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I'm half-black and moving there in a couple months, and you're starting to freak me out.
I am full black, moving out there in 3 weeks and I agree this conversation is freaking me out as well. I have a young son, that hasn't experienced much racism besides the occasional school yard brat. He is already extremely upset about moving, I am really hoping that this will be a smooth transition for him. My brother currently lives in Southern California and swears that racisms doesn't exist in California. I knew that he was missing something.
Hello Urbanquest, I absolutely AGREE with everything you say man. I have been here for 10 years, and everything you say CONTINUES to happen to me as a black male living in the bay area. I live in Oakland. I am just trying to finish getting my education so that I can get OUT of this nutty place. The amount of **** that black men deal with out here is absolutely ASTONISHING. Black men are blatantly insulted out here and everything. I am a current college student who attends school at CSU Hayward, and man, the **** that I go through on that college campus from these ignorant ass other races--and self-hating black women--would turn your damn hair white. I mean black men out here are just seen as subhuman, and treated as such. Nobody cares about your ass out here. Everybody thinks that they are up above you; and I do mean EVERYBODY. Black women out here don't even like BLACK GUYS, and the only types of black guys that they will even talk to is thug n****s, so that brother better get used to that reality. If they don't want a black thug, most of them don't like black men AT ALL; no matter how good he is. They see black men out here who are trying to do something with their lives as COMPETITION. Black men are very oppressed out here.
Every black man I know who came here to the Bay from somewhere else wants to leave because of how racist it is towards black men. And if that cat thinks that he is going to have all of these options on women, he may as well forget it. Most women won't even date a black male out here; no matter how cute he is, or how well-dressed he is. I am just telling the truth. Women in the bay simply DO NOT LIKE BLACK GUYS. I have talked to black men who came out here from as far as Philadelphia and Texas. They have all said the same thing. Something is wrong with this place. It is like everybody out here has got something terribly against the black man out here. If you are anything else, you will have the time of your life; but not if you are a black male. I am here to tell you; and I am pretty nice looking guy. I should've never had the trouble and **** that I had out here.
The only reason why black women like it out here is because they encounter blatant racism far less and they have all of these other men chasing after them. He shouldn't ask a black woman what she thinks because she will only give him a perspective from her limited female view. The Bay Area is better for black women than it is for black men. That is the honest truth. I have even made YouTube videos about this place. There is not a day that goes by that I am not slighted horribly in some way by these *******s out here. These people on this thread are not telling the damn truth at all. They are trying to treat racism in the bay as if it doesn't exist; and they are lying. It is more racist than the damn south. I came from the south, and I NEVER experienced the things that I experienced out here.
It has not changed bruh. I have been here since 1997, and this place has got to be one of the most racist places I have ever lived; especially if you are a black male. I can't believe these people are trying to make this place out to be some liberal bastion. If that brother comes out here, he better get used to seeing people grimacing at his ass all the time and patting their pockets CONSTANTLY upon seeing a black man's face. He better get used to dealing with racist ass asians, arabs, indians, and whites. He better get used to seeing women RUN from him and all of this other ****. I am telling you; that's how it is out here. They only see black men under the guise of stereotypes; and that is the ONLY way they want to see black men. If you are anything other than what they think that you should be, they will try to FORCE you to be how they think you should be by insulting you, discriminating against you, and everything else; especially this 20-something generation we have now.
That brother better bring a woman with him, because unless he has got alot of money, he won't be getting one out here; I can tell you that. He may be able to get sex, but a relationship is a totally different matter entirely.
They are telling that brother LIES; and I really don't know why. If you are a black male, straight up, the bay area is NOT for you. You may not see it when you first get here, but you will soon enough. Let him stay for about a year or so; I am telling you. I thought the same thing when I first visited the bay area from Virginia; and now I regret the fact that I ever moved here. I have had experiences out here that were so bad that I have been going in and out of depression for 10 years.
It never ends man. It has been a real struggle living out here.
You speak the truth dude.
Later,
LET THE TRUTH BE TOLD WHITE WASHERS....
The crap I listed is just the tip of the iceberg of the racist/intolerant onslaught I had to endure in the Bay Area. Your bringing up of black women is something I totally forgot about. They obviously seem to notice how everyone else has jumped on the (crush the black man) bandwagon and they figure they better jump on it to or have to deal with it themselves. I pray that there could be a million man march leading from the Richmond District to the embarcadero (through the heart of chinatown and Russian Hill). Then continuing in Oakland right up the hill to Montclair ending with a gala at the Claremont Hotel. My Puerto Rican look was not known there and I suppose they thought I was a light skinned black or maybe even an illegal. LoLoLo... Black males need to either go all out and challenge every single messed up experience they have there with some serious volume, or maybe about a 1/2 a million to 1 million black men from the east coast need to roll up and teach respect. They would roll over those ignorant **** sticks in a second. I assume all the hurt egoes and absolute displacement of reality for the real racist pricks will cause some serious splash under the golden gate bridge. And I totally feel you when you talked about dealing with this crap with multiple instances on a daily basis. You almost dreaded what animalistic responses you would get on any particular day. Sometimes you had to ponder and even wager to yourself (racism today: 2 asians, 3 whites, 1 black female and the Mexicans are in their own world but if pressed have no problem expressing their hatred for those negros. Damn Bay Area, wtf...... Maybe you need some racial tolerance advice from the god ol boys in North Carolina.....
Oh, and btw, blacks have no problems in Bensonhurst in this day and age. I was just there and the Italian dude at the pizza place I ate was blasting rap music and flirting with a black women who came in. Full of Asians and Russians now anyway. (maybe only 1/3 Italian now).
I don't even know where to begin and I thought twice about responding because whatever I write I will most probably get slammed. I am a black woman, partly raised on the east coast with a very strong sense of self and family. I also grew up in San Francisco. I have 10 uncles and 1 brother who all happen to be black men, "full black", whatever the hell that means because in the United States nobody is pure anything, we're all mixed up. Anyway, I am not a black man and have no intention of trying to discount any of your experiences or the pain you have endured. I know you have experienced it. But to make blanket statements that all black women are this, all other people (fill in the blank) are that is just painting you as a huge victim. Are you a victim?
Varying degrees of this conversation I've heard before. You guys are just on here slamming all people and black women in particular for your experience. C'mon and please give me a break. I love black men, have a great deal of respect for them. My Dad was black so for me to think otherwise would be insanity. Pure insanity. You have had a handful or more experiences with black women out here and you are quick to lump everyone into the same category. If you're educated and going to college, I know you've taken some critical thinking courses. Now does that make any sense?
And I can tell you while trying not laugh out loud, black women do not necessarily have it better than anyone else. What planet are you living on? It may appear to be the case, but I can assure you it isn't and this would be the point of what I'm writing here. Damn I know it's hard. But I have friends who are asian, white, black, native american, latino, male, female, straight and gay who have experienced racism, discrimination, bulls***, hard times, you name it. It really has to do with like attracting like. If you continue to separate yourself and view all other people as having done something to you, you will continually attract this same energy and experience to yourselves. You view the world as racist and you have a certain disdain for black women who live here so that's what you're going to continue to experience. Over and over and over again. Yes, racism exists but you've made it part of your life and brought it completely into your consciousness. It's controlling you. Therein lies the difference. Until you wake up and see that humans are pretty much alike in most cases, you will continue to experience problems.
That is all I wanted to say. All I can feel is your anger and you're entitled to it, but it's clouding your judgement. I know you all are smarter than that. I know it.
Peace.
Last edited by redwoodlvr; 11-02-2008 at 10:04 AM..
While I would venture a guess that you will find racism everywhere you go, San Francisco is extremely diverse and generally accepting of everyone. My experience in the area has shown that personality is what makes you or breaks you around here. I work at a school, so it might not relate, but there is absolutely no "old boys network" or anything like that, folks are judged on merit.
Generally, I have found that while "seeing" San Francisco, you are mostly seeing tourists and urchins, not necessarily the general San Franciscan.
Good luck wherever you decide to go!!
Look, nothing personal, but your statement ,"here is absolutely no 'old boys network' or anything like that, folks are judged on merit." is laughably absurd. SF is awesome, but to imply that it's immune to the same nonsense as the rest of mankind is beyond the pale and SF'ers tend to be tolerant only of those who are only of the same mindset.
I don't even know where to begin and I thought twice about responding because whatever I write I will most probably get slammed. I am a black woman, partly raised on the east coast with a very strong sense of self and family. I also grew up in San Francisco. I have 10 uncles and 1 brother who all happen to be black men, "full black", whatever the hell that means because in the United States nobody is pure anything, we're all mixed up. Anyway, I am not a black man and have no intention of trying to discount any of your experiences or the pain you have endured. I know you have experienced it. But to make blanket statements that all black women are this, all other people (fill in the blank) are that is just painting you as a huge victim. Are you a victim?
Varying degrees of this conversation I've heard before. You guys are just on here slamming all people and black women in particular for your experience. C'mon and please give me a break. I love black men, have a great deal of respect for them. My Dad was black so for me to think otherwise would be insanity. Pure insanity. You have had a handful or more experiences with black women out here and you are quick to lump everyone into the same category. If you're educated and going to college, I know you've taken some critical thinking courses. Now does that make any sense?
And I can tell you while trying not laugh out loud, black women do not necessarily have it better than anyone else. What planet are you living on? It may appear to be the case, but I can assure you it isn't and this would be the point of what I'm writing here. Damn I know it's hard. But I have friends who are asian, white, black, native american, latino, male, female, straight and gay who have experienced racism, discrimination, bulls***, hard times, you name it. It really has to do with like attracting like. If you continue to separate yourself and view all other people as having done something to you, you will continually attract this same energy and experience to yourselves. You view the world as racist and you have a certain disdain for black women who live here so that's what you're going to continue to experience. Over and over and over again. Yes, racism exists but you've made it part of your life and brought it completely into your consciousness. It's controlling you. Therein lies the difference. Until you wake up and see that humans are pretty much alike in most cases, you will continue to experience problems.
That is all I wanted to say. All I can feel is your anger and you're entitled to it, but it's clouding your judgement. I know you all are smarter than that. I know it.
Peace.
Your points are really valid. If you look for it, you will find it and such. Having lived literally all over the country, I can tell you there is an absolute 150% difference between ALL and I mean ALL of the places I have lived and the San Francisco Bay Area. There is no comparison. I am just assuming here, but I am pretty sure the other poster and I are not on some masocistic quest to go out everyday and experience racism because it rules our world. On the contrary, If i was so paranoid I would move to someplace everyone looked like me, while I lavished in my prozac induced cloud of magical bliss. I wasn't looking for it out there, but it sure was lookin' for me and found me, over and over again. Perhaps naysayers can tell me instead of looking at it as them despising me, I should have seen it as them regarding me as a celebrity, thus their actions where merely anxiety in having to be in the presence of their perceptions of my being royalty. Black men need to either A. avoid the place like the plague
or
B. curse these bastards every chance they get and try to call on black men from elsewhere to move there in a call for support.
or
C. Hope that a big one hits and sends all those hypocrites straight to hell
BTW. I live in suburban NJ, in a white majority suburb which has a large asian presence and love it.....
BTW. I live in suburban NJ, in a white majority suburb which has a large asian presence and love it.....
Thank you Urban. I don't agree with you completely because I still see the victim energy in the arguments but point taken and I'm at least trying to understand.
I'm glad you're loving suburban jersey, which is where I was born. Now if you can live there you can live anywhere. I cannot. lol. Take care.
LET THE TRUTH BE TOLD WHITE WASHERS....
The crap I listed is just the tip of the iceberg of the racist/intolerant onslaught I had to endure in the Bay Area. Your bringing up of black women is something I totally forgot about. They obviously seem to notice how everyone else has jumped on the (crush the black man) bandwagon and they figure they better jump on it to or have to deal with it themselves. I pray that there could be a million man march leading from the Richmond District to the embarcadero (through the heart of chinatown and Russian Hill). Then continuing in Oakland right up the hill to Montclair ending with a gala at the Claremont Hotel. My Puerto Rican look was not known there and I suppose they thought I was a light skinned black or maybe even an illegal. LoLoLo... Black males need to either go all out and challenge every single messed up experience they have there with some serious volume, or maybe about a 1/2 a million to 1 million black men from the east coast need to roll up and teach respect. They would roll over those ignorant **** sticks in a second. I assume all the hurt egoes and absolute displacement of reality for the real racist pricks will cause some serious splash under the golden gate bridge. And I totally feel you when you talked about dealing with this crap with multiple instances on a daily basis. You almost dreaded what animalistic responses you would get on any particular day. Sometimes you had to ponder and even wager to yourself (racism today: 2 asians, 3 whites, 1 black female and the Mexicans are in their own world but if pressed have no problem expressing their hatred for those negros. Damn Bay Area, wtf...... Maybe you need some racial tolerance advice from the god ol boys in North Carolina
I would take a long visit here before relocating. I am just here to tell you. You may not see it at first. The Bay Area's beauty will fool you. You will be sucked in by all the diversity and all of that mess. You won't see anything at first. However, over time, you will immediately start becoming real tense living out here. There is a very tense vibe out here. People are always uptight. When you look to speak to people, most of the time, they ain't going to speak back to you. I am primarily talking about the East Bay where I have l lived.
After awhile, you will start beginning to see how others view black males out here; and you will start to look down on them. I know that doesn't surprise most people, but you will quickly see what I mean. You will start doing so yourself after awhile; it is just part of the Bay Area Culture.
The number of homeless black men out here, especially in Oakland, is just off the hook. I am just telling you the truth. Your biggest problem will probably be learning how to deal with other black women; because they are a trip out here. California black women are something else. I don't care for them at all. They are not like black women from the South. You might wind up very lonely out here too, because people in the Bay are VERY cliquish and to themselves. You have to be EXTREMELY extroverted to really make a way for yourself out here if you want to make friends and stuff; because people out here simply ARE NOT FRIENDLY AT ALL.
They are quick to latch on to you for what they need; acting like they are your friend, but when your usefulness has ran out, they will discard you faster than a old pair of shoes. That is just the way it is.
It is extremely rare to see a black family out here; much less a black couple. It don't seem like black men OR women like each other too much out here. It can really bother you after awhile. People say that is progressive due to all the IR couples but it doesn't really feel progressive to me when I can't even speak to the other half of my race without feeling like I am consorting with the damn enemy.
This is the only place where I have seen where you can have a damn enthralling conversation with somebody, and see that same person elsewhere, and they will act like they don't even know you; especially if you are black. It is very classist out here; and it has a racist Eastern feel to it from all of these immigrants coming over here from racist subcultures.
You will probably fare well; but not your son; particularly if he is a little black male. He may not encounter too many problems if he is little, but if he is a teenage boy, he is going to catch it out here. I am just telling you.
I think that black women have a much easier time out here than black men do. At least from my observation. Black men out here are TREATED AS CONSTANT OBJECTS OF FEAR. Like I said, as a black man, that kind of comes with the territory, but not like this though. The sneers and looks of disgust are a little ridiculous. The constant patting off the pockets, clutching of the purses, and **** just starts to get on your nerves after awhile. You realize these people aren't doing it because they are scared, but because they are trying to make you feel like a damn criminal. It's a way to keep you in your "n****r" place.
I rarely ever experienced that type of **** growing up in the south. However, the south was segregated. However, the whites still didn't quite act like they do out here. These California whites are racist as hell; but they try to feign like they aren't. They are racist as hell; trust me on that one. Don't even get a damn position up over these other races, or they will give you HELL if you are black.
Well, the good thing is, as a black woman, these men of other races have no problem running up on you. You can date a white man without getting too many looks or stares. I can't really gauge the motives of these other men, but you can date out pretty openly without getting too much crap from people.
Personally, I am sick of this fake liberal place. I have had it as black man living out here. And unless something really changes. I am gone, if I can SURVIVE long enough to get my damn degree without being overridden with anger.
Wish you luck.
Later,
It's sad to hear that things are that bad. I have actually come out there several times and traveled around to various areas. I haven't made it to the East Bay, though. I really didn't have any problems, besides an older Asian man trying to close the door on me at the IHOP. My son and I laughed it off because I just think that he didn't know I was behind him.
I actually will be going into a high level position. I have been in high positions before and although I have never experienced it first hand. I have been told by some of my black employees about my age bothering some of their white coworkers (I am sure my race was also killing them). Ofcourse they would never say anything to my face, as they know I hold their jobs in the palm of my hand. Whether they like it or not they will respect me at work.
I don't see myself ever looking down on black men. As a mother of a young black male, I am trying to build him up and make him a strong black male. There is no way that I would turn on my baby. As of today, I also don't see myself dating outside of my race, there is nothing like a black man. Although, I must say that during my visits I have only seen a handful of black men. So my choices may be limited...
Who's that? Does he like white people? I sure do, 1/2 my family is white and my wife is Asian and my son 1/2 asian. Oh yeah, he's that guy who mentored President Obama. My neck is definitely not that big though....
Hey, I guess I'm kind of late to this discussion, but I'm going to chime in with my 2c.
I am a native of the bay area (Richmond, to be precise), although I have not lived there for many years. I am a white female.
My experience is that people want very very much to be seen as liberal and open minded. They are quick to adopt whatever behavior shows they are totally hip, with it and 'down' to avoid being stigmatized as a racist or any other 'ist'. However, a lot of the time, this is a surface change only; people don't really take time out to examine their deep seated, often unconscious, beliefs and hurtful assumptions. They think that as long as they are acting correctly, that should be enough. Part of the problem is that they are so afraid of being racist that they do not have the strength to examine their own belief system; they might find out things about themselves that mess too much with their self image. Also, if you grow up there, you're constantly being told how wonderful and diverse it is, so its easy to be complacent.
I think a lot of white folks just assume (wrongly) they would never have anything in common with a person of african american descent, and so they just don't bother to engage. I know I have been guilty of this in the past.
Not everyone is like that, of course. And a lot of this problem is to do with the culture of the Bay Area itself. It's very classist, and there is a lot of competition wrt education and jobs and money.
I do think a lot of people, rather than raising themselves up through their own accomplishments, try to elevate themselves by putting other people and ethnic groups down.
I also think that young african american males tend to not have a good social network to support them in their endeavors, and so, in a competitive environment, they become easy targets.
I am not trying to say to the OP to not move there. There are some good people there, and it's a wonderful place. I miss it every day. But forewarned is forearmed. After a couple of months you'll be able to spot the haters and the idiots.
I hope that I am not speaking out of turn, and I also hope that nothing I've written is phrased badly or causes offense.
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As of today, I also don't see myself dating outside of my race, there is nothing like a black man. Although, I must say that during my visits I have only seen a handful of black men. So my choices may be limited... 
