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Old 03-16-2017, 06:07 AM
 
Location: Native of Any Beach/FL
35,711 posts, read 21,081,460 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boneyard1962 View Post
And you are assuming that all or most Opioid addicts started out from a prescription. The individuals mixing meth with animal tranquilizers didn't get their prescription from the doctor. The idiots using them as recreational trucks likely didn't get a script from the doc. Yes many started out that way, but many more didn't.
Anyone who has had major surgery has been on them and yet the majority don't fall prey to an addiction. It's all about choices.


no- there are people who take taken crack once and became addicted- one who has taken a drink once and never stopped - do not ask me to explain why that is, some tolerate better than others and some with a support system/ help- can get out of the addiction- some just die. Whatever makes the difference, there is not enough there to pull out. Choice, is when you can just stop- that is not a reality for many - you always think one can just do as they please- - be glad you can - but that is the far and few. I cannot stand it when others put people down because they have overcome and are strong people- and think the rest is less of a person because they cannot.
We need facilities for these people to get it right --if possible-for free- and from the looks of it- they will be cutting the funding for that with trumpcare-- so the problem is not going away with a wall
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Old 03-16-2017, 09:55 AM
 
1,478 posts, read 789,561 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
What do they think is going to happen when they regularly and consistently use a substance which is known to be addictive? And that includes tobacco, alcohol, and both prescription and illicit drugs?

That absolutely IS intention.
No, just because you drink alcohol does not mean you personally intend to become an alcoholic who wakes up in the morning shaking, needing to take one or more drinks to bring you back to normal baseline of function. Most people don't think they will ever get addicted. Primarily because the social attitudes around substance addiction are equivalent to say... the social attitudes of some African country that incarcerates homosexuals.

Substance addiction is self inflicted. I don't buy the genetic inheritance line. Albeit, some organisms and populations may not carry as much genetic resistance to alcoholism or say heroin addiction. But given it is a scientific fact, not my opinion, that no two human beings are physiologically the same on earth, the issue of individuals responses to ingested substances be it peanuts, prescription medication, or cocktails served over a bar becomes a more complex issue. That's why doctors have to switch a patience medication or dosage often when treating patience for certain symptoms. If one goes to a medical doctor that is a psychiatrist for an issue of depression it is very common for the doctor to over many months, even years in some cases, to switch a patience type of anti-depression drugs around and adjust the dosages until they find something that works. Works in releaving the symptoms.

You know Americans like to whine like dramatic women in an opera about gun violence in the US and mass shootings. And liberals and conservatives unite in their little fake concern for "mental health care" in the US for which the two whiners blame the Federal Government for not solving, not solving each individuals mental health problems. Frankly, is see the whining for what it is: fake concern. Shifting blame. And frankly, I don't care how many Americans get shot and killed. You all did it to yourselves.

Here is a mental health issue, if Americans were true to their concerns about mental health (which they are not). Why do so many young American teens and young adults drink to get drunk or use other drugs to alter their minds?

Ironically most the reason come down to why a person goes to a psychiatrist seeking prescription drugs to treat their depression or psychological issue: to treat the symptoms of their psychological and emotional issues.

That's why one 14 year-old drinks on a few occasions but never really takes to alcohol as a need in all social occasions or every day period. And another 14 year-old that is psychologically and emotionally too afraid to speak with other kids, dance in social gatherings clinches to alcohol as a miracle drug after the first few times taking and discovering it releaved their symptoms. They came out of their shell. They were no longer fearful. And in not a few occasions the next Monday morning other kids told them how they were soooooo awesome at the party.

Herein are the early stages of alcoholism before the physical craving phenomenon ever sets in biologically, before alcoholism ever sets in biologically, altering the epigenetic mechanisms in the brain. At this point the person could stop, fix their psychological and emotional root problems, and 10 years down the line return to occasionally drinking alcohol as a social drinker because alcoholism has not set in biologically. And they have healed their root psychological and emotional problems, rather than simply treat with medication the symptoms of their psychological and emotional problems. But once alcoholism sets in biologically there is no turning back biologically. No more than a pickle can return to being just a regular cucumber.

But Americans want to blame the Federal Government. The root problem are Americans themselves. Just like your inability to get free universal health care. You're a nationality with the moral and emotional characteristics of an emotionally abusive, verbally abusive, father and husband obsessed with ensuring you are not too nice to people. Living in constant psychological fear that you and society are becoming too nice. As if the country is drowning already in niceness. The number of serial killers, serial rapists, broken homes, bullied kids, conniving and warmongering politicians, greedy corporations and banks, rates of substance addiction, child molesters running around, abducted children, mass shootings, hate for Christians, CIA trying to overthrow the President, spouses crushed by medical debt, people so addicted to food they are morbidly obese, and black Chicagoans killing each other's in slow mass murder.... and you people are overly concerned Americans are too nice to each other. LOL!

It's so absurd it's hilarious.

Addressing mental health begins in the individual, the family, his or her surrounding family and community, and then into local institutions (e.g. , schools, hospitals and so on). In that order. It does not begin with Obama, Trump, or Congress.
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:02 AM
 
16,956 posts, read 16,765,643 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EDnurse View Post
The only person who can do anything about the dependency is the addict himself. They can go into an ER and ask for help. Social workers can help connect them to available resources, but that hardly ever happens.

I worked briefly at a doctors office and quit the job because I was fed up with the addicts, their threats, verbal abuse, demands, etc. They believe that they're the belly button of the universe and everybody is on this earth just to cater to them. They create havoc around them and beyond.

You make it sound like they're sweethearts, poor little innocent darlings. It's all other people's fault. No street experience my foot. They have addictive thinking. who think nothing of pimping out their own kids for a fix. Yes, I've seen that.

No, I don't feel any sympathy and have no empathy. Some addicts are successful at staying sober but those are the ones who work at it every single day. Nobody is holding their hand. Kudos to those who work everyday at staying sober.

I don't care about the ones who whine and whine about needing help when all the while they're just trying to figure out how to con money out of you.

If they want to kill themselves it's entirely on them not the rest of the world.

But, with most serious addicts, the "drugs do the talking" for them. A constant need to find drugs and how to get them. You can compare everything you said to a gambling addict: You said: "They are liars, users, abusers, manipulators, thieves, self centered, selfish animals." Change the heroin to video poker machines. They (gambling addicts) lie to get more money, lie to their employer and families, are wanting to feel the gambling high at any cost. They know (just like a heroin abuser) that what they are doing is wrong, sick, bad, but they gamble and keep gambling until nothing is left and then they borrow and eventually will steal to get money for gambling. They manipulate and don't care about their families, leave their kids in hot cars out in the parking lot so they can gamble (saw it too many times in Las Vegas). It is just as sick a disease.


My main point is: Many addictions are destructive and tear apart families. Yes---The addict is selfish whether that be from shooting up in his arm or pulling the arm of a slot machine. So, you realize most addict replace one addiction with another? (I think you wrote that up there too) So, what is the answer for an addictive personality?
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Old 03-16-2017, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
7,184 posts, read 4,771,062 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frogburn View Post
For a minute there I thought you were describing the CIA. Or were you?

Anyways, were you describing Prince, Philip Seymour Hoffman, Ray Charles, Elvis, or the former fat Mayor of Toronto dressed in a business suit?

Anyways, I voted for Trump, fortunately as one of his winning voters you so eloquently articulated why as a non-substance addict he has to be a great guy. I'm not sure but if I recall correctly I think Trump says he refrains from drinking alcohol due to what he has seen alcoholism do to a family member.

Your rant reminds me of the rant some white cops working in the black poor neighborhoods tell their white family members about black people.

Hey, if a black person pimped their own child does that mean all have of would? What about the only 1 or 2 Muslims that have blown themselves up in suicide bombing?



Hey, I'm not much different than you in that, as that is pretty much my feelings about Americans and Russians. My enemies are here in the USA. I don't much care if the Russians nuke New York City (or if any Muslim terrorist do it for that matter). If Americans with death that is their problem.

Generally, substance addicts become increasingly immoral, and they are consumed with self. That is the nature of substance addiction. But with Donald Trump as President I'm sure as strong and inspiring as he is that he will be able to lead a lot of addicts toward a more selfless and promising road. He will make America Great Again.
I was describing real people whose parents pimped them out at age 10, for example, to pay for her mother's heroin. Mother and daughter turning tricks for heroin. Later, on came the little boy's turn to turn tricks to cover mummy's habit. I KNOW these people and others like them.

As for the rest of your post, you have serious issues. Take care of yourself.
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:03 PM
 
13,898 posts, read 6,452,130 times
Reputation: 6960
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom View Post
I have yet to meet an addict who intended to become addicted.

There's a serious level of magical thinking go on.
Are they stupid? Who doesn't know that opiates are addictive? Yeah, let's go do heroin for recreation even though we know full well of the consequences then say we didn't intend to get addicted.
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Native of Any Beach/FL
35,711 posts, read 21,081,460 times
Reputation: 14257
we are heavy consumers... obsessed with clothes- foods- shoes- work, houses, toys- tv. telephones, texting, media, drugs, booze, sex and even an array of partners- I don't know why? gluttony?
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
7,184 posts, read 4,771,062 times
Reputation: 4869
Quote:
Originally Posted by WannaliveinGreenville View Post
But, with most serious addicts, the "drugs do the talking" for them. A constant need to find drugs and how to get them. You can compare everything you said to a gambling addict: You said: "They are liars, users, abusers, manipulators, thieves, self centered, selfish animals." Change the heroin to video poker machines. They (gambling addicts) lie to get more money, lie to their employer and families, are wanting to feel the gambling high at any cost. They know (just like a heroin abuser) that what they are doing is wrong, sick, bad, but they gamble and keep gambling until nothing is left and then they borrow and eventually will steal to get money for gambling. They manipulate and don't care about their families, leave their kids in hot cars out in the parking lot so they can gamble (saw it too many times in Las Vegas). It is just as sick a disease.


My main point is: Many addictions are destructive and tear apart families. Yes---The addict is selfish whether that be from shooting up in his arm or pulling the arm of a slot machine. So, you realize most addict replace one addiction with another? (I think you wrote that up there too) So, what is the answer for an addictive personality?
Addiction is rooted in addictive thinking. Addiction can have different manifestations: alcohol, pills (legally prescribed or not), heroin, cocaine, meth, gambling, food, even sex when it evolves into destructive behavior. It is ALL addiction.

Addicts use "problems" (parents divorce, abandonment, rejection, feelings of inadequacy, etc) to justify their use. They will blame other people, situations, etc. To addicts the cause of their addiction is outside of themselves. That way, they avoid self examination.

The people who buy into the addict's narrative of self pity or anger are only fueling the addiction. They're known as enablers.

The latest rationalization I've heard amongst addicts is "it's a disease. I didn't wake up one day and decided to get sick". To which I reply, you got up this morning and told yourself "I need money to get high. I have to get high." At this point, they get mad at me because I'm not falling for their BS.
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:34 PM
 
29,510 posts, read 14,673,560 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Drug addiction is a mental health problem. A national health care system and a strong public safety net would help tremendously. But Trump seems to be more concerned about tax breaks for the donor class and propping up big pharma and the military industrial complex. The American people suffer as a result.

How ? One makes a choice to try them don't they ? One makes the choice to keep taking them knowing full well what the outcome is. I've been prescribed Norco a couple of times in my lifetime and knew, every time I took one I was one step closer to becoming addicted to it. The last time I had it was due to a surgery, and was prescribed 7 days worth. I took them for 3 and was done.


As far as Heroin and Meth, people make the choice to try those ...make bad choices and bad things happen.
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:40 PM
 
29,510 posts, read 14,673,560 times
Reputation: 14459
Quote:
Originally Posted by WannaliveinGreenville View Post
Drug addiction in many cases, is a life-time problem. It could have started with heredity. (possible theory) ...It's in the blood--passed by the parents, like some alcoholism problems. The young person could have grown up around it, (environmental) his parents, uncles or anyone directly in his life. He tries to overcome it but gives in, as any strong addiction can take over your common sense. He can go many years and then get back into it. Some will overdose, like an old friend of mine. He went 15 years without using heroin and one day decided to get back into it. He took too much and he died.


If you know someone who is or used to be into drugs, they often return to it when they can't or won't change their environment and their habits. Not sure any program for drugs is going to "cure" them. They may stabilize for many years, but something pushes them off the edge, stress for example and they are back on.


I get that an addictive personality can be passed along and generally by the time one is an adult they know if they are or not. So being an addictive person, why would they take the chance on an addictive drug ?
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Old 03-16-2017, 12:54 PM
 
Location: in my imagination
13,608 posts, read 21,402,861 times
Reputation: 10112
here is a question for all of you saying blame the person they are just stupid and they should have known better and it is Darwin weeding out the riff raff...




Did you grow up in a abusive household or had parents that were drug addicts and you were just smart and strong enough to reject drug abuse?


Did you grow up in a foster home unwanted and subjected to guardians who often cared little about you and was more concerned about the money gained by fostering?


Did you grow up in a slum surrounded by drug abuse and were strong enough to reject your environment?


Was your mother or father a drug addict who loved and cared for you no matter what who would have never pimped you out to feed their habit or purposely introduce you to addiction ?


fact is you don't know until you have walked in someone's shoes.........or at least listened to them..
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