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What's ridiculous is people claiming that a fertilized egg is a baby, a child, or a full-blown human being yet having absolutely nothing to support those claims.
This statement makes so little sense that I don't even know how to reply to it.
Humans at different stages of development are now considered human or not human based on convenience?
Quote:
Your statement "Murdering unborn children has nothing to do with chilren" is just plain silly in this context, the truth is the term "children" has nothing to do with abortion.
I'm not sure what scares me most about your holding this view...the amount of cognitive dissonance that I hope you feel, or the possibility that you hold this view without the corresponding cognitive dissonance...
But clearly you don't have a problem with forcing your beliefs on an unborn human being? What about the "best decision" for the baby, clearly dismemberment isn't it?!
By the time a woman has an abortion, her baby is well past the zygote phase and in fact has a heart beat and recognizable human features, as well as brain waves! One can use any terminology they wish, but it will never change the reality that what is being aborted is a member if the human race, as two human beings cannot create something that is not human.
Well.. now here is where my beliefs pick up.
And please, remember these are MY BELIEFS.
We are all souls and when a woman becomes pregnant there is a purpose. A soul has decided to be and two parents souls have decided to become pregnant with that soul. Now.. sometimes a woman has a miscarriage. She may have wanted that child, but that soul hs for one reason or another decided that the time wasn't right. Or perhaps that soul was only meant to be for that brief period of time for whatever reason.
That being said, a woman who becomes pregnant also has a right to decide wether it's the right time or not. Whatever she decides is between her and that soul. If she decides to abort it doesn't mean that that soul will not be born.. but that it just wasn't the right time.
You would agree that parents raise their children to follow the beliefs that they have.. and most do. That being said the unborn child is also subject to the parents belief.. and again.. it is between that woman and that soul. (as a side note, I do believe that a soul does not always occupy the body while in utero and comes in and out of it;s growing shell during the course of the pregnancy)
Now.. that also being said.. again.. what you believe is what you believe.. and YOU believe that a mothers choice is pushing a belief on an unborn child.. I do not believe it is so. Again.. we all have our different beliefs that we have a right to and we have a choice.. sometimes parents make choices for their children.. and this is just one of them, perhaps.
America is built on freedom of choice.. and we all have a right to make our own decisions based on those beliefs.
And please, remember these are MY BELIEFS.
We are all souls and when a woman becomes pregnant there is a purpose. A soul has decided to be and two parents souls have decided to become pregnant with that soul. Now.. sometimes a woman has a miscarriage. She may have wanted that child, but that soul hs for one reason or another decided that the time wasn't right. Or perhaps that soul was only meant to be for that brief period of time for whatever reason.
That being said, a woman who becomes pregnant also has a right to decide wether it's the right time or not. Whatever she decides is between her and that soul. If she decides to abort it doesn't mean that that soul will not be born.. but that it just wasn't the right time.
You would agree that parents raise their children to follow the beliefs that they have.. and most do. That being said the unborn child is also subject to the parents belief.. and again.. it is between that woman and that soul. (as a side note, I do believe that a soul does not always occupy the body while in utero and comes in and out of it;s growing shell during the course of the pregnancy)
Now.. that also being said.. again.. what you believe is what you believe.. and YOU believe that a mothers choice is pushing a belief on an unborn child.. I do not believe it is so. Again.. we all have our different beliefs that we have a right to and we have a choice.. sometimes parents make choices for their children.. and this is just one of them, perhaps.
America is built on freedom of choice.. and we all have a right to make our own decisions based on those beliefs.
Killing someone because you believe them to be less than human is the ultimate act of forcing your beliefs on someone.
What's ridiculous is people claiming that a fertilized egg is a baby, a child, or a full-blown human being yet having absolutely nothing to support those claims.
Your statement "Murdering unborn children has nothing to do with chilren" is just plain silly in this context, the truth is the term "children" has nothing to do with abortion.
Okay, so when does it become a baby then? What milestone must it reach before we can call it a baby? It it once they start to look like baby b/c that would be around 5-6 weeks and most abortions occur when the baby already has baby-like features, never mind the beating heart and brain waves. And when is it safe to call it a human being?
And what do you mean children have nothing to do with abortion- these our are children we are eliminating! We aren't simply terminating pregnancies, we are terminating living human children at the earliest stages of childhood.
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,330 posts, read 54,411,082 times
Reputation: 40736
Quote:
Originally Posted by dunkel25
This statement makes so little sense that I don't even know how to reply to it.
Humans at different stages of development are now considered human or not human based on convenience?
PLEASE! AT LEAST make a small effort to learn the difference between the adjective: human and the noun: human being.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dunkel25
I'm not sure what scares me most about your holding this view...the amount of cognitive dissonance that I hope you feel, or the possibility that you hold this view without the corresponding cognitive dissonance...
What scares me is that people are unable to understand simple facts such as there being distinct differences between children and embryos. You can flail around with your emotional outrage all you like, facts are what's important and you present none.
And please, remember these are MY BELIEFS.
We are all souls and when a woman becomes pregnant there is a purpose. A soul has decided to be and two parents souls have decided to become pregnant with that soul. Now.. sometimes a woman has a miscarriage. She may have wanted that child, but that soul hs for one reason or another decided that the time wasn't right. Or perhaps that soul was only meant to be for that brief period of time for whatever reason.
That being said, a woman who becomes pregnant also has a right to decide wether it's the right time or not. Whatever she decides is between her and that soul. If she decides to abort it doesn't mean that that soul will not be born.. but that it just wasn't the right time.
You would agree that parents raise their children to follow the beliefs that they have.. and most do. That being said the unborn child is also subject to the parents belief.. and again.. it is between that woman and that soul. (as a side note, I do believe that a soul does not always occupy the body while in utero and comes in and out of it;s growing shell during the course of the pregnancy)
Now.. that also being said.. again.. what you believe is what you believe.. and YOU believe that a mothers choice is pushing a belief on an unborn child.. I do not believe it is so. Again.. we all have our different beliefs that we have a right to and we have a choice.. sometimes parents make choices for their children.. and this is just one of them, perhaps.
America is built on freedom of choice.. and we all have a right to make our own decisions based on those beliefs.
Okay, maybe I'm wrong but to use the description "between her and that soul" would entail agreement on behalf of both partners. I hardly think that "that soul" would agree with being eliminated by means of a vacuum. So does the conversation b/t woman and young soul go something like this:
Mom: "I'm sorry soul, but you came at a bad time for daddy and I, so is it okay that we have you dismembered?"
Soul: "Sure mom, I don't mind. A little pain medicine would be nice though, but if you can't afford, I'll just suck it up- oops don't mind the pun."
Mom: "You silly soul, you! Thanks so much for the understanding. We'll catch up with you in the afterlife."
How about writing nitpicky laws to protect innocent children from being gruesomely murdered?
I really don't care what idiots do to their own bodies, whether it's injesting drugs, sticking their body parts in holes not designed to be pentrated, or whatever. But when they start murdering children, yeah, I'm going to sit up and take notice.
Why, exactly? I understand you feel strongly about this, but if destroying one's genetic legacy is, Darwinially speaking, about the stupidest thing a breeding adult can do, then what can the government do to impose external consequences more severe than not passing on your genes?
And why do I want to pay for it via tax dollars?
Pregnant women with partners uninterested in fatherhood (which is mostly the scenario that drives elective abortions) cost the rest of us a lot of money, both upfront and through years of dealing with their equally dysfunctional offspring. Sorry, but a lot of the gals who wind up at abortion clinics are there because they lacked the brains or common sense to use birth control in the first place. And their boyfriends aren't exactly what I'd call reliable future patriarchs.
D'ya really, really want THAT to be the next generation of American motherhood?
I would rather not sacrifice my own children's educations, housing, stability, etc, to fund an ever-expanding underclass of single moms and deadbeat dads created by illegalizing abortion and/or birth control. Margaret Sanger was no fool.
I totally disagree with your statement about the so-called crux of the argument, especially your attempt to insert the word 'baby' when by definition a baby has been through the process of birth. In my eyes the crux of the argument is whether a fertilized egg is a human being, I don't believe it is. When/if I ever do I'll become strongly anti-abortion.
You need to read the previous posts from other posters who have consistently used the "woman's body" argument as their justification for being pro-choice. I use fetus/baby because many pro-choicers consider the "insert noun here -->" ______ a baby once it has exited the womb but before the umbilical cord is cut.
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,330 posts, read 54,411,082 times
Reputation: 40736
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOJOG
And what do you mean children have nothing to do with abortion- these our are children we are eliminating! We aren't simply terminating pregnancies, we are terminating living human children at the earliest stages of childhood.
Since when is an embryo or a fetus a child? It is a potential child, hardly the same thing.
And I've never claimed the qualifications to judge just when it becomes a human being but I am 100% certain that Congress also lacks that qualification. I've never advocated abortion but I'm willing to let it be a decision made by a woman with the advice of her doctor, and whatever other counsel she may wish to employ, NOT by some group of mostly gray haired old men with personal agendas to attend to.
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