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Old 08-12-2020, 01:17 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,759,378 times
Reputation: 9728

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I also find it funny when Christians and Muslims complain about a supposed lack of freedom of religion in China. Two religions that were spread with the sword and other forms of violence, killing millions of people that did not want to give up their own religions.

And it is totally ok for China to ask Chinese Christians to develop a Chinese form of Christianity. After all, European Christianity has also been adapted to Europe, for instance by hijacking pre-Christian festivity dates, including pagan stuff such as Santa Claus, believing in some female mother goddess rather than Jesus...

 
Old 08-12-2020, 05:45 PM
 
5,428 posts, read 3,501,841 times
Reputation: 5031
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
One can't become a member of a party in another country. I am not even a member of any party where I live. I don't even like parties, never went voting in all my life because I don't believe in the Western type of democracy.
There’s your problem right there. If you’re not even going to participate in elections, don’t complain about the outcome. You’re a European living in a European country. You’ve got more parties to choose from than an American has, so you have even less reason complain.

Look at Switzerland with their direct democracy. Works out great for most people.
 
Old 08-12-2020, 07:03 PM
 
8,943 posts, read 11,791,856 times
Reputation: 10871
How China steals technologies:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZNudcvdzXo
 
Old 08-13-2020, 10:03 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,759,378 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by Milky Way Resident View Post
There’s your problem right there. If you’re not even going to participate in elections, don’t complain about the outcome. You’re a European living in a European country. You’ve got more parties to choose from than an American has, so you have even less reason complain.

Look at Switzerland with their direct democracy. Works out great for most people.
That is not my point. I will not be blackmailed into the democratic system with that silly phrase in blue.

I am against democracy with parties and elections altogether. There are parties that share some of my thoughts, but I don't want them to win and force their views on everyone else. I am against the tyranny of the majority. Out of fairness, I even prefer a system where the population has nothing to say, like a good kingdom, and I am not talking about silly fake kingdoms like the UK, mind you.

And I like the idea of 5-year plans based on direct feedback and suggestions from any citizens, without the involvement of any political parties, like in China now. Since political parties only make sense if there are more than one, I don't consider the communist party a party, but simply a platform including all of society.

Political parties were a horrible invention.
 
Old 08-13-2020, 10:18 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,759,378 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidt1 View Post
How China steals technologies:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IZNudcvdzXo
Without having watched your video, product copying and pirating didn't start in China, it is the invention of the hotbed of crime that is Hong Kong, a city that the west feels oh so much pity for now that China is finally starting to clean up that mess, those poor innocent CIA/NED-funded pro-democracy protesters, boo hoo

"Today, China is everyone’s favorite whipping boy for copied or fake products, but these began their lives in Hong Kong, not in Mainland China and, while the factories may indeed be in China, the owners are now and have always been in Hong Kong, shifting their factories across the border for easier access to lower-cost labor when Hong Kong reverted to China. Even today it is easily possible to buy all manner of fake and copied Western products on the streets in Hong Kong, while the Western media have not a word of criticism. The hypocrisy is deafening."

https://www.transcend.org/tms/2019/1...rward-to-2019/
 
Old 08-19-2020, 01:33 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,759,378 times
Reputation: 9728
An interesting article on the organ-harvesting accusations:

https://thegrayzone.com/2019/09/30/r...lt-falun-gong/


Like with the other accusations against China, the mainstream media irresponsibly limit themselves to parroting what dubious sources such as anything but independent NGO's, radical ideological individuals with an agenda, and organizations such as the Falun Gong cult feed them. Not a trace of investigative journalism, with very few exceptions.

Transplantation experts, however, agree that the transplantation of organs from executed prisoners and people who had not agreed to allow transplants after their death already ceased to take place about a decade ago. Current numbers are in line with other countries that have the know-how to perform transplants. Experts know for instance because of the sales of immunosuppressant drugs that the recipients of organs have to take for life.
 
Old 08-19-2020, 02:01 PM
 
Location: Chicago Area
12,687 posts, read 6,740,882 times
Reputation: 6594
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
An interesting article on the organ-harvesting accusations:

https://thegrayzone.com/2019/09/30/r...lt-falun-gong/


Like with the other accusations against China, the mainstream media irresponsibly limit themselves to parroting what dubious sources such as anything but independent NGO's, radical ideological individuals with an agenda, and organizations such as the Falun Gong cult feed them. Not a trace of investigative journalism, with very few exceptions.

Transplantation experts, however, agree that the transplantation of organs from executed prisoners and people who had not agreed to allow transplants after their death already ceased to take place about a decade ago. Current numbers are in line with other countries that have the know-how to perform transplants. Experts know for instance because of the sales of immunosuppressant drugs that the recipients of organs have to take for life.
When a first hand account is a dubious source then obviously, nothing will ever be good enough for you.

Now there's the obvious, "where there's smoke, there's probably fire" stories like this one: https://www.nationalreview.com/corne...stem-in-china/ So we have a woman from Japan request a heart transplant in China. It takes them just 10 days to find four hearts. How does that compare to the United States, where organ harvesting definitely isn't a systemic problem? In the United States, the average wait time for a heart is 144 days. The population of the United States is 1/4 that of China, so it might be reasonable to expect that China can find a single donor heart in 36 days. Finding four genetically compatible hearts in just 10 days beggars credibility. That's a case of a whole lot of smoke, but not definitive proof.

Then you have the fact that Uyghurs and Falun Gong practitioners die mysteriously and regularly in the concentration camps they're detained in. When their families ask to examine the bodies for incisions that would indicate their organs were harvested, they are flatly refused such access to the bodies. More smoke hinting there there most assuredly is a fire.

Then you have the firsthand accounts:
https://endtransplantabuse.org/the-s...vesting-video/
https://www.foxnews.com/world/organ-...vivors-victims
https://www.agenda21radio.news/2019/...inas-military/

Is it possible that it's all massively coincidental and that the first hand witnesses are all liars? It would require a ridiculous number of fortunate coincidences, but maybe it's possible. All that China has to do to dispel all the rumors and allegations is give free and unfettered access to independent outside organizations. Let them see the prisons and camps where the Uyghurs and Falun Gong practitioners are being held. Open the books on all organ transplants. China flatly refuses such access. They know they're guilty. Everyone knows it.
 
Old 08-19-2020, 02:47 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,759,378 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by godofthunder9010 View Post
When a first hand account is a dubious source then obviously, nothing will ever be good enough for you.

Now there's the obvious, "where there's smoke, there's probably fire" stories like this one: https://www.nationalreview.com/corne...stem-in-china/ So we have a woman from Japan request a heart transplant in China. It takes them just 10 days to find four hearts. How does that compare to the United States, where organ harvesting definitely isn't a systemic problem? In the United States, the average wait time for a heart is 144 days. The population of the United States is 1/4 that of China, so it might be reasonable to expect that China can find a single donor heart in 36 days. Finding four genetically compatible hearts in just 10 days beggars credibility. That's a case of a whole lot of smoke, but not definitive proof.

Then you have the fact that Uyghurs and Falun Gong practitioners die mysteriously and regularly in the concentration camps they're detained in. When their families ask to examine the bodies for incisions that would indicate their organs were harvested, they are flatly refused such access to the bodies. More smoke hinting there there most assuredly is a fire.

Then you have the firsthand accounts:
https://endtransplantabuse.org/the-s...vesting-video/
https://www.foxnews.com/world/organ-...vivors-victims
https://www.agenda21radio.news/2019/...inas-military/

Is it possible that it's all massively coincidental and that the first hand witnesses are all liars? It would require a ridiculous number of fortunate coincidences, but maybe it's possible. All that China has to do to dispel all the rumors and allegations is give free and unfettered access to independent outside organizations. Let them see the prisons and camps where the Uyghurs and Falun Gong practitioners are being held. Open the books on all organ transplants. China flatly refuses such access. They know they're guilty. Everyone knows it.
Funny sources. Did you read my link? The ETAC is explained there, a shady organization.

It is not coincidence, no, it is an orchestrated media crusade against China.
And many "witnesses" have their own agenda, many are paid by the NED, CIA and similar organizations and do lie, yes. There is even a term for that, atrocity propaganda, read it up. There have been absurd cases again and again.

After all, there are also radical right-wing Chinese people, some of them exiled, who love to thrash their own country. They are not unlike Cuban-Americans in Florida.

You accuse the Chinese government, but prefer to believe the Falun Gong people that believe that modern science was invented by aliens as part of a scheme to take over human bodies; or that feminism, environmentalism, and homosexuality are part of Satan’s plan to make us into communists; or that race-mixing severs our connection to the gods.

China's organ donation system is rather transparent these days, it has been thoroughly reformed by Huang Jiefu over the past 14 years.

There are no concentration camps for Uighurs and Falun Gong. That nonsense has been fabricated by Adrian Zenz most of all, an evangelist fundamentalist from Germany, who claims god chose him for fighting China. He has miraculously transformed from a nobody into a pseudo-expert on Uighur matters.
Have some of those people been locked away in jail? Probably, and since there is a lot of radicalism among those people, rightly so. After all, there were terrorist attacks in China. The Chinese do nothing else than the US locking away and even torturing civilians in Guantanamo and elsewhere.
 
Old 08-19-2020, 02:58 PM
 
1,881 posts, read 1,011,705 times
Reputation: 1551
Quote:
Originally Posted by blahblahyoutoo View Post
Have you ever been to china? what city did you go to? what are your personal thoughts based on first hand accounts?
Most Trump voters on this forum have never left the country... I can promise... Of course now they'll all lie on here and say they've been all over to me because its an anonymous forum
 
Old 08-20-2020, 09:58 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,759,378 times
Reputation: 9728
A new article on the Western anti-China propaganda machine's working and the scum behind it:

https://thegrayzone.com/2020/08/18/u...ed-coda-story/
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