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Old 03-15-2017, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
7,184 posts, read 4,771,062 times
Reputation: 4869

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Niagara716 View Post
While it was well-intended, I think that cutting people off of their painkillers - which was largely done in 2013-14 after hydrocodone was reclassified as a stronger controlled substance - turned out to completely backfire and it's created this monster of heroin/fentanyl addictions which has led to overdose deaths from not knowing what is in 'the stuff' that many former painkiller addicts are buying on the streets. Many of these folks who have died from overdoses had no street experience and had no clue what they were getting themselves into. Even though the source of this addiction was largely attributed to prescription pain pills, many were at least somewhat functional, sane and alive while on them.

When a doctor has a patient getting 180 hydrocodone tablets a month, there must be some kind of step-down in place to ween them off responsibly. This was not done in a way that would have been successful for the patient. It was largely the DEA, who put the fear of God in the doctors, because they were at risk of losing their license to practice medicine and in some cases, serving jail time. When doctors were made aware of this, many of them immediately cut their pain patients off, some refused to even accept new patients being prescribed opiates, and I knew of some who even retired for good because of how uncomfortable it was just to see patients.

This whole thing has been a lose-lose. Those who were cut off their prescription opiates - some turned to the street drugs, overdosed and died; others committed suicide, and those who were elderly and/or lifelong disabled had to go through tremendous hoops and monthly doctor visits just to get half of the prescriptions they were getting previously. And in many cases in 2017, you won't get narcotic pain medication for anything other than a day.

I get that this is a crisis and an emergency, but they way this was handled from the beginning is largely what created this disaster. Medical professionals got scared and dropped these patients like a hot potato and let them fend for themselves. What did they think would happen? Cutting their patients off did nothing to stop the dependency issues - they just found other very dangerous ways to obtain their pills.
The only person who can do anything about the dependency is the addict himself. They can go into an ER and ask for help. Social workers can help connect them to available resources, but that hardly ever happens.

I worked briefly at a doctors office and quit the job because I was fed up with the addicts, their threats, verbal abuse, demands, etc. They believe that they're the belly button of the universe and everybody is on this earth just to cater to them. They create havoc around them and beyond.

You make it sound like they're sweethearts, poor little innocent darlings. It's all other people's fault. No street experience my foot. They have addictive thinking. They are liars, users, abusers, manipulators, thieves, self centered, selfish animals who think nothing of pimping out their own kids for a fix. Yes, I've seen that.

No, I don't feel any sympathy and have no empathy. Some addicts are successful at staying sober but those are the ones who work at it every single day. Nobody is holding their hand. Kudos to those who work everyday at staying sober.

I don't care about the ones who whine and whine about needing help when all the while they're just trying to figure out how to con money out of you.

If they want to kill themselves it's entirely on them not the rest of the world.
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Old 03-15-2017, 08:32 PM
 
Location: California
37,143 posts, read 42,240,055 times
Reputation: 35022
It's awful. Until we have an actual CURE for addictions, or thing things that drive people to it, we can't do much but try to save those who OD. If no cure is ever found then even that will begin to make little sense since few people want to make their career keeping addicts alive to OD another day.
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Old 03-15-2017, 08:45 PM
 
Location: Native of Any Beach/FL
35,711 posts, read 21,081,460 times
Reputation: 14257
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDnurse View Post
The only person who can do anything about the dependency is the addict himself. They can go into an ER and ask for help. Social workers can help connect them to available resources, but that hardly ever happens.

I worked briefly at a doctors office and quit the job because I was fed up with the addicts, their threats, verbal abuse, demands, etc. They believe that they're the belly button of the universe and everybody is on this earth just to cater to them. They create havoc around them and beyond.

You make it sound like they're sweethearts, poor little innocent darlings. It's all other people's fault. No street experience my foot. They have addictive thinking. They are liars, users, abusers, manipulators, thieves, self centered, selfish animals who think nothing of pimping out their own kids for a fix. Yes, I've seen that.

No, I don't feel any sympathy and have no empathy. Some addicts are successful at staying sober but those are the ones who work at it every single day. Nobody is holding their hand. Kudos to those who work everyday at staying sober.

I don't care about the ones who whine and whine about needing help when all the while they're just trying to figure out how to con money out of you.

If they want to kill themselves it's entirely on them not the rest of the world.
Wow. Well, they might have been spoiled brats before, but you know the addiction is like having a demon perched on your shoulders 24/7 wasting you and eating your brains. But, I don't roll them all into one ball and throw them in a box. They are some ones kid. But glad you quit, not for you...
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Old 03-16-2017, 01:00 AM
 
1,478 posts, read 789,372 times
Reputation: 561
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
This is such an unbelievable crisis and I can't think of another way than to start created rehabilitation centers and making the medication that stops it available everywhere.

It's mute testimony to the opioid addiction plague that has been ravaging Ohio — a 20-foot-long air conditioned trailer with room for 18 bodies.

The Stark County coroner in Canton had a "cold storage mass casualty trailer" trucked-in on Saturday because the morgue was overflowing with bodies, nearly half of them victims of drug overdoses.


Too Many Bodies in Ohio Morgue, so Coroner Gets Death Trailer - NBC News
Mexico--to my great surprise--mandates by law a much longer period in rehab for alcoholics and drug addicts. And good for Mexico a far more impoverished nation than the USA.

Rehabs don't permanently end use for the vast majority of substance addicts though. But what Mexico demonstrates is a will. Something the US lacks, just like it's wimpish war against ISIS. But more importantly Mexico demonstrates a will to help in the sense of mental health care terms. Again, with far less money than the USA.



But bright minds can figure a way of handling the problem of cost. I have a very vague idea, a vague outline in my mind. And most substance addicts down and out would gladly run to it. It's not prison nor rehab but draws from elements of both. You have a prison industrial complex were private businesses are in joint venture with that state and use prison labor to make a financial profit. Well then why can't something similar be applied to a sectioned off community in a city turned into a mixed industrial/residential zone that is alcohol and drug free? The businesses being given an exemption to pay the voluntary addicts there below minimum wage for their labor? I don't know... say the employer pays each employee something like $3.00 an hour. And the residents would pay rent also where they live at inside that community. So, they would buy their own food (and probably be required to garden and grow a small amount of food too) in the store or stores on the grounds that a business opens too. The main thing is too keep the addict on grounds for a significant period of time. Over 3, 4, or 7 years time in the community and clean they begin to move out of the community into society.

I'm saying, God gave man a brain. If you can figure out how to send man to the moon, if you can figure out how to create a nuclear bomb, if you can figure out how start a war with Russia, then you can figure out a better way to tackle a very ancient problem. If you have the will that is. Portugal has the will and started doing things differently.
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Old 03-16-2017, 01:27 AM
 
1,478 posts, read 789,372 times
Reputation: 561
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDnurse View Post
You make it sound like they're sweethearts, poor little innocent darlings. It's all other people's fault. No street experience my foot. They have addictive thinking. They are liars, users, abusers, manipulators, thieves, self centered, selfish animals who think nothing of pimping out their own kids for a fix. Yes, I've seen that.
For a minute there I thought you were describing the CIA. Or were you?

Anyways, were you describing Prince, Philip Seymour Hoffman, Ray Charles, Elvis, or the former fat Mayor of Toronto dressed in a business suit?

Anyways, I voted for Trump, fortunately as one of his winning voters you so eloquently articulated why as a non-substance addict he has to be a great guy. I'm not sure but if I recall correctly I think Trump says he refrains from drinking alcohol due to what he has seen alcoholism do to a family member.

Your rant reminds me of the rant some white cops working in the black poor neighborhoods tell their white family members about black people.

Hey, if a black person pimped their own child does that mean all have of would? What about the only 1 or 2 Muslims that have blown themselves up in suicide bombing?

Quote:
If they want to kill themselves it's entirely on them not the rest of the world.
Hey, I'm not much different than you in that, as that is pretty much my feelings about Americans and Russians. My enemies are here in the USA. I don't much care if the Russians nuke New York City (or if any Muslim terrorist do it for that matter). If Americans with death that is their problem.

Generally, substance addicts become increasingly immoral, and they are consumed with self. That is the nature of substance addiction. But with Donald Trump as President I'm sure as strong and inspiring as he is that he will be able to lead a lot of addicts toward a more selfless and promising road. He will make America Great Again.
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Old 03-16-2017, 05:10 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by boneyard1962 View Post
Ok I'll be the bad guy and say it. It is self inflicted. It is a choice they make. Darwin scores a huge win and we as a species are better for it. Anyone dumb enough to do meth deserves what follows. Anyone dumb enough to mix meth with anything else absolutely deserves the death that awaits them. It is self inflicted.
Sadly, yes. To all of the above. There are no guarantees in life. Life is what you make it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9G42rmPvbbU


Also said earlier by Eleanor Roosevelt (paraphrased): Life is what you make it. Always has been. Always will be.
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Old 03-16-2017, 05:20 AM
 
Location: Florida
33,572 posts, read 18,177,840 times
Reputation: 15551
Some people love their drugs... more than life.
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Old 03-16-2017, 05:22 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
I have yet to meet an addict who intended to become addicted.
What do they think is going to happen when they regularly and consistently use a substance which is known to be addictive? And that includes tobacco, alcohol, and both prescription and illicit drugs?

That absolutely IS intention.
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Old 03-16-2017, 05:35 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
As you well know, Purdue Pharma - a drug CORPORATION - is probably the largest profiteer from opiate production.
Just want to make sure everyone knows Purdue Pharmaceutical has nothing to do with Purdue University in Indiana.

Purdue Pharmaceutical was founded in NYC in 1892 by doctors John Purdue Gray and George Frederick Bingham. Their HQ is now in Stamford, CT.
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Old 03-16-2017, 05:46 AM
 
Location: SE Asia
16,236 posts, read 5,886,302 times
Reputation: 9117
Quote:
Originally Posted by burdell View Post
We also all learn to trust our doctors but I suppose you'd prefer we just ignore how prescription opioids are so often over prescribed, right? I personally know several people with bottles of prescription opioids in their medicine cabinets because they found common OTC pain-killers sufficient for their discomfort but were never the less prescribed opioids.
And you are assuming that all or most Opioid addicts started out from a prescription. The individuals mixing meth with animal tranquilizers didn't get their prescription from the doctor. The idiots using them as recreational trucks likely didn't get a script from the doc. Yes many started out that way, but many more didn't.
Anyone who has had major surgery has been on them and yet the majority don't fall prey to an addiction. It's all about choices.
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