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He/she doesn't matter to me and it's the first time I've noticed your gender under your name. Ringo? Sounds like a guy's name to me. There are only three reasons that anyone supports illegal immigration, advocates for amnesty, balks at the enforcement of our immigration laws both on the border and internally, and resorts to name calling of the opposition. I had your agenda pegged from your numerous posts. You gave yourself away long ago.
Oldglory----When they have nothing in terms of valid counterpoints, they resort to personal attacks.
Just like the ubiquitous Republican hate ads currently infesting the air waves, you are quoting me - misquoting me - completely out of context. I never said that the asylum seekers were shining examples of patriotism and Christianity, that was the description I used for my own ancestors who came here in the 17th and 18th centuries.
Why do you twist my words for your own purposes?? Why resort to such falsehoods and fakery? Why do you lie?
Nor did I ever state that we should automatically admit those making their way north - not 7,000, that's the number who started out, there are no more than 4,000 at present, last I heard, perhaps fewer as more are turning back or staying put each day. There are likely to be far fewer in another six or eight weeks when the last stragglers make their way to the legal border entry points- why on earth are 15,000 troops needed to deal with such a small number of would-be legal asylum seekers, all of whom are civilians and many of whom are women and children? It's all political posturing on Trump's part, which should be crystal clear to anyone who takes the trouble to examine reality.
Obviously we need to deal effectively with the situation. I do not support open borders at all, why do you insist that I do? But sending 15,000 troops is a waste of money and human resources and is a transparent, blatant political effort to gin up Trump's base and affect the election. How dumb does he think Americans are?
If you have a valid argument, by all means, express it, but stop lying about what I stated. It doesn't help your case at all and only makes you look bad.
I'm not stupid you were making an analogy otherwise why even bring up your ancestors.? It has nothing to do with what's going on today. I also explained why. No words were twisted nor did I lie about anything!
How do you know what the final number of asylum seekers will be? All you are doing is guessing. Better to be prepared for the worse than to be caught off guard. As I said under another topic at the very least these troops are acting as deterrants to those who don't want to make that long trek with no likelihood of entering with that many troops there to stop them. You are being very naïve if you think that none of these people will try to enter illegally instead as they have done in the past. Our troops are being paid anyway so what's the problem? Better to have them protecting our own border than sitting on their thumbs somewhere.
Trump doesn't need any political posturing to retain his base. When we go to the polls we will vote the same as we did back in 2017. Just the same as the Democrats will. They won't be changing their votes based on this caravan. What a silly conspiracy theory.
I never said that you promote open borders. What I asked is why do the left object to the wall, want amnesty again, want to abolish ICE, object to most internal enforcement and back sanctuary cities then? Give me some other explanation for it then. Bet the left doesn't want the laws on asylum changed either even though taking in these thousands of people endlessly will be harmful to our own citizens.
What that means is that once you get to the Customs Building and get inside "to present your papers" -- You are already in the USA. When a group like this Caravan come then they are already on US Soil to claim "asylum" and they are coached and escorted by US Lawyers on how to do it.
Thanks for the clarification. It helped. My questin still is why couldn't it work like a US consulate? You can't just walk in to present your papers. The guard at the gate could refuse your entry and you'd be standing on the soil of whatever country you are in. Even if you get in and apply for asylum, you're not going to spend the night on embassy grounds. You have to go back out, I would think.
That will be up to them. As noted, many have turned back already or have chosen to remain in Mexico. By the time the remnant arrive, six to eight weeks from now, their numbers are likely to be even lower.
You know, it would make so much more sense for our government to support stability and democracy and economic opportunity in Honduras and Guatemala and the other "sending countries", so that people could live safe and productive lives in their own countries and not feel compelled to walk thousands of miles on the slim chance of admittance to ours, rather than to use this sad situation solely for political hay.
But this is Trump's doing, and he will not change. He is incapable of changing or doing the humane, logical, sensible thing. Instead, he's sending troops to the border and cutting off economic aid to Honduras...
Why people continue to buy his crap is beyond me. We need a better educated and informed populace in this country if democracy and basic decency are to survive, and I hope the next administration will make that a top priority.
I see, so it's up to our country to be the baby sitters of the world? How about the citizens of their country demand change from their governments? We already send those countries enormous amounts of money to help their citizens and it's been money down the drain, obviously.
Again, I ask why didn't most of them accept asylum in Mexico along with jobs for them? I never get an answer from you people. Why is that? How is this Trump's doing that these people decided to come to the U.S.? If anything he's been discouraging that since he's taken office. There is nothing humane, logical or sensible to the American people to have to take in the whole world's destitute! Certainly poverty isn't a reason to claim asylum.
And hey, bud, I'm a very law-abiding American and a direct descendent of a Revolutionary War veteran who spend the winter with George Washington at Valley Forge. He was seventeen years old that winter, and was a captain.
I also descend directly from (oh, shock, horror!) refugees. French folks, Huguenots who came here earlier, back in 1700 for religious freedom - actually, not just religious "freedom" but to save their necks from persecution unto death. The good English people established in the Virginia Colony saved their lives when they arrived, penniless and starving, without shelter, that cold December. Just like Jesus Christ advocated, they welcomed the strangers, fed the starving, clothed the naked. I had ancestors meeting the newcomers' boat, as well as ancestors sailing upon it. I honor them all.
So don't you dare call me anti-American. I honor my ancestors and all they stood for. That's why I speak out when I encounter those who would destroy all this country stands for and who know and care nothing about its roots, its founders, its standards, its traditions, and how it's supposed to work.
BTW, I vote. Every. single. election, I vote. How about you?
Okay
So...your ancestors came from Europe years ago. And...?
That doesn't mean that we should continue to allow illegal immigration to continue. Nor should we allow hyper immigration.
If I had to guess, you will say you care about the environment, no? Then you must realize that we don't have unlimited buildable land. Nor do we have unlimited potable water. Do you envision a country of 1 billion people? If so, ponder this --- India has over 1 billion people and Bangalore doesn't have enough potable water. Don't you want better for your descendants?
How is not allowing millions of functionally illiterate people into this country equate to "destroying" the US? We, as a nation, are deeply in debt. Meanwhile, we have homeless people, mentally ill people and veterans who aren't receiving proper care. These people come first and foremost. We owe illegal aliens nothing.
Then you bring Jesus into the conversation. Jesus told his followers to obey the laws of the land and to render unto Caesar that which is his. Illegal aliens do none of that.
Since you did bring Jesus into the conversation, then I take it that you have opened your home and your wallet to illegal aliens. How many do you have living in your own home and are feeding, clothing, sheltering and paying for their medical care? Did you also let them use your SSN? After all the law says it's okay if someone uses your SSN as long as they don't use your name with it.
If I had to guess, you live someplace where you haven't experienced the deleterious effects of illegal immigration. It's easy for you to insult those of us who have seen it up close and personal.
Times have changed since your ancestors arrived here. There was no country back then. Times have also changed since the turn of the 20th century. Back then, we had room to expand. Immigrants and Americans alike knew that it was sink or swim for them as there was no welfare. We were largely an agrarian and industrial society which meant that unskilled and illiterate people could make a living.
That will be up to them. As noted, many have turned back already or have chosen to remain in Mexico. By the time the remnant arrive, six to eight weeks from now, their numbers are likely to be even lower.
You know, it would make so much more sense for our government to support stability and democracy and economic opportunity in Honduras and Guatemala and the other "sending countries", so that people could live safe and productive lives in their own countries and not feel compelled to walk thousands of miles on the slim chance of admittance to ours, rather than to use this sad situation solely for political hay.
But this is Trump's doing, and he will not change. He is incapable of changing or doing the humane, logical, sensible thing. Instead, he's sending troops to the border and cutting off economic aid to Honduras...
Why people continue to buy his crap is beyond me. We need a better educated and informed populace in this country if democracy and basic decency are to survive, and I hope the next administration will make that a top priority.
Countries like Honduras and Guatemala have gotten untold millions in aid from the US. It hasn't done a darn thing because all the money gets pocketed by corrupt governments. And you want to throw more money at them?
You also know that currently there are other caravans forming. If we don't stop this current one, then even more will arrive.
So, what is it that you want? Do you want the BP to stand by and watch these people come into our country? Do you want open borders?
They're not walking "thousands" of miles. For large parts of the journey, they are getting rides. One of them fell off the back of a flatbed truck and was killed. Why repeat the lie that they are making this journey entirely on foot?
Do you really want all these people to come here and stay despite not being vetted? Remember---these are the same people who forced their way into Mexico and injured police officers. Would you volunteer to take some of these unvetted people into your own home?
To all those who are flipping out over the shoot to kill order falsely attributed to Trump, troops have a simpler tool at their disposal; the Concertina wire. I have to admit I had never heard of the term before. It can be rolled off the back of a truck laying down miles and miles in a single day. Let's see how the proverbial 30' ladder gets around it
Some blankets.
Any physical barrier can be overcome unless they are covered by armed troops. The only thing barriers accomplish is to keep the law abiding out or slow down those wanting to cross it. So, neither a wall nor wire will stop anyone unless guarded by troops with the ability to fire on those crossing.
So...your ancestors came from Europe years ago. And...?
That doesn't mean that we should continue to allow illegal immigration to continue. Nor should we allow hyper immigration.
If I had to guess, you will say you care about the environment, no? Then you must realize that we don't have unlimited buildable land. Nor do we have unlimited potable water. Do you envision a country of 1 billion people? If so, ponder this --- India has over 1 billion people and Bangalore doesn't have enough potable water. Don't you want better for your descendants?
How is not allowing millions of functionally illiterate people into this country equate to "destroying" the US? We, as a nation, are deeply in debt. Meanwhile, we have homeless people, mentally ill people and veterans who aren't receiving proper care. These people come first and foremost. We owe illegal aliens nothing.
Then you bring Jesus into the conversation. Jesus told his followers to obey the laws of the land and to render unto Caesar that which is his. Illegal aliens do none of that.
Since you did bring Jesus into the conversation, then I take it that you have opened your home and your wallet to illegal aliens. How many do you have living in your own home and are feeding, clothing, sheltering and paying for their medical care? Did you also let them use your SSN? After all the law says it's okay if someone uses your SSN as long as they don't use your name with it.
If I had to guess, you live someplace where you haven't experienced the deleterious effects of illegal immigration. It's easy for you to insult those of us who have seen it up close and personal.
Times have changed since your ancestors arrived here. There was no country back then. Times have also changed since the turn of the 20th century. Back then, we had room to expand. Immigrants and Americans alike knew that it was sink or swim for them as there was no welfare. We were largely an agrarian and industrial society which meant that unskilled and illiterate people could make a living.
I couldn't Rep you again but I agree.
The problem today V just a generation ago is that people wanted to assimilate into American society today not so much.
I used to live and work in a largely Brazilian community where most were legal and some were not and I saw a theme there. The young guys, in their 20's worked hard but put very little back into the community. Instead their plan was to send as much money back to Brazil as they could and they would eventually head back to live the good life. They packed the houses they rented to reduce the rent payment but they always had their satellite TV so they could watch shows and the soccer matches from back home.
The older generation say 30 plus put down roots in the community and learned our customs, language and they worked to become part of America.
I knew one guy that worked hard with his own business, became a US citizen, bought a house and then lost it all during the recession and had to move back to Brazil. One of the reasons he failed was that his fellow countrymen some of whom were illegal were able to undercut the jobs.
Times have certainly changed as have the temperament and desires of the immigrants to become ingrained in American society. This is evident in the mob that is approaching in the caravan that they are waving flags of their homeland. It is also evident in many communities across the nation where you can see other nations flags flying but Old Glory is not.
The problem with the new wave of immigrants is that they expect us to change and make room for them when it is they that should be adapting to our culture.
I don't think you understand how I think this is going to work.
They are not going to just let in 1,000's of people - they will process them individually ONLY at Port of Entry Facilities - those that might have a real "asylum" request will be admitted and processed.
I can see thousands of people lined up at a port of entry. It would almost make great entertainment value.
I used to live and work in a largely Brazilian community where most were legal and some were not and I saw a theme there. The young guys, in their 20's worked hard but put very little back into the community. Instead their plan was to send as much money back to Brazil as they could and they would eventually head back to live the good life. They packed the houses they rented to reduce the rent payment but they always had their satellite TV so they could watch shows and the soccer matches from back home.
Working hard is giving back to the community. And it's not like they're not buying stuff here. They will need food, clothes, gas, rent (shared, but they still pay), etc. How is sending money back home any different than someone saving money in a bank for example? Or investing in international money markets?
Quote:
Times have certainly changed as have the temperament and desires of the immigrants to become ingrained in American society. This is evident in the mob that is approaching in the caravan that they are waving flags of their homeland. It is also evident in many communities across the nation where you can see other nations flags flying but Old Glory is not.
The homeland flag waving can seem curious at first, but think about it. Lots of cultures cling to their homeland flags, even after immigrating to the US. I see Italian flags on cars all the time. And ever hear of St. Patty's day, Cinco de Mayo, etc?
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The problem with the new wave of immigrants is that they expect us to change and make room for them when it is they that should be adapting to our culture. What a mess.
Who cares if they hang on to some artifacts of their culture? Why is that a bad thing? I can guarantee if you got a job assignment in Taiwan for example, you'd darn hanging onto as much of your American culture as you could. Of course you would, it's only natural. Ask anyone what their nationality is and they'll tell you. Why? Because despite moving half-way around the world, we still want that little anchor to remind us of whence we came.
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There are only three reasons that anyone supports illegal immigration, advocates for amnesty, balks at the enforcement of our immigration laws both on the border and internally, and resorts to name calling of the opposition. I had your agenda pegged from your numerous posts. You gave yourself away long ago.
