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Old 04-13-2015, 10:51 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTDominion View Post
Of course the US would never openly behave as a hegemon in its official diplomatic statements.

That's why we speak in de facto terms. There's plenty to suggest between the lines of diplomatic protocol (for example, the extensiveness and persistence with which such advisories we're issued) that this was a failed concerted agenda to isolate the embryonic AIIB.

As for long term ramifications, only time will tell how this will influence the balance of geopolitics. To completely rule out potentially serious consequences for either the U.S. or its allies comes across as wishful thinking at this stage, though more likely than not we won't see any seriously adverse outcomes.
The U.S. might have tried to influence but failed, but I don't think they care afterwards. The European countries will only get a small fraction of shares and/or voting power in the AIIB as non-regional members can only have 30% of the shares. They will just be minor characters and will just be supportive of the Asian powers like China, India, Russia, South Korea, Indonesia, etc. They will certainly treasure their positions in the existing IMF/World Bank institutions where they hold apparently great proportion of shares.
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Old 04-13-2015, 12:41 PM
 
Location: United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daywalk View Post
The U.S. might have tried to influence but failed, but I don't think they care afterwards. The European countries will only get a small fraction of shares and/or voting power in the AIIB as non-regional members can only have 30% of the shares. They will just be minor characters and will just be supportive of the Asian powers like China, India, Russia, South Korea, Indonesia, etc. They will certainly treasure their positions in the existing IMF/World Bank institutions where they hold apparently great proportion of shares.
Maybe. The U.S. did try to join afterwards to my knowledge, at least to some degree in its own terms, though now that too was rebuffed or ignored, I guess all that it can do in terms of its public profile is maintain that it was never so important in the first place.
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Old 04-13-2015, 03:11 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
1,386 posts, read 1,559,895 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariete View Post
travric, everything you say is true, but what can we do about it? Nothing.
The change has to come from inside China itself. Moralising and waving fingers won't do it, as there's not a global force who could put enough pressure on her. So why not close our eyes and try to make some money?
Tell China no perhaps? Instead of accommodating them as much as we have would be a good start. Another thing the west could do is launch cyber attacks back at China every time it launches one which it has been doing for over a decade now with no one doing anything about it. In short the west could grow some balls in dealing with China. As far as not being able to put pressure on China goes yeah I don't buy that at all.
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Old 04-13-2015, 03:14 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerbalm1985 View Post
the AIIB has really exceeded all expectations.

I am not really surprised that Japan did not sign up but I would not say that the Japan PM is in a rage or anything.

I really don't see it as a fisaco for Japan; Japan is not as isolated as it really is; no matter what, it is still an enormous country.

i suspect the China AIIB would play a major role in the funding of the infrastructure of "One belt, One road" : the central asia new silk road and the maritime silk road; this is about the issuing of construction contracts for several thousand kilometeres of super-highways that are probably 12 lanes or more wider; an entire high-speed cargo rail network; hundreds of logistics hub and maritime ports.

However, many countries in the Asia-Pacific nation would still want Japan as a counter-balance force to China; the real interest is to have business opportunities and investment possibilities in China, while accessing the far superior technology (especially weapons technology) of South Korea and Japan.

That's if any of that actually gets built and that is a pretty big if. If a new silk road does get built it will take a decade or longer to do so since were talking about construction projects in several different countries and not to mention some of these countries don't have their **** together to be blunt.
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Old 04-13-2015, 03:20 PM
 
Location: Pennsylvania
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTDominion View Post
Maybe. The U.S. did try to join afterwards to my knowledge, at least to some degree in its own terms, though now that too was rebuffed or ignored, I guess all that it can do in terms of its public profile is maintain that it was never so important in the first place.
Do you have any proof the US tried to join this organization?
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Old 04-13-2015, 06:56 PM
 
Location: Singapore
653 posts, read 744,171 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwa1984 View Post
That's if any of that actually gets built and that is a pretty big if. If a new silk road does get built it will take a decade or longer to do so since were talking about construction projects in several different countries and not to mention some of these countries don't have their **** together to be blunt.
The maritime version is far more likely to be sucessful, much of the existing infrastructure is already in place. the land version in central asia has a far higher chance of failing thanks to unstable geo-politics.
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Old 04-13-2015, 11:23 PM
 
Location: United Kingdom
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cwa1984 View Post
Do you have any proof the US tried to join this organization?
U.S. Looks to Work With China-Led Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank - WSJ
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Old 04-13-2015, 11:58 PM
 
2,973 posts, read 1,976,145 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CTDominion View Post
Maybe. The U.S. did try to join afterwards to my knowledge, at least to some degree in its own terms, though now that too was rebuffed or ignored, I guess all that it can do in terms of its public profile is maintain that it was never so important in the first place.
Not sure what the U.S. Tried to do, but I don't think the U.S. should join the bank
It already has enough of these international institutions in which it is the major stakeholder. If the U.S. Wants to invest more it should inject more into these organizations first

Also, the U.S. Is also quite behind in infrastructure so it will be sensible for the U.S. To invest in its own infrastructure first
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Old 04-14-2015, 05:21 AM
 
Location: Finland
24,128 posts, read 24,817,796 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dunno what to put here View Post
Good point. The UK and France in any case cooperate very closely in military terms. With Germany, Italy and Spain, our military force would be far larger than Russia's. No doubt about it. People only tip toe around Russia because of its large nuclear arsenal. Remove that, and you are left with a country that isn't mightier or much bigger than the European powers.
And to add, the Russian army's stockpile is full of Cold War material, which the Western powers scrapped. The Russian military might have an impressive inventory, but that is filled with obsolete tanks and materiel which only would create traffic jams and be completely useless on a battlefield. The Russian army has some 700 modern BMP-3 IFV's, while small Sweden and Finland have together some 600 CV90's, which are newer. The rest of the Russian mechanised infantry relies on BMP-2's, which Finland had an option to modernise them or scrap completely. The Ukrainians have lost hundreds of these in the War in Donbass.

Russia has very impressive military technology, there's just isn't enough of material which could beat the big four of Europe, alone overwhealm the whole continent.
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Old 04-14-2015, 06:30 AM
 
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^
You know with that final assessment it does show that Russia apparently uses its military 'cards' to pretty good effect in small-scale military involvements and incursions. She does know how to maneuver among the powers.

China is also another country with great military capability that acts the same way as Russia. They have no compunction of pursuing their interest with vigor and backing it up with action.
It will be interesting if they pull the nuke option as Russia does to defend those interests. Seems to be a very good option. Keeps Europe and the West dancing to their tune.

At this time, both countries' defense budgets are going up. For them the time is ripe as Europe questions how much it wants to pay for defense.
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