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So you’re saying you’d run up to an armed guy and try to wrestle his gun from him even though he’s had plenty of time to shoot you and hasn’t and the guy with the gun should just give it up and assume you won’t shoot him with it?
I believe many posting comments are are deniers. I believe most who side with Arbery here and the sentencing of the 3 would NOT have run up to the armed guy and tried to take it from him.
I believe most here that suggest Arbery made the right decision would in fact not have done what he did. Arbery died due to a lack of common sense/logic/intelligence. His stupidity got him killed. And double standards and today’s crazy times got those 3 whites life sentences.
3 whites doing the same to one white “jogger” would have in no way resulted in 3 life sentences.
Another fact which isn't talked about is that the younger McMichael had law enforcement experience.
Travis McMichael had spent 9 years in the U.S. Coast Guard, where he had held the rank of boarding officer. This is a maritime police officer. He knew how to wield guns; he had been trained, and he knew how to hold a long gun in such a way to assert authority but in a way whereby the barrel of the long gun is aimed towards a direction that makes it impossible for a person standing in front of him to be struck if the trigger is pulled from that position.
That is called "port arms." At port arms, the long gun is wielded diagonally; the buttstock is pointing down to the right while the barrel points up to the left (if the person is right-handed). Anyone who has ever seen videos or even movies depicting the military has seen this position.
At no point before Arbery ran towards and then approached Travis McMichael did Travis switch from port arms to the barrel pointing at Arbery. As a former maritime law enforcement officer, McMichael most assuredly knew that to point a gun at another person, even if unloaded, is felony assault outside of a legitimate self-defense scenario.
This is why Arbery was able to grab the shotgun with both hands; a shotgun, like a rifle, is a long gun; it's a thin and lengthy contraption. Had McMichael been pointing AT Arbery, it would have been more difficult for him to place both hands on it immediately. The shotgun was held sideways; Arbery was able to grab it just as a person lifting weights can grab a barbell with both hands when doing a military press or a bench press or a deadlift.
Any active-duty and retired law enforcement officer in the U.S. today will regard a civilian's attempt to forcibly wrest away the said police officer's service pistol from the police officer's possession as a crime and likely as an effort to kill the said police officer. The said police officer would be legally authorized not only to fight off the civilian but to fire at the civilian if/when the said police officer succeeded in acquiring full physical possession of the firearm from the hands of the civilian on grounds of self-defense.
Why does this principle not apply to the effort Arbery made, with punches to Travis' head, to take away the shotgun away from him? If he had succeeded and then fired at McMichael, would any of you who so adamantly believe Travis McMichael did commit first-degree murder have the same conviction towards Arbery's actions? Because on C-D, some posters have rationalized Arbery running at a shotgun-wielding man as an act of desperate self-defense because he was being "hunted down."
Or would you who agree with the verdict on grounds McMichael chased Arbery down to murder him have said ARBERY legally acted in self-defense?
Last edited by Sprawling_Homeowner; 01-10-2022 at 11:55 AM..
I just watched the raw video on You Tube and saw how he ran from the right side of vehicle around the front where a person had opened the door and gotten out, he probally could not see the gun till he came around.
Travis was standing on the driver's side, Arbery ran towards Travis on the driver's side, Travis shows his shotgun and they start yelling at Arbery to stop, Arbery turns sharp to the right at the back of the truck, goes around the passenger side, then as soon as he gets to the front of the truck takes another sharp turn and runs directly towards Travis. By the time you see Arbery again he has both his hands on the shotgun.
Moreover, Gregory McMichael is in the back of the truck with a pistol.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VA Yankee
And if "one white “jogger”" was going through they would have never tried what they did...
Why wouldn't they have followed a white burglar/thief? Would Travis have let a white guy take his shotgun?
Travis was standing on the driver's side, Arbery ran towards Travis on the driver's side, Travis shows his shotgun and they start yelling at Arbery to stop, Arbery turns sharp to the right at the back of the truck, goes around the passenger side, then as soon as he gets to the front of the truck takes another sharp turn and runs directly towards Travis. By the time you see Arbery again he has both his hands on the shotgun.
Moreover, Gregory McMichael is in the back of the truck with a pistol.
Why wouldn't they have followed a white burglar/thief? Would Travis have let a white guy take his shotgun?
The mental gymnastics in this thread are unreal.
I watched the video called raw footage which show Aubrey running from the right across the front of the truck, the audio is not that clear. As I said to the other poster would you have the same clarity that time and replay presents after being chased down, I don't think so.
And they wouldn't follow a white person because they would assume that they live there, what do you think...
I believe most here that suggest Arbery made the right decision would in fact not have done what he did.
I don't think anyone is suggesting it was a rational choice. It's just that it doesn't excuse the criminals one single bit. They brought a firearm with them as they were committing a crime.
Quote:
Arbery died due to a lack of common sense/logic/intelligence.
If a mugging victim goes for the gun and dies, is that the mugging victim's fault? Or the mugger's?
I watched the video called raw footage which show Aubrey running from the right across the front of the truck, the audio is not that clear. As I said to the other poster would you have the same clarity that time and replay presents after being chased down, I don't think so.
And they wouldn't follow a white person because they would assume that they live there, what do you think...
If it had been a white man instead of a black man showing up on surveillance footage 5 times, and if it had been a white man known as "The Jogger" by local business owners for coming in, grabbing merchandise, and taking off.... I don't see why the McMichaels wouldn't have been concerned.
You are attributing race as the primary or at least as one of the primary reasons the McMichaels went after Arbery when he was spotted in broad daylight, yet again lurking about than unfinished house, on the day he died. Yet again he ran off. The burglaries that had happened, the comments by Satilla Shore residents on that FB page they created to discuss recent burglaries, the notoriety Arbery built for himself for repeatedly shoplifting, not to mention the night when he was confronted by Travis McMichael, upon which time McMichael went inside his house to get a firearm (for self-defense) because Arbery's body language was hostile (if I'm not mistaken he spoke threateningly to McMichael), to the extent local police commended the McMichaels' efforts to protect their neighborhood.....
If none of this matters to you but race does, then do exercise intellectual honesty and admit to yourself that certain crimes only bother you when the perpetrator and the victim are from certain races. Or do you get worked up when blacks assault, pummel, and even kill Asians? If it had been white people attacking blacks the way blacks have done to Asians numerous times for almost 2 years (and it happened aplenty beforehand, but it got some media coverage since early 2020), would you have been any more upset?
If yes, then you are that which many attribute to the McMichaels - you judge others and situations primarily according to race.
Ahh, couldn't remember. Been a while since I discussed this case... From your video...
Gregory McMichael = "He was trapped like a rat, I think he was wanting to flee and he realized that he wasn't going to get away."
Officer Roderic Nohilly = "Yeah, but he could have run around your son right?"
Gregory McMichael = "Sure, sure."
Officer Roderic Nohilly = "What I can tell in the video, I mean the whole road is there."
Gregory McMichael = "Oh yeah, and he was much faster than Travis would ever be. He had opportunity to flee further. We had chased him around the neighborhood a bit but he wasn't winded at all."
So the good-ole-boy contradicted himself. We're talking two cars vs. one terrified man on foot. Sounds like McMichael was unhappy the fun ended so quickly.
...to the extent local police commended the McMichaels' efforts to protect their neighborhood...
That would be the same local police who looked at events and said "Nah, not worth making any arrests over", right? Perhaps you may not want to hold up their judgment as a yardstick for - well, anything.
That would be the same local police who looked at events and said "Nah, not worth making any arrests over", right? Perhaps you may not want to hold up their judgment as a yardstick for - well, anything.
This from the poster who made a statement about online posters knowing more than judges. Do you know more than police officers who were there?...
Status:
"Let this year be over..."
(set 23 days ago)
Location: Where my bills arrive
19,219 posts, read 17,095,590 times
Reputation: 15538
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sprawling_Homeowner
If it had been a white man instead of a black man showing up on surveillance footage 5 times, and if it had been a white man known as "The Jogger" by local business owners for coming in, grabbing merchandise, and taking off.... I don't see why the McMichaels wouldn't have been concerned.
You are attributing race as the primary or at least as one of the primary reasons the McMichaels went after Arbery when he was spotted in broad daylight, yet again lurking about than unfinished house, on the day he died. Yet again he ran off. The burglaries that had happened, the comments by Satilla Shore residents on that FB page they created to discuss recent burglaries, the notoriety Arbery built for himself for repeatedly shoplifting, not to mention the night when he was confronted by Travis McMichael, upon which time McMichael went inside his house to get a firearm (for self-defense) because Arbery's body language was hostile (if I'm not mistaken he spoke threateningly to McMichael), to the extent local police commended the McMichaels' efforts to protect their neighborhood.....
If none of this matters to you but race does, then do exercise intellectual honesty and admit to yourself that certain crimes only bother you when the perpetrator and the victim are from certain races. Or do you get worked up when blacks assault, pummel, and even kill Asians? If it had been white people attacking blacks the way blacks have done to Asians numerous times for almost 2 years (and it happened aplenty beforehand, but it got some media coverage since early 2020), would you have been any more upset?
If yes, then you are that which many attribute to the McMichaels - you judge others and situations primarily according to race.
If the McMichaels had any legitimate concern they would have reported it to law authority and let it go from there. Nothing in his behavior was illegal, creating a danger for anyone and he was jogging so what a surprise that he "ran off".
Any background of the victim was not know at that time and has no bearing on anything. Race is a factor from a black man running in a white neighborhood to the local police who did nothing because the bubba trio was there friends so spare me all the random examples and deflections to things that don't apply.
So far this year in my city of Indianapolis there have been 7 murders. All black on black or black on white. What makes this case so special to get this much outrage, coverage, and attention?? What a waste of time and energy.
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