthy period of their early development, they have become the property of the State, and it's poorly conceived education delivery and it's boot-camp mentality, such as the mindset that you have clearly demonstrated. In all of that, the second point is not lost, but ignored ... that is the differences between various children of the same age. This cookie cutter philosophy that treats all children as the same, based on age alone, is an idiotic approach by any reasonable account. Children develop both physically and mentally at differing rates .... one size does not fit all. Everyone should know that, but apparently this is just something that must be ignored ... as there are schedules to maintain.
This is why the old structure of the small school house worked much better than the cattle processing approach that currently defines the public school system today. Young children need a lot of individual attention at those early stages of learning, which is not conducive to the large class concept, and they are not getting it. This individual attention is not just a one way street either ... the teachers need that level of interaction with the individual students to assess their abilities and their grasp of concepts being taught and those individual learning rates that vary widely. Just like adults, children are different in their style of learning too ... some are more visual, while others more auditory ... some more independent, and others more in need of extra one on one interaction. Teachers cannot possibly attain that knowledge of each student among the growing sizes of student classes these days, which more resembles a university lecture setting.
And this is just the tip of the iceberg, but with these issues taken into account ... "home work" ought to be recognized for what it is ... the effort to stuff even more into an already over stuffed, tired little person. It's really a disgrace, and a demonstration of how crazy our system has become, and why the system is failing.
And you want to blame the parents?
If parents aren't up to the job of raising children to be productive adults, they should forego the idea of breeding.
Better yet, they should forego the act of breeding.
It's a job, and it's the parent's job - it is their responsibility to raise their child.
Don't want to do the work, don't have the kids.
Why should the rest of society suffer because you don't want to do your job?
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