Gary Olsen's "Master Path" - anybody familiar? (Mormon, prophet, create)

[FormerChela]

What does gary do that "harms"?

MANY THINGS!!

I know I'm just one persons experience, but that man instilled me with so much fear. Took so much money from me, exploiting my desire for truth and God. Put 4-5 years of my life into an unimaginable hell. Believing he's real and hearing his voice ring in my head telling me I'm "the walking dead" without his path. Telling me to suffer, now that I'm off. When you really believe gary is god incarnate, what he says can have a profound impact on the psyche. It might sound petty from my brief description, but it's not. I can't imagine a worse feeling than wanting truth and God, but feeling damned and rejected, helpless and alone, without even blessings to help one get through the ugly grey world(gary makes it out to be) or "dumpster"(as gary calls it) of pinda(physical plane). For someone who gary has completely convinced; life without MP is pure "doom gloom". Instilling that kind of fear, is severly harmful.

He's lieing about his position and mission, that in itself, is extreemly harmful. Light and Sound teachings have a tremendious potiontial to be exploited. Exploiting a teaching and using it for power, money.. or any other sick perversion, is beyond damaging.

One of his greatest harms, is to those who trust him but become dismissed from the path. As I've stated before, gary's 'loving' parting words include. "If you want to leave the path, fine, suffer!". "If you leave the path, you don't have my blessings!". "God doesn't even know you exist". Then there's my favorate one, "you are deluded IF you think you are on THE spiritual path if you are not on MasterPath!". As well as many more loving statements...

I know belief isnt a fact, but rather a best guess. I really believe there's truth in Surat Shabd Yoga teachings. Even though I also, in a way, know, through and through, that gary's a fraud. That the teachings he's using to exploit for his own sick gain, is something that will infact help some to a degree, based on it's original truth. Although, will harm many in the long run, as his actual guidance is ill and weak.

So you give $400 aprox per yr to MP Allen? With $360.00 per year in membership dues, that only leaves you about $40 a year you spend on MP? Right...

That means either 1 live satsang per yr(not even a full weekend), or 5-6 $6 audios or how about one LARGE $40 photo of gary to hang on your bedroom wall? $400 a year is aprox the absolute minimum to pay to be on MP, and basically means you almost never attend satsang, yet gary's going to give you an "irrovicable" 2nd initation.. why? because you've shown yourself to be a truly devoted student?.. Or because giving you an "irrevocable" initation might better ensure continued income from your pocket for years to come? I really can't imagine a true master initiating someone who never attends satsangs. gary's not a true master, so i guess anything goes.

After Allen pointed out my misperception of the tax forms, I realized something even more interesting. I concluded that there's not enough evidence to show any dues theft, but what it does show is that MP surpluses each year without donations. For example, as Allen said, 94% of the dues must be represented in Line 1d, which would equate to $482,000(in remaining dues income), which would mean only $223,000 was donated to MP that year. When looking at the yearly surplus. It shows MP made $464,826 extra that year. Subtract donations and they still made $241,826 surplus..


The same goes for almost every other year reported, infact some years suggest almost over $300,000 in annunal surplus(with Allens speculation), not including donations. Basically meaning, no-one needs to donate to the MasterPath for it to run. Also, no money donations are even used! They're just put into a bank account to collect interest off, rather than being used to more greatly 'spread the word'.. which seems to be MPs ONLY mission in actually helping humanity and life. Even with just that, they don't do it, they just bank a great % and never use it. Yet, gary likes to state "that not a penny is wasted". He's a fricken liar! The only thing donating to the MP does is allow the leaders to boost their salary aprox $10,000 per year and still make good profit for the Org.

I could be wrong,... but I think I once heard gary claimed to have been Sawan Singh, in his past life. A deciple of Sawan Singh was Julian P. Johnson, Julian P. Johnsons works were plagerized to make up over 70% of Eckankar's teachings, which in turn, made up a good deal of MP teachings. One thing Paul Twitchell didn't plagerize, nor gary, was a excerpt from the one of the most prominent books Paul copied his teachings from, a book written by Julian P. Johnson - The Path of the masters.

The un-copied or un-plagerized quote from Julian P. Johnsons - The Path of the masters is:

"Real Masters never charge for their services, nor do they accept payment in any form
nor in any sort of material benefits for their instructions. This is a universal law among
Masters, and yet amazingly, it is a fact that thousands of eager seekers in America and
elsewhere, go on paying large amounts of money for "spiritual instruction." Masters are
always self-sustaining and are never supported by their students or by public charity."

Why didn't gary include this quote in the part of his works that were copied from Julian P. Johnsons - The Path of the masters, with the rest of his plagerized teachings? Namely in conjunction with what he DID plagerize from Eckancar?(the question is rhetorical and sarcastic)


What does this quote really have to do with gary? Well, gary claims to have been the master of the deciple who wrote this quote, gary chose to closly rewrite or directally plagarize a lot of his works... supposedally his own deciples works. Yet he doesn't copy a very important quote that actually has the words "Universal law" included. Can I ask? What part of that 'universal law' does gary follow?

Since MP makes a surplus profit every year.. what in the world makes MP "non-profit"? Does gary in any way live up to this universal law he "himself" supposedally tought his proclaimed "own" deciple, Julian Johnson? NO! Yet I don't have to say that, the lust MP has for mega-bucks is self revealing.

Seriously.. MP is NOT,'non-profit', what they are is a 'non-ethical' tax-avoiders. Bringing in the Org., A LOT of
banked away, tax free, money, which is clearly visable in MPs 990 tax reports. Over $3,500,000!



About guru bhakti, I agree with it. I support it, but most of all, I'm very sensitive to it. The entire point of my original thread, was to point out how gary 'diverts' attention from his outer actions, bcz it would give him away as a fraud. If chelas see what a poor example, of simply a being kind human being, gary is, and how truly un-saintly he really is, his scam is over. As a supposed "true guru", shouldn't he be a prime 'living example'? I'd say he's very far, from being a visable, let alone a spiritual example.. he's a ghost! That was the point of my guru bhakti discussion. To point out that gary puts minimal focus on guru bhakti, and greater focus on christianity being a personality cult. In order to actually divert and keep the chelas from looking at gary too closly, as to ensure no-one finds he's not a "pure" living example at all.

When I read what Shakey said - "the outcome of any of it has nothing to do with whether or not gary olsen turns out to be some big scam artist or not. this path that i'm on isn't about him..... i am unconcerned for his human cause or effect." My jaw dropped. Simply because the masters cause and effect is a vital aspect of guru bhakti! Understanding the guru through all his/her actions, words and deeds. The living example! If the master cant even be a living example, then what is the real reason you think there should be a live guru to begin with? If he's not an example, he's equal to that of a book. How can we all be so dense?.. I was. I trusted gary, yet I equally knew there was something wrong with him. I now realize, I actually trusted the teachings, not gary.

Finally, the fact that gary and joy make around $200,000(projectivally almost a quarter million now in 2009) per year combined is crazy. Some say there's no universal chart to show what a guru should be paid or not, that's true. Yet, what he's paid can be compared to what all the other hard working MP employees make. Aprox $50,000 is the salary of most MP employees, a lot of which work 60 hours a week. That's their living, granted and determined by gary himself, so the question is. Why does gary feel he and his wife deserve and NEED 2x as much as almost all other employees? gary knows he can make a modest living, which he teaches that saints live, from a combination of $50,000 each to him and his wife per year like the rest of his staff. He's obviously very greedy, and apparently believes he deserves riches for his effort in "channeling God". Otherwise he would give himself the same as all other MP workers, who work as hard, if not harder the him.

On a final note: Allen was right about me conjecturing, then concluding. gary has caused me a great deal of suffering, my emotional reaction is to share with others what I now see and feel. It's not like me to assume or accuse, so what Allen said, effected me a lot, bcz he was right. I am sorry about that. I find myself putting out these posts, not for revenge, or prejudice or hate. I really have no desire to seek any revenge nor blindly sway folks from potential truth.

I share what I do here in hopes that some may be spared from the horror gary can put one through. Noone deserves the inner torment he put me through, and others I know. He exploits the most sensitive part of our being, for a gain that I'm beginning to think is more disturbing than I here-to-fore thought. Something much darker than the gain of money. Even though garys chosen amount of money to take for him and his wife each year, is enough to give away the truth of his materalism and greed. It shows he's not beyond worldly desires at all. Why does he need 100s of olive trees on his property as billions of ppl are dieing and starving from disease and poverty as gary and joy feed ONLY their desire for luxerys.

Do you know why many ppl dont eat meat, because to have that meat, an animal has to endure a type of suffering no living being should face. To eat meat is to increase and propetuate violence towards animals, especally commerceral produced chicken or viel. Most ppl don't like to hear this because they LOVE meat, although, everyone knows we live in an age where meat is no longer needed to live.

We dont have to farm and kill animals for food anymore, doing so IS violent. To eat chicken is to not care of the life that had to live in a ft. x ft. cage, with its beak and toes cut off, undergoing tremendious distress it's whole life for the sake of one meal for 1-2 ppl. That 'not caring' is an act of violence, especally when one is awair of how its manufactured. Is the suffering of another life, worth it for one 'tasty' meal? gary eats meat, so you know his answer. Why would a saint say the suffering of an animal is worth it for a good tasting meal? I really don't think a saint would say that. gary eating meat is a demenstration of his violent nature in action. gary is also the only guru ive known of to not examplify vegitarinism e.g. gary eating meat(by choice).

I know the vegitarism thing is a little off topic, but it's just one of the many many examples of garys un-saint-like behavior. Examples seem to be of major importance in this peticular descussion. So I'm stateing what comes to mind in that regard.

[shakey1]

i understand the words you speak. and i do not begrudge you your truth, your experience, i recognize that all experience is sacred, and purpose can only be determined by ones own self. i also understand that the context from which you speak is your own, not mine. and vice versa.

you, like me....understand the words i say, but you are left jaw agape by some of it (as i am with you) because your recognition of what i *mean* is limited by the attempt to relate to my words thru your context, not mine. and again...absolutely vice versa. for the record, i never make observations that do not also apply to myself.....and from that viewpoint, it also means of course, that neither does anyone else.

i guess i do not understand guru bhakti the way you do, end of faith. perhaps it is my failing, maybe i am arrogant in my blindness, but i am simply not attached, nor do i have any preference about whether gary is a god realized saint or the biggest fraud this side of blue cheese.

what i don't understand in trying to relate to your experience from the confines of my own personal context.....is the sense of victimhood i pick up on in reading your posts. perhaps you simply do not choose to share personal responsibility and accountability, which of course is fine, i am an extremely private person myself, and do not find it prudent or purposeful in sharing much about myself in such environment either....please......i am speaking gently, and mean no offense, and i certainly do not mean to imply that i can see anything in what you *don't* choose to share. as i said before and my continued point is.....it is my context, not yours that brings me to relate to your words as i do. i offer my own limitations as illustration for what i see in much of this thread, is all.

will you...can you? acknowldege the same?

the reason i feel the way i do about gary the saint or gary the fraud....is not because i am in denial. it is because even if he did turn out to be a fraud.....it would not have such power over me as to shake me to my foundation. i would feel no shame, no humiliation, no sheepishness, no betrayal, no victimhood for my choice of participation in this path. i am not duped, nor am i blindly enamoured....what i am.......is extracting so much value from the teachings, the way gary conveys these teachings......that my capacity to remain centered in self is strong enough to withstand even such a seemingly heavy blow. afterall, it would only be a blow to my ego attached belief system, not my true self and constitution. the first i shed willingly......daily if i am graced....joyfully....even tho it is so often excruciating.

if gary is somehow exposed in a manner that convinces me he is bastardizing these teachings, that's when i would leave this path, with no regret, no resentment and absolutely NO sense that i have wasted my time, energy or attention in pursuing any of this.

i am here because i find benefit. i experience the daily expansion of my consciousness in notable, tangible and demonstrable ways. i will not give up personal benefit of such magntitude for that which i percieve as trivial and worldly. i suppose it's a sign of my own selfishness, but i will not apologize for my devotion to what i recognize as truth in my continued spiritual unfoldment.


i fully accept that those with opposing viewpoints are entitled to the validity of their personal experience. i fully allow for the possiblity that gary is a sham. is that considered betrayal of the master? am i failing miserably at guru bhakti? according to the definition of some, surely i am a pathetic arrogant little excuse of a chela. arrogance and humility often appear to be in disguise as the other, ever notice that? it seems so obvious, doesn't it......plain as day, plain as the nose on your face.

then you find out the obvious isn't at all what is so immediately apparent, lol. well, probably just me again......am i really the only one that has to trip over the obvious to finally see it?

the truth that (you) continually try to point (me) to.....is out there. it may well indeed be truth, but only compared to some. as in all things "out there", that's not the truth i'm personally after or much interested in. i suppose that must seem incredibly naive and stupid to some, but i don't begrudge anyone who thinks so, or finds value in that kind of truth. value is yours to determine for yourself, as is mine for me. what you find value in is not necessarily where i find benefit. what i find beneficial may be something you find worthless. isn't that how it should be?

well....as per usual, i am found at the recognition that all is well, and as it should be.

perhaps masterpath is kindergarten, and those who shun it are truly the more spiritually advanced, wide awake ones. perhaps i should sit up and take more serious notice of the warnings. i freely submit i might have just fallen off the turnip truck yesterday. but who is so convinced they're in the drivers seat?

.....whilst looking back over their shoulder to watch the idiots like me fall off the back end, uh........btw, watch out for that tree, lol.

blessings to all, and thank you again for the richness of this vein.

[earthman]

Originally Posted by b. frank

It's more the "path to God" part that is troublesome. Sure, I could go to any kind of temple, church, meditation center or whatever and they would expect money. That's fine. But when the head of that place is an individual who himself (the individual) is an elevated personality and is receiving the bulk of the money (don't know if this is the case with Olsen although the elevated personality part is obvious) - then I see a problem. It is the combination of the factors that seems like a red flag - not just the money.

I can see why you would be exasperated. Really the "sign" is that the disgruntled ex-members are vocal in the first place. Why is that? Then when supporters try to emphatically deny the exs a web of unanswered questions is created. Have you ever followed a "debate" between a current Jehovah's Witness and an ex-JW? This thread is kinda the same thing.

A rational summary of this thread. B. Frank sums up my thoughts too

[allan1015]

Originally Posted by deepcynic

you are the one that happily pays $400 a month for something you would be able to get for free, if you only had a brain.

Its $400 a year, not month - just for accuracy

And no I couldn't get 'it' for free. What is it you think I could be getting for free?

[deepcynic]

Originally Posted by allan1015

Its $400 a year, not month - just for accuracy

And no I couldn't get 'it' for free. What is it you think I could be getting for free?

OK, I mis-typed on the month/year thing. You got me.

I get all of my spiritual peace for free, because I have a free and functional mind.

I suggest you read FormerChela's post carefully, especially the part about true masters not charging.

I get such a kick out of you and others that follow this 'path', to me it is just 'path'etic. How sad to be so needy as to have to believe in a person that claims such outlandish stuff! He is merely a man, a plagiarizer, hypocrite, user, opportunist and a sham.

Get a clue and stay tuned, it feels to me like he will be exposed soon.

[rememberingyou]

It is easy to be smug. To sit back and judge another’s suffering with religious and devotional language seeking to exalt one’s self at the expense of what one perceives to be another’s weakness…like referring to someone’s broken heart as “they are just acting like a spurned lover,” or pointing out with great holier than thou flair someone’s “victimhood.”

The only authentic response to suffering is to express to the one who suffers your sincere regret that they went through that pain. That is compassion.

Alan and Shaky you exemplify the biggest complaint from former members of Masterpath: that at the end of the day, there is no kindness there. Your consistent and accurate demonstrations of the man and the path that you defend speak volumes.

[shakey1]

end of faith and former chela, may i ask either/both of you for your thoughts/feelings please, on my last post.

altho i am at a complete loss at understanding how/why my expression has been construed as smug, unloving and/or unkind, i am not so arrogant as to dismiss rememberingyou's comments out of hand, either. perhaps it is a singular opinion that you do not even share, but if you do share it, then it is of concern to me, not for my own sake but for yours, as i have no wish to incite ill will, or cause injury.

i offer no clarification/defense at this time, since i don't follow, i don't even know how i would express clarification, or what purpose any defense would have, aside from balming and thus strengthening my own ego, which is about the only 'thing' i recognize is not in my own best interest. i suspect anything i might offer out of the bewilderment i feel at the moment would only fuel a fire i had no idea had melted the frying pan in the first place. i can offer nothing but a willingness to listen, and a promise to do so with open heart. but only if it is your choice to share, i have no desire to put anyone else in the hot seat either. my only wish for you is for what you wish for yourself. whether you choose to answer or ignore my request, please know that i will harbor no judgement either way, as i trust that you both will act in your own best interests as well.

good night and be well.

[rememberingyou]

When you label another’s experience, i.e. “your victim hood” and then pontificate how you would handle things in a vastly superior way, disregarding that the person you have just labeled is possibly suffering, that is arrogance. You ask where someone’s “accountability” is, assuming that the person has never asked the question of themselves.
What has bewildered you and stopped you in your tracks? You say that you don’t care if Gary is a fraud, but it is the leader of the group which the followers try to emulate. You emulate Gary with your words.

[shakey1]

thank you. i'm not sure i will be able to convey my point more accurately by repeating it, but here goes:

i certainly do not mean to imply that i can see anything in what you *don't* choose to share. as i said before and my continued point is.....it is my context, not yours that brings me to relate to your words as i do. i offer my own limitations as illustration for what i see in much of this thread, is all.


so your post strikes me as further illustration of my point. i tried to make it clear that i deliberately used myself as example, willingly putting my head on the chopping block here when i admitted openly that my perception of how i see other's viewpoints is a result of my own limitations, as is yours for you, his for hers and theirs for ours etc etc.

just because i may hold to my own point of view, i do my best to remember that it doesn't mean i am right. and so i am bewildered by the ridicule i find here, the name calling, the berating.....and the attempts to shame people for feeling and sharing what they do...these are simple observations.

in looking for the love/truth here, i am personally unable to find much that compels me in the posts/posters that choose to shame and ridicule others. entertainment and atta-boy bandwagon mentality that solidifies alliance and provides distraction....is certainly purposeful in degree, but why anyone who purports to expose the truth would choose that purpose....is indeed, bewildering to me. i dunno....perhaps it is balming to the pain and suffering others are feeling and that you believe i've disregarded. i wish i could say or do something to alleviate it, truly i do. i am sympathetic, but let's be honest...given the circumstances, given that i cannot relate outside my own very different context, realistically i can only aspire to not adding to anyone's pain. in my experience, healing is a process that leaves me stronger than i was before, not diminished and broken, and so if i can add anything to that healing end for anyone here, deliberately or waywardly, then perhaps i will be graced with the priviledge of having been of benefit to someone other than myself. given that ALL experience is valid, nothing is unclean of itself.....we are the ones that sully and tarnish..........it is up to the individual to extract that which is of value and benefit. i am as arrogant as anyone and everyone in this thread. but i am not so arrogant as to presume i know what is of value and benefit for anyone else but me.

[rememberingyou]

If you could learn to articulate in a complete sentence, it would help. Nothing you say is very clear or convincing. You seem to have a lot of the MP jargon and spin, but not much substance and certainly no ability to see the obvious. That being said, if in fact you get so much from MasterPath, just what is it that you are looking for on this forum? And given your statement that you "cannot relate outside of your own very different context," then I wonder if you can even see how God works in the hearts and lives of others different from yourself. You seem to be a walking paradox, and that too is a perfect representation of the MasterPath. I will disengage with you now as I do not believe my words will have any impact on you whatsoever, thus they are wasted. You do "defense" really well Shaky 1, crying "ridicule" and "shaming" when someone points out your emotional numbness. If you are feeling shame, then I gently suggest that you might have something that you are regreting, and that would be a human thing, a good thing actually. And I still wonder what you are doing on this forum. Voyer, maybe?