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How do we know that any of us is even real? Maybe we're all holographs. Maybe we're all figments of the great Cosmos's mind.
Quote:
Originally Posted by hbdwihdh378y9
Right. Epistemology is underrated.
It would never occur to me to speak as if "ISIS" or "Al Qaeda" were real. They could be, but I have no reliable source of information in that regard. I have no reason to think that 9/11 happened the way the media and government said it did. There was never any reason to believe that Saddam Hussein had WMD.
Much of what we think we know is hearsay, or double, triple, quadruple, quintuple hearsay. And often, as in the instances cited above, the links in the chain of hearsay include the most shameless of liars.
Well this is a fascinating issue indeed. (the nature of "truth")....because it is one truth to know something is true and another truth just to believe it. It reminds me of the aphorism "Believe some of what you see, half of what you read and none of what you hear."
For myself, I do have knowledge that both ISIS and Al Qaeda are real as well as know reliable sources (persons who have personally related to me that they have verified the existence of both) as well as anecdotal sources whom I trust and don't have any reason to distrust or believe to be shameless liars. So multiple sources of belief for that one. I'd almost bet my life on the existence of these groups. That's how certain I am about it.
But I agree with you, there are so many things that are not within our personal experience that we have to take it on "Faith" that the sources telling us about these things actually exist or occurred. Heck I can think of several things I have seen myself over the years that few people would believe if I told them, even people that have known me for years who have no reason to think I would deceive them. And I pride myself on being forthright. Why? Because they think such things just can't happen or wouldn't happen, and that is the world view they have. You can't threaten someone's world view with personal testimony. They usually have to see it for themselves. i think that's human nature.
And as little as I trust those *some* in the IC...which includes some I know and still believe are not trustworthy, I trust their counterparts and stooges on the political side even LESS. That ESPECIALLY includes MISTER Mueller and his team of hired Democrat guns.
The most trustworthy people in my experience are the ones who don't have any reason to lie to you. Seek out those people, and examine who THEY are being told things by, and that will give you another peek at the REAL truth. Sometimes the story people believe the most fervently is the one they were told not to discuss with anyone (a common subterfuge). In fact, I'd even venture to generalize that people that THINK it is their DUTY to protect a secret, believe the secret to be the truth. Almost all of the time. Which is what makes it so diabolical and creates so much dissonance. My personal experience involves several situations exactly of that nature. How do you think I became so cynical?
As a result, I trust nobody...because in my experience, that is who you can trust. And the other thing I have learned - is that people that have a reason to lie to you - likely will lie to you. Maybe not all of the time...and maybe not a complete lie...but eventually, they will lie about something in some way. My mantra could be summed up as "trust....but verify. And if you can't verify, then don't trust."
Next, apply Occam's Razor to every situation. Now, does the "official story" fit? If it doesn't then scrutinize it, because its probably a steaming load of horsecrap! Again...trust but verify.
There is no way to prove it and that is why they came out with this ridiculous ploy to save face. Yeah, let's indict people that we will never be able to reach or prosecute. It's embarrassing.
it doesnt matter, like rush was saying last week, they have to blame somebody, they cant just say " we have nothing" that why the big deal about lying to fbi agents and other charges that doesnt have anything to do with trump. They got to pin someone so they justifly the money spend. and what better way, charge somebody, nobody knows.
Getting your talking points from an entertainment radio show, I can't even begin to take you seriously.
Kind of like the school kid shooting victims in FL - that are fake, just actors pretending to be traumatized.
The whole criminal justice system is fake. All the Dems are fake. Russian meddling is fake. Environmental pollution is fake.
And you may ask yourself
How do I work this?
And you may ask yourself
Where is that large automobile?
And you may tell yourself
This is not my beautiful house!
And you may tell yourself
This is not my beautiful wife!
And you may ask yourself
What is that beautiful house?
And you may ask yourself
Where does that highway go to?
And you may ask yourself
Am I right? Am I wrong?
And you may say yourself, "My God! What have I done?"
Sorry . its all making me a little crazy this morning.
Your disinformation campaign on this thread is falling flat Ivan.
Mueller is embarrassing. You should be too for supporting his childish nonsense that does absolutely nothing. Indicting people who will never ever be prosecuted? That's cartoon land stuff.
Look, Mueller could allege anything he wanted to. The alleged miscreants aren't US persons, and aren't in the country. How convenient. The DNC/Swamp could have created every single fictitious person themselves. They sure were talking about it way before anyone had any reason to be suspicious of "foreign interference". It could be them all along. They create the fake personas. They create and manage the fake accounts. They reach out to conservatives, including perhaps people on the Trump campaign.
Then they nark on themselves, and blame Trump.
How could we know this isn't what happened? The entire thing could be just another DNC dirty trick, like their other dirty tricks - like paying mentally ill/homeless to be agitators and incite violence against Trump supporters - we know they actually did that - its on video tape captured by Project Veritas.
We know they sabotaged the Sanders campaign in the primary and rigged it so he couldn't compete. We know that happened.
We know they conspired to obtain the debate questions and give them to Hillary's team to prep. That really happened.
So how do we know this "russian troll farm" thing isn't just another Democrat Dirty Trick?
The truth: we can't know. It fits their pattern of deceptive underhanded sleazy behavior.
Let's just assume they exist.
These 13 Ruskies have ensnared the Democrats as readily as the Republicans. If there is blame here, it's bipartisan.
You know what I think? I think they failed to prove the "collusion" thing, since the "hacking" thing couldn't be proved either, and "collusion" relied on the hacking. So this is plan C.
Make up some cockamamie story about Russian troll farms, no real people need to exist to even defend themselves with the usual "I'm innocent. I don't know what you're talking about! I wasn't there. It wasn't me. Nobody saw me do it. " that might derail the entire charade by way of lack of proof that could withstand scrutiny (like records produced and kept by telco companies or social media companies - to the extent that (they) couldn't get someone in those companies to collude with them to fake the data). It is the perfect crime. One with defendants conveniently beyond the reach of the law and simultaneously beyond the ability of any American citizen to verify actually even exists.
And since the defendants cannot be secured to answer to the charges, the charges never withstand any scrutiny and the Special Counsel never has to present any Evidence or Proofs of the alleged crimes.
What could go wrong?
I think your elaborate little fake news world will come crashing down around you.
Reality is harsh. Conjuring up conspiracy theories is a right wing specialty.
Look, Mueller could allege anything he wanted to. The alleged miscreants aren't US persons, and aren't in the country. How convenient. The DNC/Swamp could have created every single fictitious person themselves. They sure were talking about it way before anyone had any reason to be suspicious of "foreign interference". It could be them all along. They create the fake personas. They create and manage the fake accounts. They reach out to conservatives, including perhaps people on the Trump campaign.
Then they nark on themselves, and blame Trump.
How could we know this isn't what happened? The entire thing could be just another DNC dirty trick, like their other dirty tricks - like paying mentally ill/homeless to be agitators and incite violence against Trump supporters - we know they actually did that - its on video tape captured by Project Veritas.
We know they sabotaged the Sanders campaign in the primary and rigged it so he couldn't compete. We know that happened.
We know they conspired to obtain the debate questions and give them to Hillary's team to prep. That really happened.
So how do we know this "russian troll farm" thing isn't just another Democrat Dirty Trick?
The truth: we can't know. It fits their pattern of deceptive underhanded sleazy behavior.
I don't personally really have an opinion on whether they are real. It is glaringly obvious that Trump believes they are real, and that it puts him one step closer to impeachment and criminal charges. If the DNC did it, Kudos! It means they are getting pretty good at this counterespionage thing.
You need to tweet Donnie and tell him he has nothing to worry about.
Mueller is embarrassing. You should be too for supporting his childish nonsense that does absolutely nothing. Indicting people who will never ever be prosecuted? That's cartoon land stuff.
And you know they will never be prosecuted how? Foreigners are routinely prosecuted for crimes they commit. If they fail to appear in court they can be convicted anyway and apprehended at some later date if they travel.
Important right now is to establish the facts and put on record that these crimes exist.
No irresponsible person can any longer claim that the activity of the Russians is a "Hoax". It is real, it is dangerous to our republic, and it could (probably will) be tried again. This is a threat we must be prepared for, and defend our nation against, not deny and ignore.
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