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"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 56 minutes ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,159 posts, read 13,444,010 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics
:-:-: Why Tax Payer Subsidized Health Care Is Dangerous :-:-:
Although governments instituted to secure endowed rights are acceptable, allowing governments to impose the obligation to pay for the health care of others is not.
There are a host of reasons why it is dangerous and a threat to liberty.
Once government controls healthcare, not only does it have the literal power of life and death, it has the power to impose obedience to the dictates of that system. Obviously, if one participates in such a healthcare system but refuses therapy, won’t take medications, is uncooperative and thus wastes time and resources, it could be a criminal if not a civil offense. It certainly may result in the loss of future services. And what about second opinions? Or third opinions? Isn’t that also a waste of public resources? And what happens when the “state of the art” is dead wrong and to challenge it is illegal?
Say good-bye to liberty.
On the opposite spectrum, what happens when the individual’s illness imposes a cost that is greater than what the bureaucracy will allocate? Shunting such patients to a hospice to comfortably die is not what most people would think of as benevolent universal health care.
There is one other aspect that no advocate of national health care wishes to consider - the self sacrifice for loved ones. It is not an uncommon practice for a family to sacrifice in order to care for a sickly member. In some instances, a sickly child will consume far more time, resources, and attention than the other healthy children. The parents and other family members willingly give up far more than what a bureaucrat would designate as “equitable.” In short, national health care is heartless, cold, and driven by budgets. [As illustrated by the case of Alfie Evans, sentenced to death by NHS bureaucrats.]
Before Socialism and government meddling, many private charities operated health care facilities, staffed by those who willingly chose a life of service to others. Frankly, I prefer to be cared for by selfless individuals than well paid professionals. Nor should we expect exemplary service from the lowest paid professional.
In short, national health care will be a boon to the bureaucrat, the politician, and the tax collector, but a curse upon the people stuck with the bill, and the patients and medical staff who suffer under it.
Firstly many Universal Healthcare systems use private sector hospitals and have inpit from charities, foundations, religious organisations, mutual-insurance associations and other NGO's. Hospices are generally not part of the UK NHS and are for the terminally ill, whilst the social care sector is also a largely private sector.
Secondly you can take out private healthcare insurance and pay for private treatment in the UK should you wish to
Thirdly the NHS is not run by Government it is run by NHS Trusts and it provides very good services for children, and if any system is budget driven it is the private sector and insurance companies.
Finaly in terms of Alfie Evans it was a judicial decision based on the fact the child was terminally ill, there was no cure or treatment available and was also based on issues such as quality of life.
Last edited by Brave New World; 06-20-2018 at 10:28 AM..
Why would I want my taxes to pay for someone that was a lifelong junk food eating , non-excecising, druggie, alcoholic smoker? Same goes for some lady that wants to have a dozen kids?
It makes no sense to pay for someone else poor health choices. Sorry.... the government does not pay...
They forcefully redistribute "people's" aka tax payer's wealth that is created by them.... its ROBBERY and is not the FREE MARKET and is not the principles of which the country was founded upon.
The WELFARE STATE cannot continue.
If you have insurance, you already are paying for exactly that. If you don't, you are either lucky (that you haven't needed major medical), unbelievably rich, or one of those free-loading people you describe who doesn't pay their debt.
The whole dealing with insurance companies is insane. Heck, even if you are paying for it you still have to pay a deductible and HOPE your insurance covers whatever it is you need done. This is insane! From birth, everyone should automatically have all the access one needs without having to pay a dime. Every person should be able to walk into any hospital whenever and get whatever procedure/surgery etc. is needed without paying anything. We certainly could do it if we stopped all these stupid wars that our politicians constantly jack off to while watching us kill innocent men women and children and destroying everything.
Other than greed, is there any good reason we can't shut down all these health insurance companies and just have the govt itself foot the bill for every persons healthcare needs? God forbid rich people only have 50-100K to live off of compared to millions/billions.
Goody, goody! And, this will be paid for, HOW!!!!!
Perhaps one downside of state healthcare, is that it doesn't provide any incentive for people outside of the profession to really talk about their healthcare, as things like deductibles, co-pays, premiums , pre-existing conditions etc, would tend to make someone more connected to the nature of their healthcare
Honestly, why doesn't the govt just give everyone health benefits?
Govt is the cops. They are there to protect your rights. Not to be your mother and father, and take care of your needs.
You want some group to "give" you health care? Go ahead and form one. Nobody's stopping you. And figure out where the money is going to come from. Unless you plan to force doctors, nurses, pharmaceutical companies, and support personnel to work for free. Even then, where will those medical people's food and shelter come from? Going to force contractors, builders, grocery stores etc. to also work for free to support the doctors etc.?
How exactly did you plan for ANY group to "give" you health care?
Democrats already tried that, imposing Obamacare on the rest of us. Three things resulted:
1.) Most people were stripped away from the health care plans they had and could afford, and were penalized if they didn't switch over to the govt-approved plan.
2.) Costs began skyrocketing and never stopped.
3.) People began skipping needed medical procedures because they couldn't pay the huge deductibles Obamacare forced on them. Many of them couldn't afford any medical procedures at all. While the politicians crowed "now they have medical coverage".
Are you sure you want "govt to give everybody health benefits" again? No thanks, once was plenty.
Perhaps one downside of state healthcare, is that it doesn't provide any incentive for people outside of the profession to really talk about their healthcare, as things like deductibles, co-pays, premiums , pre-existing conditions etc, would tend to make someone more connected to the nature of their healthcare
Healthcare is front and centre in every Canadian election, federal and provincial.
The only disconnect, is that Canadians, for the most part, don't know the actual cost for the PERSONAL treatment. We know that tax dollars are spent, but not what a doctor actually bills. Of course, if someone is curious they could easily look it up I suppose.
Compulsory charity is great - if you're a recipient. Not so great if you're the one paying for it.
I don't see my tax dollars paying for all Canadians healthcare as charity, any more than I see my tax dollars going to pay for schools, roads, street lighting, sewers, etc.
It's not a charity if everyone is receiving the same benefit.
My proposal has been to impose a high federal tax on all such unhealthful products--booze, cigs, junk food, etc. We could also legalize all drugs and tax them heavily. Then earmark the revenue to provision of health care.
According to the CDC, 'chronic disease' accounts for 75% of US health care costs, almost all preventable through more healthy lifestyle. The advantage of my proposal is that those who generate the costs, pay for them (via excise taxes).
Let's face it the US electorate demands universal health care. Even Trump said during the campaign that any replacement of Obamacare would have to provide universal coverage.
I would be all for dismantling the welfare state, but in reality, it ain't gonna happen.
Because you will never get taxpayers to agree to allow a single mother working minimum wage to get treatment for her kids with chronic health issues while they are paying most of the taxes to fund such a program.
Healthcare is front and centre in every Canadian election, federal and provincial.
The only disconnect, is that Canadians, for the most part, don't know the actual cost for the PERSONAL treatment. We know that tax dollars are spent, but not what a doctor actually bills. Of course, if someone is curious they could easily look it up I suppose.
Quite different here, where it hasn't been an election issue for over 20 years - a right leaning government did look to implement moves that would have been a road to privatisation, but lost the next election due to their typically reliable conservative voters, abstaining from voting in quite large numbers.
People only really seem interested in the present single payer system, when it looks to be under threat.
Also, if the govt took away every rich persons millions/billions and invested all of it into health care that alone would take care of it.
For less than 18 months. Then all that money would be gone and the entire millionaire and billionaire class would be penniless.
What's your plan for the 19th month?
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