Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The 'market' had a chance to deliver the best care at the lowest price since at least the 1920's what went wrong? And how many more chances do they need? The only competition in healthcare is for elective services like Lasik and cosmetic surgery and the prices have been stable or dropped when other prices were rising, but those are services people don't need to stay alive and they aren't typically covered by insurance, so the consumer has some power to keep prices down.
But there is no competition when your three year old is having an asthma attack, you take the child to the closest ER for treatment you don't do a google search to try to save money or walk out with a sick kid if you think it will cost too much to treat her. If you get cancer, you beg your doctor to send you to the best oncologist in the area, you don't bargain shop. Probably 70% of the public would go bankrupt trying to pay for chemo or an expensive surgery- that's why we have health insurance.
You tell me, how do you create competition in a market where the providers and the insurance companies hold all the cards and we have none?
There is precious little direct competition at the provider level between the provider and patient. Direct competition. Even spur of the moment issues, such as ER visits, will experience the lessening of costs and increase in quality that competition results in.
However, I suspect that people, a whole lot of people, don't want competition, they want somebody else's nipple in their mouth - for FREE.
The ACA was based on the Massachusetts program. It was and still is considered to be a success.
A success by who?
It's a very expensive program that had the opposite effect than it's name suggests.
Universal or single payer is the correct answer. The Dems could have done that if they actually cared about a program that made health care affordable.
There is precious little direct competition at the provider level between the provider and patient. Direct competition. Even spur of the moment issues, such as ER visits, will experience the lessening of costs and increase in quality that competition results in.
However, I suspect that people, a whole lot of people, don't want competition, they want somebody else's nipple in their mouth - for FREE.
Competition is typically good for free markets. Local HC monopolies are not the cheapest way of course, but ER competition is way too complex and difficult an issue to improve on without moving away from patients best medical interests.
How would you provide for more competition with providers attracting patients?
There is precious little direct competition at the provider level between the provider and patient. Direct competition. Even spur of the moment issues, such as ER visits, will experience the lessening of costs and increase in quality that competition results in.
However, I suspect that people, a whole lot of people, don't want competition, they want somebody else's nipple in their mouth - for FREE.
I don't disagree, but let's talk about competition in the ER, how would you achieve that? If an ambulance delivers you to the hospital who are you going to bargain with before you allow them to treat you?
I don't disagree, but let's talk about competition in the ER, how would you achieve that? If an ambulance delivers you to the hospital who are you going to bargain with before you allow them to treat you?
Very few people will have the necessary information along with the sensible possibility of being taken to one ER over another. Cost is one factor, insurance coverage another, then there is distance and time, and finally there is ER capability.
If you don't have anything constructive, or at least rational, to say, butt out.
If you cannot speak thruthfully about healthcare delivery payment systems you know nothing whatsoever about, you should stop using them as comparators to your fubarred country and it's propensity to take any system and reduce it to shambles.
"Deserve?" Do we all "deserve" free food, clothing, and shelter merely because we exist, too? Those are all life necessities.
Let me know if and when someone gets an unexpected bill for hundreds of thousands of dollars for clothing and food, or an insurance agency that offers food and clothing protections. Affordable housing should be a priority.
Single payer is a disaster in Canada. Aniimals in Canada have much better health care than people do because Vet Med. is market based, and an animal can get high-end diagnostics and treatments same day or next, at much reduced costs, because of the absence of OPM.
The last thing I want is the Federal Government, whose job is very thin (read the powers granted to the Fed. Gov't by the Constitution), caring for me individually. That is NOT the role of the central government.
Furthermore, if you think that the push for single payer is to provide quality health care to all Americans, you are naïve as can be. It is about gaining power and control over the American people. Read how Castro came to power.
It is sad that people such as yourself can't seem to live their lives without resorting to Uncle Sam, the most inept and incompetent, heartless and soul-less institution around, to nipple-feed you.
The government can't even deliver quality healthcare to the Veterans, and you want to nationalize that kind of incompetence. No doubt, you would also want to ban private health care as well.
Read this - it outlines the powers of the Federal Government. Note that there is nothing in there remotely authorizing single-payer.
Powers of the Fed. Govt:
Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;
To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries;
To constitute Tribunals inferior to the supreme Court;
To define and punish Piracies and Felonies committed on the high Seas, and Offenses against the Law of Nations;
To declare War, grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal, and make Rules concerning Captures on Land and Water;
To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;
To provide and maintain a Navy;
To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval Forces;
To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions;
To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
To exercise exclusive Legislation in all Cases whatsoever, over such District (not exceeding ten Miles square) as may, by Cession of particular States, and the acceptance of Congress, become the Seat of the Government of the United States, and to exercise like Authority over all Places purchased by the Consent of the Legislature of the State in which the Same shall be, for the Erection of Forts, Magazines, Arsenals, dock-Yards, and other needful Buildings; And all Laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into Execution the foregoing Powers, and all other Powers vested by this Constitution in the Government of the United States, or in any Department or Officer thereof.[/LEFT]
If you cannot speak thruthfully about healthcare delivery payment systems you know nothing whatsoever about, you should stop using them as comparators to your fubarred country and it's propensity to take any system and reduce it to shambles.
Public forum, my butts in it, just like yours.
The irony that that poster had nothing constructive to say about Canada's system in that post isn't lost on most of us here.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
