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Old 12-29-2020, 07:42 AM
 
5,938 posts, read 4,700,933 times
Reputation: 4631

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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post

Removing HISTORY is idiocy.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_E_Lee

Nope. That history is still there. Still in history books too. Not sure what you are talking about.

 
Old 12-29-2020, 08:29 AM
 
73,028 posts, read 62,634,962 times
Reputation: 21936
Quote:
Originally Posted by webster View Post
Actually industrialization in the south after the Civil War resulted in a new form of slavery: convict leasing. By passing a host of Jim Crow laws, Blacks were arrested and unable to pay bail or fines, were leased by the government to businesses ranging from factories, to the railroads to farms. Convict leasing was huge, hundreds of thousands were swept up into the system.

Slavery by Another Name: The Re-Enslavement of Black Americans from the Civil War to World War II is an excellent read. Its also available as a video.
The elites of the South were not willing to let go of slavery. They had to be dragged out of it kicking and screaming. Convict leasing and Jim Crow laws were a last gasp of the old plantation system. Industrialization did not bring about an end of slavery. Industrialization came after slavery was abolished.

I think about Birmingham's steel industry. One thing to understand about steel is that it requires coal. One way of getting that coal in the beginning was the use of convict-lease labor.

Convict-Lease System | Encyclopedia of Alabama
 
Old 12-29-2020, 08:53 AM
 
73,028 posts, read 62,634,962 times
Reputation: 21936
So far, no one has come up with a good reason for me to want those Confederate statues to stay up. No one has been able to change my mind. And someone needs to come up with something better than "It's part of history". Why should I, as a Black man living in 2020 America, be in favor of Confederate statues staying up, knowing that a major part of the Confederate cause was to keep the institution of slavery? As someone who would rather die than be enslaved, someone needs to come up with a better reason than "it's part of history" or "life wasn't all that bad for slaves(life was bad for slaves)".
 
Old 12-29-2020, 08:57 AM
 
73,028 posts, read 62,634,962 times
Reputation: 21936
It's not just Richmond removing Confederate statues.

Washington,DC.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ElvdrnrPYQ

Lexington, VA.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR18KTPba8I
 
Old 12-29-2020, 09:20 AM
 
Location: Minneapolis, MN
10,244 posts, read 16,377,717 times
Reputation: 5309
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell View Post
Still arguing the politics of the day I see ---

Here's an idea, put "we are all Americans now" on the base of that Statue, then tear that bad boy down. That's what you're up to anyway.
I agree with you on the point that the history is valuable and should be preserved. I think the disagreement is the part about it being displayed “in honor” in public spaces part of the equation.

The statues should be removed from these spaces and placed in a Confederacy and Jim Crow museum. How’s that for a compromise?
 
Old 12-29-2020, 09:27 AM
 
Location: Barrington
63,919 posts, read 46,758,281 times
Reputation: 20674
Quote:
Originally Posted by dspguy View Post
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_E_Lee

Nope. That history is still there. Still in history books too. Not sure what you are talking about.
Germany eliminated the monuments and flags that honored Hitler/ Nazism. Neither it nor the world has forgotten the Holocaust, well except for the fringe of Holocaust deniers and those who believe in those values.
 
Old 12-29-2020, 09:37 AM
 
Location: Nowhere
10,098 posts, read 4,091,461 times
Reputation: 7086
Quote:
Originally Posted by Veritas Lux Mea View Post
ignorant insecure hillbillies seem to enjoy racism. they feel better about themselves. people who have self esteem and average iqs dont need to pick on people.

these guys are a dying breed
To me (and many others) the real ignorant, insecure, violent, are the BLM terrorists going around burning down cities and stirring the racial pot.


And if you want low IQ (by average), look them up. I can assure you it isn't we whites who represent the lowest IQs in this nation.
 
Old 12-29-2020, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Bronx, New York
4,437 posts, read 7,675,690 times
Reputation: 2054
A man who took an oath, at West Point, to protect the US, "against all enemies, foreign and domestic," becomes the supreme military leader of the largest rebellion against the US, ever! And folk want to defend him! Go figure!
 
Old 12-29-2020, 09:50 AM
 
46,963 posts, read 26,005,972 times
Reputation: 29454
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell View Post
Still arguing the politics of the day I see ---
Of the 1850s and 1860s? Most certainly I am. And I even manage to separate articles discussing the legality of secession from documents describing the slave states' motivation for secession. The latter being s ubject you seem very unwilling to touch on, for some reason.

But sure, some lady in the South taught her slaves to read.
 
Old 12-29-2020, 10:10 AM
 
4,192 posts, read 2,512,816 times
Reputation: 6573
Quote:
Originally Posted by scatman View Post
A man who took an oath, at West Point, to protect the US, "against all enemies, foreign and domestic," becomes the supreme military leader of the largest rebellion against the US, ever! And folk want to defend him! Go figure!
This is the oath officers took from the 1830's until 1862:

"I, _____, appointed a _____ in the Army of the United States, do solemnly swear, or affirm, that I will bear true allegiance to the United States of America, and that I will serve them honestly and faithfully against all their enemies or opposers whatsoever, and observe and obey the orders of the President of the United States, and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to the rules and articles for the government of the Armies of the United States."

https://history.army.mil/html/faq/oaths.html
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