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I do not know for sure but I do believe at The Villages you get to play quite a few courses as part of the monthy dues but there is an additional charge for the premium courses (as listed). $18 to $26 additional is not that bad for top tier courses.
The brochure says "free golf on all of our executive courses (you may be able to use your own golf car for a nominal fee)"
You do have to consider if their is a CDD (Community Development District) bond on the property, which must be paid off like a mortgage. A number of 55+ in FL have these. I don't know about elsewhere. This is actually a fee paid by those who live in the community to pay off the developer for the expenses he incurred in building the community.
At the Villages I believe it's referred to as the Development District Assessment (avg=$192 per month; ranges from $97 - $448 per month)
I do not know for sure but I do believe at The Villages you get to play quite a few courses as part of the monthy dues but there is an additional charge for the premium courses (as listed). $18 to $26 additional is not that bad for top tier courses.
You can pay a priority membership; but everyone has to pay an additional 'trail' fee.
We arrived at the Villages for our lifestyles package. Our appt was for 10 am and don't be early you will wait. Our representative took us to a Villa accomodation. Before the ink was dry, the Sales person showed up; wanted to
take us on a tour and viewing. Many open houses daily. She then called us
everyday for five days. eh no pressure?
We did find out that we would never buy a villa; they are so close the first
night we were kept up all night by a party next door. But the house was nice.
Met many people in the pool - if you are the least bit friendly they will talk your ear off. It got so we'd be greeted as we walked in. Very nice. A number of
older single women were living in The Villages because there is no snow and
very safe. They do not participate in clubs.
Clubs range from basketweaving to archery to woodworking to pajama clubs.
Interesting. Over 1600 clubs to choose from. All with a fee.
There are invisible class divisions; the historic manufactured home side to the Miona Lake million dollar homes. The historic side has fewer fees.
Shops and restaurants everywhere; probably ones you know. A lot of people never leave the Villages. Boring.
However, The Villages is nearing capacity for the land they own. People are
buying houses like potato chips.
We were there at an off season; heard in season over 100.000 People and hugely busy like a metropolis.
Would I buy there? I dunno. And as BH says 'what happens when the infrastructure needs updating? A special assessment?
I do not know for sure but I do believe at The Villages you get to play quite a few courses as part of the monthy dues but there is an additional charge for the premium courses (as listed). $18 to $26 additional is not that bad for top tier courses.
"Top tier" in the context of the Villages? Or really "top tier" (I suspect you won't find the latter at the Villages)? Robyn
...And as BH says 'what happens when the infrastructure needs updating? A special assessment?
In Florida - all HOAs and condo associations are required to keep reserves to pay for anticipated future infrastructure needs. Of course - some HOAs and condo associations are better at doing this than others (and I don't know how The Villages stacks up on this score). I know we had a small increase in our HOA fees this year just to pay for increased reserve needs (the new reserve needs were established by a professional firm that specializes in this stuff). Special assessments typically are imposed when something unanticipated happens - like damage from a storm (insurance doesn't cover a lot of things - like damage to landscaping).
One concern I'd have with The Villages is who's responsible for maintaining the golf courses - and doing necessary infrastructure improvements. There are 30+ golf courses in The Villages. All need not only regular maintenance - but complete overhauls from time to time (and storm/weather damage cleanup even from something as minor as a really bad thunderstorm or a bad hard freeze). I don't think the courses at the The Villages are any great shakes - but they're probably not dumps either. A decent golf course can turn into a dump pretty fast if it doesn't get the TLC it needs.
Even though I play golf - I wouldn't buy into a HOA where I was required to pay anything to maintain a golf course as a condition of living in the HOA. My husband and I are currently non-equity members at a TPC facility - and we see what goes into running a world class facility. A ton of money - time too (one of our 2 courses is now closed for 2 weeks for regular summer aerification). Note that our membership is a pretty good deal financially - because golf tourists pay over $200+/round (up to about $400/round) to play golf at our club. Us locals get a good deal because we play all year (not only in high season) and are willing to put up with some minor inconveniences (like the facility was closed to the public for about 10 days during the Players a few weeks ago).
FWIW - north Florida has too many golf courses. It's not hard to find relatively inexpensive ways to play pretty good courses (and the ones that aren't very good are cheap as dirt most of the year).
Note that with CDD fees (and similar - regardless of name) - the developer usually borrows the money to put in infrastructure. The borrowing is usually done by the issuance of municipal bonds. The obligations on the bonds (principal and interest) are owed by whoever owns the land (sometimes the original developer - sometimes a sub-developer - sometimes a homeowner). I happen to hate CDDs - and wouldn't buy any property that's subject to one. I've written about this a fair amount on the JAX forum - and won't repeat myself here (people can search my messages). A fair number of CDDs in Florida are in trouble today due to the real estate bust. Here's one resource to do research:
Most are junk muni bonds (don't know about The Villages - or its financial structure for that matter). Which tells you something about the concept.
Note that you often have to do some digging to match the names of communities with CDDs with their bonds (for example - most of the bonds in Nocatee - big CDD here - aren't called Nocatee bonds - their first name is "Tolomato").
The brochure says "free golf on all of our executive courses (you may be able to use your own golf car for a nominal fee)"
"Free" assumes walking. Not using your own cart - or renting a cart.
For those who don't know - an "executive course" is usually a short 9 hole course that has mostly par 3 holes. With the occasional par 4 (or sometimes a par 5). I took a brief look at the Villages executive courses this afternoon. Many of the newer ones strike me as weird. They're really short - with lots of par 3s. OTOH - many have a fair number of forced water carries (not appealing to average golfers). And many have a fair number of "hazards" that are "environmentally sensitive" which you're not allowed to enter to retrieve errant golf balls. Now if I had to guess (and this is just a guess) - the developer is taking fairly marginal land (wetlands areas) and developing it into golf courses. And winding up with courses that won't appeal to anyone (not beginners - or average golfers - or good golfers either).
Anyway - if I were a golfer and interested in the Villages - I'd take a really close look at this. Perhaps rent for at least a month or two and play lots of the courses.
Also - I read that golf is super crowded in the winter snowbird season. Apparently - you have to pay some reasonably big bucks (I recall $80/per person per month - but it could have been $80/per couple) to become a "priority" golfer on the regular courses ("priority" meaning that you can make a tee time a week in advance - which is something most golf club members take for granted as part of their membership fees). I find this kind of weird because winter is low season in north Florida and you can usually find great golf deals here in the winter. Robyn
One thing about CDDs. Yes they are bonds, but they aren't something that is endless. They are usually for 20-30 years (which is a lot of time for retired people), but can be paid off in advance.
If you check on re-sales sometimes you see it stated that the bond has already been paid off. Apparently The Villages allows owners to pay off the bond all at once, therefore avoiding interest on it, or paying it off sooner. This is something that really helps to sell someone's house. So if you can find one of these, then you don't have to worry about the CDD.
Unfortunately, there are bonds associated with a lot of communities, and not just CDD ones. The one I live in has a 20 year bond to pay for infrastructure but also to pay for the new library building that the builder promised to the county to help "grease the palms" to get the approval for the community. We get the bill each year with our property taxes and don't have the option to pay it off ahead of time.
One thing about CDDs. Yes they are bonds, but they aren't something that is endless. They are usually for 20-30 years (which is a lot of time for retired people), but can be paid off in advance.
If you check on re-sales sometimes you see it stated that the bond has already been paid off. Apparently The Villages allows owners to pay off the bond all at once, therefore avoiding interest on it, or paying it off sooner. This is something that really helps to sell someone's house. So if you can find one of these, then you don't have to worry about the CDD.
Unfortunately, there are bonds associated with a lot of communities, and not just CDD ones. The one I live in has a 20 year bond to pay for infrastructure but also to pay for the new library building that the builder promised to the county to help "grease the palms" to get the approval for the community. We get the bill each year with our property taxes and don't have the option to pay it off ahead of time.
My friend who lives in The Villages told me that owners of homes which have the CDD paid off usually ask a higher sales price for their homes. So if I buy a home with the CDD paid off, I may end up paying for the CDD anyway thru the higher cost of the home for sale. I have viewed Villages re-sales on-line and they seem quite expensive for the square footage to me. Perhaps this is because the price includes the cost of the CDD...
The IRS is looking into the Villages reserves. They are apparently underfunded
and not labelled correctly. Can't think of the right word.
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