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Old 07-27-2023, 06:44 AM
 
Location: Upstate
9,525 posts, read 9,848,359 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
I think you put Herbert on those Chiefs teams, he has ABOUT the same success of Mahomes.

Jackson? No. Because the backup would have played so many games.

Mahomes has certainly benefited from those around him. Every QB does, but, Mahomes supporting cast has been top notch.
I agree, but one of the great talents of Mahomes is his ability to extend plays. Haven't seen Herbert match that ability, but it could also be due to the quality of players around him.
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Old 07-27-2023, 01:19 PM
 
78,545 posts, read 60,737,570 times
Reputation: 49859
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turnerbro View Post
He's gotta be top 5 atm. My top 10 QB list would probably be.

1. Patrick Mahomes
2. Joe Burrow
3. Jalen Hurts
4. Josh Allen
5. Justin Herbert
6. Trevor Lawrence
7. Aaron Rodgers
8. Lamar Jackson
9. Geno Smith
10. Jared Goff

Those last two are surprising but I think it's accurate.
IDK, he was in a 4 way tie for 8th in TD's and had the 10-12th highest passer rating.

His numbers in 2022 were roughly in line with Cousins (vikes).

Oh well, let's see what happens but I don't like ranking a guy top 5 without seeing something more substantial first.
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Old 07-27-2023, 01:23 PM
 
78,545 posts, read 60,737,570 times
Reputation: 49859
Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
I think you put Herbert on those Chiefs teams, he has ABOUT the same success of Mahomes.

Jackson? No. Because the backup would have played so many games.

Mahomes has certainly benefited from those around him. Every QB does, but, Mahomes supporting cast has been top notch.
I fully appreciate the value of "the team", especially the O-line and having a TE like Kelce.

That being said, I think that's quite a projection of herbert's success.
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Old 07-27-2023, 02:49 PM
 
17,616 posts, read 15,317,330 times
Reputation: 22966
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
I fully appreciate the value of "the team", especially the O-line and having a TE like Kelce.

That being said, I think that's quite a projection of herbert's success.

You can't prove me wrong. lol.
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Old 07-27-2023, 05:36 PM
 
1,999 posts, read 984,706 times
Reputation: 1504
Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
I think you put Herbert on those Chiefs teams, he has ABOUT the same success of Mahomes.

Jackson? No. Because the backup would have played so many games.

Mahomes has certainly benefited from those around him. Every QB does, but, Mahomes supporting cast has been top notch.
Yes, there is no QB in football history that has won without playmakers around him. It's just not possible because it is such a team effort.

Mahomes has Andy Reid who is a top coach. Herbert hasn't had that sort of leadership. But this year the pressure will be on the Chargers because they have all the pieces for Herbert to be successful.
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Old 07-29-2023, 11:38 PM
 
6,329 posts, read 3,625,247 times
Reputation: 4318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Labonte18 View Post
Things I'll say


1) Regression from Daniel Jones. Giants miss the playoffs.

2) A better year for the Broncos, but, they still miss the playoffs

3) The Lions win the NFC Central.
1. Disagree here. If he regresses anymore, he will be bad. He was very much just average or just good enough. Should not be difficult at all to have a repeat performance of 2022. More likely he gets better rather than worse IMO. But the Giants playmakers besides Saquon are not that great but that was also the case last year so that shouldn't prevent him from repeating his 2022 performance.

3. EVERYONE is all in on the Lions. I have a suspicion the NFC North will be one of the tightest division races between Packers, Vikings and Lions. Could be a toss up. I would love to see the Bears get into the mix as well but they might have one of the weakest rosters in the entire league. Fields would have to make a Hurts like jump in year three but the Eagles vs. Bears rosters are night and day different.
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Old 07-29-2023, 11:49 PM
 
6,329 posts, read 3,625,247 times
Reputation: 4318
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turnerbro View Post
He's gotta be top 5 atm. My top 10 QB list would probably be.

1. Patrick Mahomes
2. Joe Burrow
3. Jalen Hurts
4. Josh Allen
5. Justin Herbert
6. Trevor Lawrence
7. Aaron Rodgers
8. Lamar Jackson
9. Geno Smith
10. Jared Goff

Those last two are surprising but I think it's accurate.
Hurts is too high. I'd put Allen, Herbert and Rodgers ahead of him.

Especially Allen. Give me the guy who has done it at a high level for three straight seasons now over the player who has done it for just one. Plus, no QB other than perhaps the 49ers QB's have had a better roster on both sides of the ball than Jalen Hurts. Hurts is good but he needs to do it for at least one more year before I can put him in the top 5.
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Old 07-30-2023, 10:28 AM
 
1,999 posts, read 984,706 times
Reputation: 1504
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill the Butcher View Post
Hurts is too high. I'd put Allen, Herbert and Rodgers ahead of him.

Especially Allen. Give me the guy who has done it at a high level for three straight seasons now over the player who has done it for just one. Plus, no QB other than perhaps the 49ers QB's have had a better roster on both sides of the ball than Jalen Hurts. Hurts is good but he needs to do it for at least one more year before I can put him in the top 5.
I agree. Allen is at least a top 3 QB. Maybe Mahomes, Burrow, Allen or Mahomes, Allen, Burrow.

AFC East is much stronger than NFC East. Allen has beaten tougher defenses and tougher opposition. He has to play Miami twice, the Jets twice, and you can't count out New England even though they have regressed, but still a strong defensive club.
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Old 07-30-2023, 10:34 AM
 
1,999 posts, read 984,706 times
Reputation: 1504
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill the Butcher View Post
1. Disagree here. If he regresses anymore, he will be bad. He was very much just average or just good enough. Should not be difficult at all to have a repeat performance of 2022. More likely he gets better rather than worse IMO. But the Giants playmakers besides Saquon are not that great but that was also the case last year so that shouldn't prevent him from repeating his 2022 performance.

3. EVERYONE is all in on the Lions. I have a suspicion the NFC North will be one of the tightest division races between Packers, Vikings and Lions. Could be a toss up. I would love to see the Bears get into the mix as well but they might have one of the weakest rosters in the entire league. Fields would have to make a Hurts like jump in year three but the Eagles vs. Bears rosters are night and day different.
Honestly I'd take Fields over Jordan Love of GB. Vikings lost Dalvin Cook, so I wonder how much that will impact them.
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Old 07-30-2023, 11:35 AM
 
6,329 posts, read 3,625,247 times
Reputation: 4318
Quote:
Originally Posted by sluggermatt15 View Post
Honestly I'd take Fields over Jordan Love of GB. Vikings lost Dalvin Cook, so I wonder how much that will impact them.
I like Fields a lot. On potential I would take him over all the starting QB's in the NFC North. He has breakout potential like Hurts. The problem is from top to bottom the Bears roster is really weak. How can a player breakout with no real help around him?

His year last year reminded me a bit of Josh Allen's rookie year. A one man show and every win they had was because of Hurts exceptional athletic ability. Josh Allen was surrounded by garbage on offense his rookie year. In year two the offense brought in Beasely and John Brown and he took a big step up. Then a massive step forward when they brough in Diggs in year three.

I don't think the Bears have made the same additions to the roster to help Fields along. Not that high on Claypool.
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