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You have no concept of the end game when our gun rights will cease to exist, and all you can do is play word-games with quasi-intellectual language, while all the time, missing everything of import.
As far as the appropriate channels is concerned, that channel is composed of the Constitution, as amended.
We have allowed a monstrosity of court cases (improperly given the force of law), improper rules than require that a person run afoul of a law before they have "standing" to challenge it, all supported by a class of unaccountable super-potentates who have buffaloed us into believing their word is law.
You make a huge mistake when going along with the premise that a court decision creates "case law". It is a decision on a single case, and we, the owners, can no longer allow it to be given the force and effect of law. Making law is the purview of elected Representatives - NOT appointed-for-life potentates.
We are allowing the same sort of thing with bureaucrats who issue Regulations that have force of law, and now a CEO going over the head of the Board of Directors. We must get a grip on this juggernaut or it will be our end.
It seems to me you can't see the forest because your eyes are filled with bark and pine-needles. Back away and get a glimpse of the big picture, for there is a great deal at stake.
As our gun-rights go, so will go all other rights, and then American Freedom will fade. As goes American Freedom, so goes global freedom, and humanity will once again fall back into the morass of Kings and subjects that held the vast majority of all who have lived on earth living as peasants, subjects and slaves.
My point stands, be glad gun owners that the NRA exists, I certainly am. If they didn't we'd have this sort of representation and we'd lose them so quickly you wouldn't know what to do.
A holding is case law that's how common law works I've already explained this to you. The majority of the civilized world uses common law system just like us, the other is Civil Law used by countries like France and its subsidiaries, that seems to be more in line with how you think things work.
Quote to me exactly what language in the Constitution says that. People assume it is true, but it is not. They are there to try cases, not create a whole new body of law that SUPERCEDES Representative Democracy.
Let that sink in. Justices, appointed FOR LIFE, accountable to nobody have taken upon themselves, without Constitutional authorization, the role of final arbiter and a power higher than the people's elected reps. It is INSANE.
Their power extends to all Cases arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made, or which shall be made, under their Authority;
...under the Constitution and the laws of the United States... (no mention of case "law", but direct reference to the Constiution and Laws. Basing a decision on a previous case, (and not the Constiution and Laws) is beyond their power.
Here is the entire power of the Federal Courts as Granted by the Constitution
Article III.
Section. 1.
The judicial Power of the United States, shall be vested in one supreme Court, and in such inferior Courts as the Congress may from time to time ordain and establish. The Judges, both of the supreme and inferior Courts, shall hold their Offices during good Behaviour, and shall, at stated Times, receive for their Services, a Compensation, which shall not be diminished during their Continuance in Office.
Section. 2.
The judicial Power shall extend to all Cases, in Law and Equity, arising under this Constitution, the Laws of the United States, and Treaties made, or which shall be made, under their Authority;—to all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls;—to all Cases of admiralty and maritime Jurisdiction;—to Controversies to which the United States shall be a Party;—to Controversies between two or more States;— between a State and Citizens of another State,—between Citizens of different States,—between Citizens of the same State claiming Lands under Grants of different States, and between a State, or the Citizens thereof, and foreign States, Citizens or Subjects.
In all Cases affecting Ambassadors, other public Ministers and Consuls, and those in which a State shall be Party, the supreme Court shall have original Jurisdiction. In all the other Cases before mentioned, the supreme Court shall have appellate Jurisdiction, both as to Law and Fact, with such Exceptions, and under such Regulations as the Congress shall make.
The Trial of all Crimes, except in Cases of Impeachment, shall be by Jury; and such Trial shall be held in the State where the said Crimes shall have been committed; but when not committed within any State, the Trial shall be at such Place or Places as the Congress may by Law have directed.
The power you say is granted to them by the Constitution isn't there. They carved it out and took it for themselves to further empower the courts beyond that granted by the USC.
Read the words, over and over, if necessary, and see if what you say is there is actually there. It isn't.
They also created the test of "standing" where no law can be challenged in court except by somebody be charged with a crime under that law. They made that up too.
Let's NOT forget the number of times the later courts have OVERTURNED PREVIOUS SC rulings.
But Obama is not imposing an executive order prohibiting 'small arms in the hands of law abiding citizens'. The executive order is a directive to ATF to require people who meet the following criteria and sell guns online or at gun shows to obtain a dealers license and conduct background checks on purchasers, just like every other licensed dealer already does:
"officials from the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives will begin contacting gun sellers to let them know of new standards to “clarify” who would be considered a regulated dealer — taking into account factors such as whether someone has a business card, uses a website or sells guns in their original packaging."
Now, take a deep breath and tell me how that is impinging on your 2A rights...I'll be waiting.
"and sell guns online"
Another lie from O.
On line sales REQUIRE going through a licensed dealer and a background check is required.
On line sales REQUIRE going through a licensed dealer and a background check is required.
On this point you are correct, for the most part. Out of state sales are required to be shipped to a licensed FFL dealer and the buyer must fill out a form 4473 and get a background check. Whether it's a site like Gunbroker or a private gun site like AK-Whatever.com. In fact over the last 3 years, I've noticed that now FFls are requiring the seller to have an FFL dealer ship from his end to the FFl on the buyer's end. Doubling the fees. The sellers FFL gets a fee and the Buyer pays a fee to the Receiving FFL. Used to be I could package the gun up in my home and ship it to the FFL of the buyer for delivery. There was no special law passed requiring the seller to do this but FFLs decided to do this on their own.
Obama's new law will do nothing to halt gun crime and mass shootings. Only mandatory background checks of all gun sales will make a real dent in the rate of gun deaths. That means all private sales must go through an FFL dealer and a form 4473, with all mental health backgrounds being forwarded to the federal NICs system
Of course there are a lot of gun owners who are paranoid individuals to begin with and that paranoia extends to any form of gun control. IE: Background checks lead to national registration. Totally false but believable if you're ruled by paranoia. NRA's foundation is based on Paranoia. Yes I am a member. Yes I carry concealed, every day. A little Ruger with a laser.
Soon there will be a split between the responsible gun owners and the rest of the phony gun packing patriot crowd.
Indeed. We see genocide and tyranny everyday in Japan.
Had you been in Nanking, China, or anywhere else that had been taken under the Japanese umbrella, you would have seen it wholesale. Don't think, that can't, much less, won't happen again. May I remind you that a decade and a half into the last century, a great war was fought in Europe. It was, euphemistically, and incorrectly labeled "The war to end all wars". Did it? (Hint: "NO").
Japan is no longer warring, but in WWII, China was our ally, but it seems now that they are potential aggressors. Ditto N. Korea and ISIS and much of Islam. Putin is stretching his legs, as well.
We have passed no marker, exited no phase, for evil, slavery and subjugation are still our fellow travelers, are still alive and well, as their victims lie dead and dying.
Now the Obama Administration, first in Obama Care, and now with his Executive Orde,r are employing a tactic of the Gestapo of officially-condoned/mandated snitching, where doctors are now to report any patient they feel might have a mental issue. Obama Care required them to find out about guns in the household
The road we are traveling down dead-ends in the graveyard of freedom, the cemetery of patriots.
Last edited by Piccadilly Lily; 01-05-2016 at 01:50 PM..
Words have meaning in laws, or there are no laws.
Shall not be infringed. By even the act of trying to amend the 2nd, be an infringement on that very right?
What does "shall not infringed" mean in a court of laws?
Any part of the Constitution can be deleted or revised by the process of Constitutional Amendment. If the 2nd amendment were to be repealed, it would not be in effect and so "infringement" would not be an issue. We could throw out the entire Bill of Rights if a supermajority of people wanted to.
That said, the Founders made it quite difficult to amend the Constitution. That was done intentionally; the Constitution should not be revised frivolously or at the whim of public opinion. As has been pointed out, it is highly unlikely that the 2nd amendment will ever be repealed. Personally, I think it would be great if we could reword the 2nd amendment to clarify what this stuff about "a well-regulated militia" is referring to, but I don't expect any changes in my lifetime.
On this point you are correct, for the most part. Out of state sales are required to be shipped to a licensed FFL dealer and the buyer must fill out a form 4473 and get a background check. Whether it's a site like Gunbroker or a private gun site like AK-Whatever.com. In fact over the last 3 years, I've noticed that now FFls are requiring the seller to have an FFL dealer ship from his end to the FFl on the buyer's end. Doubling the fees. The sellers FFL gets a fee and the Buyer pays a fee to the Receiving FFL. Used to be I could package the gun up in my home and ship it to the FFL of the buyer for delivery. There was no special law passed requiring the seller to do this but FFLs decided to do this on their own.
Obama's new law will do nothing to halt gun crime and mass shootings. Only mandatory background checks of all gun sales will make a real dent in the rate of gun deaths. That means all private sales must go through an FFL dealer and a form 4473, with all mental health backgrounds being forwarded to the federal NICs system
Of course there are a lot of gun owners who are paranoid individuals to begin with and that paranoia extends to any form of gun control. IE: Background checks lead to national registration. Totally false but believable if you're ruled by paranoia. NRA's foundation is based on Paranoia. Yes I am a member. Yes I carry concealed, every day. A little Ruger with a laser.
Soon there will be a split between the responsible gun owners and the rest of the phony gun packing patriot crowd.
"Only mandatory background checks of all gun sales will make a real dent in the rate of gun deaths."
To repeal the second amendment would require support of 2/3 of both houses of congress and 3/4 of the state legislatures.
Not to likely considering politicians like their jobs.
They could do it and still keep their jobs.
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