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I think that what you said is really, really important and if there were mandatory classes for adoptive parents, this is a topic that should be discussed at length.
Why aren't there mandatory classes for adoptive parents to teach them about all the things that can come up when raising adopted kids, what to expect and how to handle it? Of course in the every day grind raising adopted kids is no different than raising any other kids but there are additional issues that may come up.
On the topic of gratitude - I watched a documentary on TV where a couple was picking up a 2-year old from an orphanage in Haiti and it seemed very clear that they had not received enough education on what to expect, how to handle it and how not to handle it and as a result their, especially the mom's, expectations were completely unrealistic and I found it very disturbing. This couple shows up at the door step of the orphanage and an employee comes out carrying the little girl. The mother lights up and goes over to grab the girl. The girl gets scared and starts crying, clinging on to the caretaker and wants nothing to do with this smiling stranger. It's a very typical response from a toddler when meeting a stranger. The mother, however, starts to cry and tells her husband that she thought this was a mistake as it didn't seem like the little girl wanted them. She had thought that she would be happy to be adopted and would greet them with open arms. Although she didn't say it it was clear that she was holding this against the baby. She had expected gratitude that these wonderful Americans were coming to take her out of this horrible orphanage in that horrific country. This woman had no understanding at all for the fact that she was a stranger and this was a toddler. Fortunately the dad was more reasonable and understood that the baby's reaction was due to the fact that she didn't know them.
This is something that should have been discussed beforehand though. The AP's should have been told what to expect and been aware that it may be rocky at first and not to hold that against the baby. They can't and shouldn't expect gratitude because they're taking her out of a bad situation.
My fear, with a mother like this one, would be that she would continue to have expectations of gratitude and would take any kind of misbehavior from the kid as a sign of ungratefulness and take it personally and that's a recipe for disaster. Shouldn't these kinds of things be addressed with all PAP's before adoption?
Sorry I don't have time to read the entire thread but this resonates with me.
Like the OP I think we all should be grateful for the good fortune we have in life. I grew up with a father who never missed an opportunity to tell us that everything we had was because he worked so hard to provide it. Gratitude became a dirty word to me and i certainly never used it with my children- adopted or bio. I did however asked them not to squander the good fortune they had by making choices which they knew went against how they were raised.
However, I have to say if somebody said that to an adopted child I would have to remind myself that adoption is still a big mystery to most people. they say things and ask things they don't realize are incredibly inappropriate or offensive. I used to be very strident about this but have mellowed over the years. If my adopted child came home and told me somebody said that to her I would explain it by saying she should not be any more grateful than her brother who is bio or any of her friends. We all should be grateful for our good lot in life and make the best of it.
I certainly was never offered any training or classes about parenting an adopted child. I read some books but believe me the agencies are not about to offer something which might cut into their profit margin. Now foster parents take 3 months of classes but not adopting parents.
Getting back to the grateful for being adopted - that contrived rigid belief and requirement placed on one segment of the population by another segment of the population - removes any of the true, beautiful, naturalness of the joy of gratitude - which must always be something freely given and from the heart - a natural response showing the value we place on the gift or action given to us back to the giver. Instead, that beautiful gift of gratitude is turned into a societal requirement that rings hollow, shallow in depth, valueless to the recipient, and because it is something expected, and required, from one group to another - it is an indebtedness that feels wrong and has no true value.
Can anyone see the difference?
Thanks for starting this thread Artful. I see the difference in telling someone they should be grateful when you are in a position of authority/power over that individual. This is unhealthy and will likely be unwelcomed by the person being told they should be grateful. I can see where resentment would set in.
I also see the difference in a child naturally feeling grateful and gratitude towards their parents, whether adopted or not, for genuinely loving them unconditionally and supporting them throughout their life. For being there, through thick and thin, good and bad times, and not abandoning them.
I am part of a blended family. I am the youngest, so my siblings have always just been, my siblings. No "half" prefix has ever been used between us or our parents. When my father married my mother, she already had four children and had been divorced. My oldest three siblings were very quick to remind him that he wasn't their father when they didn't get their way; or to be hurtful because he was the only father around to lash out at. They had a fantasy about their bio father. When they became of age, my father pushed my mother into arranging time for them to be with their dad; at first, her ex-husband said "no." Then, he dictated who he wanted to see first - he lived in another state - which was his firstborn son. After each visit, my siblings came back realizing how grateful they were to have a father. The one who was living under the same roof as them. It wasn't that their father was abusive; he was selfish, uninvolved, and insensitive. His love was very conditional. Also, he still did not want to be a parent, as evident with his two children in his second marriage. From that moment on, they ceased using the hurtful tactic of "you're not my father." Reality had set in, and they were grateful for the home that my parents were providing them.
I remember telling my parents (at one time or another) "I hate you!" or "I can't wait to move out!" I was a kid and a teenager. My friends and I all had similar sentiments about our parents at the time. I imagine with an adopted child, there is an added bonus, so to speak, of being able to throw in the biological parent remark. But the intent is the same: children don't control much of their lives and hurting a guardian/parent is a logical response to being angry about a situation they don't understand, a parental decision they don't agree with, or being hurt by someone they love. Words, for the most part, are the only power kids have against parents or authority figures.
I don't think APs should be made to feel any more guilty about their parenting mishaps than biological parents. And I think that what may come across on this forum is that APs or PAPs expect gratitude and gratefullness unconditionally from their children. I honestly don't believe that is what's being said. It's just that after being constantly 'tested' and perhaps having feelings of inadequacy early on as an adoptive parent (because society paints you as second-best and less than) that many feel that nothing they do will ever be good enough. There will always be those judging APs and PAPs a lot more harshly than our bio counterparts. Thankfully, many have family and friends who can share similar stories of childhood disobedience within biological families. I think more of this is needed. Seeing the similarities as opposed to focusing in on the differences.
As far as training for foster and adoptive parents, our county discussed how and why adoptive children may lash out; especially older ones. We were shown videos of what some kids say, one little girl, age 5, flat out called her foster mom a b**ch. That was her 'normal' considering her background. Sometimes, it has a lot to do with their past, but also, the social workers were quick to point out that some behavior is related to a child's developmental age, and not adoption.
Now, in the heat of the moment, I agree with others who have posted that it is hard to stay calm and not lash out as well. All parents make mistakes. There are parents whose style of parenting is to influence their children through guilt and manipulation. This may include forcing feelings of gratitude and gratefullness. I don't believe one segment of the population is targeted over another. I believe at the end of the day, it comes down to parenting styles.
My fear, with a mother like this one, would be that she would continue to have expectations of gratitude and would take any kind of misbehavior from the kid as a sign of ungratefulness and take it personally and that's a recipe for disaster. Shouldn't these kinds of things be addressed with all PAP's before adoption?
Good story. I guess these situations aren't always addressed with private adoptions. It may also depend on the state. But in all honesty, this mother may not have been helped by the training/information. She seems to be self-absorbed as she immediately took it personally and made it all about herself. I mean, the child is a two-year old. This is a stage of separation anxiety...quite normal as you point out. Thankfully the father is there to balance the emotions of the mother.
Quote:
Originally Posted by no kudzu
I certainly was never offered any training or classes about parenting an adopted child. I read some books but believe me the agencies are not about to offer something which might cut into their profit margin. Now foster parents take 3 months of classes but not adopting parents.
I never really thought about it because we are going through the state and Calif. policy is to first be cleared or licensed for fostering before you are approved for adoption. This is a new requirement though and I don't know if it applies to private adoptions. Having gone through the process, it makes sense to do it in this order, even when someone/couples never intend to foster.
It's just that after being constantly 'tested' and perhaps having feelings of inadequacy early on as an adoptive parent (because society paints you as second-best and less than) that many feel that nothing they do will ever be good enough. There will always be those judging APs and PAPs a lot more harshly than our bio counterparts.
Does society paint APs as less than or judge them more harshly? Most people usually assume APs are well-off, great parents, who are more capable of unconditional love & selfless. That's why so many people believe adoptees are lucky.
Also most people assume biological parents are more likely to abuse their children than adoptive parents, so it would seem to me that society judges bio-parents much more harshly than APs. I've actually seen people accuse adoptees of being ungrateful liars because they admitted they were abused by their adoptive parents.
Last edited by thethreefoldme; 04-26-2013 at 06:16 PM..
To avoid derailing an existing thread about something else - where gratefulness was brought up by two different posters - I thought it might be interesting to discuss the concept, and context, of being grateful and in general gratitude. I do believe that as humans we should all be grateful and appreciative for the good things we experience in life - from the small things like a beautiful day to the larger gifts bestowed on us throughout life and that gratitude is a natural response freely given and received in kind.
Yet, when it comes to the statement required from one group to another group - you should be grateful for being adopted - I cringe. That statement implies and requires a forced indebtedness - that comes with a heavy burden because it takes away from the spontaneous loving gift of gratitude, and turns it into something ugly, a repayment required which negates the loving action that would inspire the return gift of gratefulness.
Gratitude, or gratefulness for a good life to the family and friends surrounding you is a natural response to good things, and even in bad or challenging times happen - when the will to come back is still within you and you join forces and rebuild - you are grateful. True gratitude is something freely given in appreciation, love, thankfulness, and in joy. Just like love must be freely given, without condition, or demand - so must gratitude be something that comes from the heart.
I would imagine (hope) that we are all grateful and appreciative of the family and friends we enjoy in our lives. For the roof over our head, the education we have received. The love from others freely given to us. The fact that we live in a free society, and as such we have the freedom to do what we want (within reason and law), to travel, to choose professions, to be free to chose our mates, really any of the options we have every single day that would never happen in a restrictive society that exists in other countries.
Getting back to the grateful for being adopted - that contrived rigid belief and requirement placed on one segment of the population by another segment of the population - removes any of the true, beautiful, naturalness of the joy of gratitude - which must always be something freely given and from the heart - a natural response showing the value we place on the gift or action given to us back to the giver. Instead, that beautiful gift of gratitude is turned into a societal requirement that rings hollow, shallow in depth, valueless to the recipient, and because it is something expected, and required, from one group to another - it is an indebtedness that feels wrong and has no true value.
Can anyone see the difference?
Well said, Artful Dodger.
As you say, gratefulness is not something that should be expected, it needs to be given freely. I am grateful for my life, I am grateful for my family and for many other things. I am grateful in the same way that non-adopted people are grateful. However, I don't feel that it is up to others to imply that I should be grateful about certain things, it needs to be my choice.
Sometimes people can perhaps unintentionally make other people feel like they should be grateful. For example, if a person A is constantly told that other people are grateful about something, it can send the message to person A that they should be grateful as well.
I never really thought about it because we are going through the state and Calif. policy is to first be cleared or licensed for fostering before you are approved for adoption. This is a new requirement though and I don't know if it applies to private adoptions. Having gone through the process, it makes sense to do it in this order, even when someone/couples never intend to foster.
OT - I'm just curious, are there babies that are free for adoption through the state in California? I know in other states babies are usually legal risk placements and could go back to their bio family. Can you do a closed adoption of an infant in California or a closed adoption of siblings under age 5? How long is the wait for a baby through the state in CA?
OT - I'm just curious, are there babies that are free for adoption through the state in California? I know in other states babies are usually legal risk placements and could go back to their bio family. Can you do a closed adoption of an infant in California or a closed adoption of siblings under age 5? How long is the wait for a baby through the state in CA?
From what we have learned from the state, and others who've adopted from the state...
Short answer to all: Yes. And some are considered legal risk placements, but not all. With the state foster care system, TPR is usually involuntary, hence the adoption is closed. When it's voluntary, it is likely abandonment or done at the hospital at the time of birth. But closed today is really semi-open. With the state they don't enforce on-going communication between the adoptive and the birth families. Having said this, every situation is different and warrants a different approach to how open or closed the adoption is.
As far as the wait, it varies. Every county has different wait times. The pickier a person/couple is the longer they will wait.
Private adoptions are a different story.
Other things: It usually takes six months for an adoption to be finalized, but this is a separate process from TPR, which can take up to 18 months. Some infants and children fall outside of this however. So, there are several infant placements where the TPR and adoption aren't finalized until let's say age 1 1/2, but the baby could have been placed at 2-days old and may never have been at risk of being returned to the birth family. The state still has to follow the law though and all the legal proceedings. This example is one we were given during our classes.
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