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Old 03-21-2010, 10:41 PM
 
Location: Imaginary Figment
11,449 posts, read 14,412,278 times
Reputation: 4777

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Quote:
It’s hard to exaggerate the magnitude of the disaster. Conservatives may cheer themselves that they’ll compensate for today’s expected vote with a big win in the November 2010 elections. But:


(1) It’s a good bet that conservatives are over-optimistic about November – by then the economy will have improved and the immediate goodies in the healthcare bill will be reaching key voting blocs.


(2) So what? Legislative majorities come and go. This healthcare bill is forever. A win in November is very poor compensation for this debacle now.
Quote:
But we do know that the gap between this plan and traditional Republican ideas is not very big. The Obama plan has a broad family resemblance to Mitt Romney’s Massachusetts plan. It builds on ideas developed at the Heritage Foundation in the early 1990s that formed the basis for Republican counter-proposals to Clintoncare in 1993-1994.
Quote:
We followed the most radical voices in the party and the movement, and they led us to abject and irreversible defeat.


There were leaders who knew better, who would have liked to deal. But they were trapped. Conservative talkers on Fox and talk radio had whipped the Republican voting base into such a frenzy that deal-making was rendered impossible. How do you negotiate with somebody who wants to murder your grandmother? Or – more exactly – with somebody whom your voters have been persuaded to believe wants to murder their grandmother?

Quote:
For them, it’s mission accomplished. For the cause they purport to represent, it’s Waterloo all right: ours.
Waterloo | FrumForum
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Old 03-22-2010, 01:18 AM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,897,598 times
Reputation: 15037
Read and weep!
"The Obama plan has a broad family resemblance to Mitt Romney’s Massachusetts plan. It builds on ideas developed at the Heritage Foundation in the early 1990s that formed the basis for Republican counter-proposals to Clintoncare in 1993-1994."
So much for socialism
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Old 03-22-2010, 01:23 AM
 
Location: Beautiful Niagara Falls ON.
10,016 posts, read 12,518,788 times
Reputation: 9025
Hopefully this is just the first crushing defeat of the wingnuts who claim to be conservatives but in reality are just nut bars.
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Old 03-22-2010, 01:31 AM
 
23,653 posts, read 17,408,504 times
Reputation: 7467
Wait until Nov. Then we will see defeat like none other. Dems going down to defeat. But then they won't need to worry since they didn't put themselves on universal health care.
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:52 AM
 
Location: Imaginary Figment
11,449 posts, read 14,412,278 times
Reputation: 4777
Quote:
Originally Posted by janelle144 View Post
Wait until Nov. Then we will see defeat like none other. Dems going down to defeat. But then they won't need to worry since they didn't put themselves on universal health care.

You still don't get it. Do yourself a favor and read the article written by a conservative. The author has been saying the same thing I've been telling you guys since before the last election. The entire point is that the right lost by following the hysteria and lies preached by their talking heads yet again. Even a victory in November will mean little compared to this win today.
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:55 AM
 
Location: The Woods
18,332 posts, read 26,355,074 times
Reputation: 11328
A victory in November means this bill can be repealed. No law is forever. I think it's also highly probably the courts will strike this bill down or at the minimum gut it.
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:55 AM
 
Location: Imaginary Figment
11,449 posts, read 14,412,278 times
Reputation: 4777
Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
Read and weep!
"The Obama plan has a broad family resemblance to Mitt Romney’s Massachusetts plan. It builds on ideas developed at the Heritage Foundation in the early 1990s that formed the basis for Republican counter-proposals to Clintoncare in 1993-1994."
So much for socialism
It's nothing of the sort and they knew it. Bush's expansion of Medicare was more "Socialist" then anything Obama even got close to. In the end the Republicans lost big by embracing the loons of the party: The Becks, Rushies, Hannities, Bachmans, tea bigots etc. FINALLY some conservatives are waking up to this fact. The question is if they will listen or not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
A victory in November means this bill can be repealed. No law is forever.
I'm sure Obama would let that happen...Just as the article says: I'm also sure the GOP will be able to sell increasing the prescription drug price on seniors, or stripping the health care away from your 24 yr old, or allowing preexisting conditions to get reapplied to children etc. You're dreaming if you think any of that will happen. All the new laws going into effect immediately will reach millions of people right away. The Republicans would have to run a campaign on taking those new things away from them, and then Obama would have to sign it into law.
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Old 03-22-2010, 08:59 AM
 
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
3,390 posts, read 4,929,303 times
Reputation: 2049
Quote:
Originally Posted by SLCPUNK View Post
Wow. You spent a lot of time on this... Happy are ya?
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Old 03-22-2010, 09:05 AM
 
Location: The Woods
18,332 posts, read 26,355,074 times
Reputation: 11328
Quote:
Originally Posted by SLCPUNK View Post
It's nothing of the sort and they knew it. Bush's expansion of Medicare was more "Socialist" then anything Obama even got close to. In the end the Republicans lost big by embracing the loons of the party: The Becks, Rushies, Hannities, Bachmans, tea bigots etc. FINALLY some conservatives are waking up to this fact. The question is if they will listen or not?



I'm sure Obama would let that happen...Just as the article says: I'm also sure the GOP will be able to sell increasing the prescription drug price on seniors, or stripping the health care away from your 24 yr old, or allowing preexisting conditions to get reapplied to children etc. You're dreaming if you think any of that will happen. All the new laws going into effect immediately will reach millions of people right away. The Republicans would have to run a campaign on taking those new things away from them, and then Obama would have to sign it into law.
The majority are opposed to being forced to buy insurance. The bill doesn't prevent insurance companies from jacking up the prices of insurance either. This is a bailout for the insurance industry. Once reality sets in and people realize they aren't suddenly going to have free healthcare now, even some supporters will turn on this.

The courts also will care little about public opinion when they start cutting this to pieces.
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Old 03-22-2010, 09:09 AM
 
11,973 posts, read 31,624,552 times
Reputation: 4641
For a repeal to happen before 2013, the GOP would need to get a 2/3 veto-proof majority in both the house and senate in the November elections. That's just not going to happen. And people who think that courts are going to strike this bill down are dreaming.
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