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Old 10-06-2012, 12:39 PM
 
7,541 posts, read 6,287,390 times
Reputation: 1837

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Quote:
Originally Posted by CheyDee View Post
It's interesting that in your own argument you advocate personal responsibility for the parent(s) and hold them accountable, yet you think it's fine for them to drop the ball when providing for their child. If a parent wants their child to use birth control (or have an abortion), let them pay for it.

In a perfect world. however, we don't live in that fantasy land.

Teens are rarely going to let their parents know that they are actually having sex or if they get pregnant, and usually by the time that the teen tells their parents, its already too late to consider alternatives (the choice of abortion, to carry through for adoption). You'll see that these are the very teens that end up throwing their babies in garbage cans.

Most parents think that their children are just the perfect little angels.
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Old 10-06-2012, 12:42 PM
 
Location: Ohio
15,700 posts, read 17,101,850 times
Reputation: 22092
Quote:
Originally Posted by CheyDee View Post
It's interesting that in your own argument you advocate personal responsibility for the parent(s) and hold them accountable, yet you think it's fine for them to drop the ball when providing for their child. If a parent wants their child to use birth control (or have an abortion), let them pay for it.
Except.....once their child is having sex on their watch, they have already dropped the ball, haven't they?

And.....if a parent does not want their child to use BC {or have an abortion}, let them pay to raise the resulting grandchild to the age of 18......instead of passing THAT responsibilty off onto the taxpayer.
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Old 10-06-2012, 12:57 PM
 
Location: the AZ desert
5,035 posts, read 9,251,056 times
Reputation: 8289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arus View Post
In a perfect world. however, we don't live in that fantasy land.

Teens are rarely going to let their parents know that they are actually having sex or if they get pregnant, and usually by the time that the teen tells their parents, its already too late to consider alternatives (the choice of abortion, to carry through for adoption). You'll see that these are the very teens that end up throwing their babies in garbage cans.

Most parents think that their children are just the perfect little angels.
If the parent(s) didn't establish a good, open communication bond with their child, where the child feels comfortable enough to discuss sex with them, that shouldn't be society's problem. Unfortunately, teaching good parenting skills are not part of the general school curricula. It's also the parent(s) job to pay attention to their child, which includes noticing subtle signs of pregnancy in it's earlier stages. For the latter alternative (adoption), it's never too late.

In fact, many people these days are raising their grandchildren.

Yes, sadly, there are teens who throw their babies into garbage cans. Cold as it may sound, taxpayers shouldn't be on the hook for every pathetic case. We can't prevent a parent from severely beating their child either, although sometimes (not always) we can intervene to prevent repeated incidents. Not everything is perfect.
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Old 10-06-2012, 01:01 PM
 
15,120 posts, read 8,700,613 times
Reputation: 7501
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cinebar View Post
I'm surprised no one has commented on this yet.



Free birth control cuts abortion rate dramatically, study finds - Vitals

I have been a proponent for free birth control for a long time and I'm glad to see that studies are now supporting what I suspected.

For those so vehemently opposed to abortion, this really seems like a win-win solution!

I know the usual suspects will chime in with all the usual "personal responsibility" cries and the "I shouldn't have to pay for it" belly-aching, but one of the facts of life is that this is not a perfect world, and women will find themselves facing unwanted and un-prepared for pregnancies.

It would be nice if those who are opposed to abortions could look at the issue of free birth control as an issue of the lesser of two evils, at least, and see it as a positive thing.

After all, it seems that the cost of making sure women have access to free birth control would be a small price to pay for the number of abortions (to some - "murders") that would not occur.

Like I said - WIN/WIN.

Yes indeedy, population reduction is population reduction ... a big win/win for the eugenists. Abortion, birth control, war, disease, sterilization by vaccine and GMO .... all have a role to play in the success of the program, even if birth control takes a bite out of the revenue generated for abortions .... it's the end goal that counts. Gotta break a few eggs if you want to make an omelette!

Yay for the the death of the human race! Dontcha just love Win-Wins ....
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Old 10-06-2012, 01:03 PM
 
Location: the AZ desert
5,035 posts, read 9,251,056 times
Reputation: 8289
Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie53 View Post
Except.....once their child is having sex on their watch, they have already dropped the ball, haven't they?

And.....if a parent does not want their child to use BC {or have an abortion}, let them pay to raise the resulting grandchild to the age of 18......instead of passing THAT responsibilty off onto the taxpayer.
Not necessarily. Even being strongly involved in a child's life doesn't mean a parent is with them 24/7. One can only hope they've instilled a good value system in their child and keep lines of communication always open, since a parent can only protect a child so much.

If the parent doesn't want their child to use BC and if the parent doesn't want their child to have an abortion, the other options are to give the baby up for adoption or yes, raise their grandchild.
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Old 10-06-2012, 02:25 PM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 19,017,050 times
Reputation: 8912
Quote:
Originally Posted by rikoshaprl View Post
New study: Abstinence cuts abortions dramatically!
Another new study: Child birth cuts abortions dramatically!
As the family of Sarah Palin exemplifies, teaching abstinence just increases the incidence of unwanted children. You think children cannot sense that they are unwanted?

Child birth also increases unwanted children. The biggest predictor of anti social behavior and later, crime, is a male being born to a single parent.

Although you probably mean well, your arguments make no sense.
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Old 10-06-2012, 02:32 PM
 
Location: Earth Wanderer, longing for the stars.
12,406 posts, read 19,017,050 times
Reputation: 8912
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenneth-Kaunda View Post
how much is a packet of condoms these days anyway?

why do they need to be free?
Actually, the IUD is the most effective measure. No need to remember to take a pill at the same time each day, no need to remember the condom in an adolescent heat of passion. It's there for years and is removable.

This is more effective than the pill or condoms, but it is expensive for a young person. Of course, the condom should be used if there is a possibility of std's.
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Old 10-06-2012, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,094 posts, read 26,080,297 times
Reputation: 6128
Abortion stops a beating heart.
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Old 10-06-2012, 02:57 PM
 
Location: The Cascade Foothills
10,942 posts, read 10,283,562 times
Reputation: 6476
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier View Post
Abortion stops a beating heart.
Free birth control prevents that "beating heart" from ever existing, thus never aborted.

Duh.
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Old 10-06-2012, 03:00 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles County, CA
29,094 posts, read 26,080,297 times
Reputation: 6128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cinebar View Post
Free birth control prevents that "beating heart" from ever existing, thus never aborted.

Duh.
So does birth control that the person who uses it has to pay for out of their own pocket.

Nothing is free: what you call "free" is something that I as a taxpayer have to pay for.

Why should I pay for your ability to have sex without worrying about producing a baby?

If you don't want kids - then pay for your own birth control or practice abstinence.
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