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Old 09-09-2017, 04:37 PM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,241,574 times
Reputation: 17209

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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
High taxes don't necessarily buy good schools. What's your public high school's college readiness percentage?

I pay over $19,000 in property taxes in Illinois to a community in which I didn't send my kids to school.

Illinois is largely a corrupt cesspool. It's not fair to use it for any sort of point.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:13 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by Natnasci View Post
Let me know if and when someone gets an unexpected bill for hundreds of thousands of dollars for clothing and food, or an insurance agency that offers food and clothing protections. Affordable housing should be a priority.
Housing can easily cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. And so can food and clothing over a lifetime. The point is, no one has a "right" to them. The government doesn't provide them to everyone for free. People have to earn them, and some people have earned higher-quality food, clothing, and shelter than others.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:28 PM
 
18,805 posts, read 8,479,367 times
Reputation: 4131
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Housing can easily cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. And so can food and clothing over a lifetime. The point is, no one has a "right" to them. The government doesn't provide them to everyone for free. People have to earn them, and some people have earned higher-quality food, clothing, and shelter than others.
As Natnasci said about the potential drastic costs of HC.

The conundrum created with HC as compared to food and clothing, is related to the vast potential for humongous costs in any individual patient. So we have to deal with those with pre-exisiting and our seniors, where the HC spending will be higher, and possibly enormously higher.

Free markets and ordinary insurance can't/won't go there due to risks and potential losses. Thus where free markets fear to tread, we create social programs to provide the necessary support. HC is not a Right per se, but IMO we need to make it as close to a right as reasonably possible.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:33 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
As Natnasci said about the potential drastic costs of HC.

The conundrum created with HC as compared to food and clothing, is related to the vast potential for humongous costs in any individual patient. So we have to deal with those with pre-exisiting and our seniors, where the HC spending will be higher, and possibly enormously higher.

Free markets and ordinary insurance can't/won't go there due to risks and potential losses. Thus where free markets fear to tread, we create social programs to provide the necessary support. HC is not a Right per se, but IMO we need to make it as close to a right as reasonably possible.
No, we don't. If HC were a "right," seniors wouldn't have had to prepay premiums for 35+ years for Medicare.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:43 PM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
42,850 posts, read 26,307,990 times
Reputation: 34059
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
No, we don't. If HC were a "right," seniors wouldn't have had to prepay premiums for 35+ years for Medicare.
Of course healthcare is a right, we acknowledged that healthcare is a right when we passed EMTALA in 1986. It only provides for emergency care but it is still healthcare and is available to everyone. And there are seniors who never paid into medicare and they are still eligible if they pay part A and part B premiums.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:48 PM
 
18,805 posts, read 8,479,367 times
Reputation: 4131
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
No, we don't. If HC were a "right," seniors wouldn't have had to prepay premiums for 35+ years for Medicare.
Seniors typically get a 1/3 or more discount. IMO this is reasonable. If I were king I'd do similar with private Obamacare policy holders.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:48 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
Of course healthcare is a right, we acknowledged that healthcare is a right when we passed EMTALA in 1986.
That's emergency care to stabilize a patient. That's not ongoing HC. HC isn't a "right."

Quote:
And there are seniors who never paid into medicare and they are still eligible if they pay part A and part B premiums.
Exactly, because HC isn't a "right." It's a purchasable commodity.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:52 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,060 posts, read 44,877,895 times
Reputation: 13718
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
Seniors typically get a 1/3 or more discount. IMO this is reasonable. If I were king I'd do similar with private Obamacare policy holders.
What are you talking about? I'll never get back in free HC benefits what I've paid in Medicare tax for 36 years (worked from age 16-52).
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:58 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,823,758 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoonose View Post
As Natnasci said about the potential drastic costs of HC.

The conundrum created with HC as compared to food and clothing, is related to the vast potential for humongous costs in any individual patient. So we have to deal with those with pre-exisiting and our seniors, where the HC spending will be higher, and possibly enormously higher.

Free markets and ordinary insurance can't/won't go there due to risks and potential losses. Thus where free markets fear to tread, we create social programs to provide the necessary support.
HC is not a Right per se, but IMO we need to make it as close to a right as reasonably possible.
That's why Medicare was started in the first place. (Agreeing)
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Old 09-09-2017, 07:05 PM
 
18,805 posts, read 8,479,367 times
Reputation: 4131
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
What are you talking about? I'll never get back in free HC benefits what I've paid in Medicare tax for 36 years (worked from age 16-52).
Blessing of good health noted!
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