MARTA News (Atlanta, Clayton: designs, interior, schedule)

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by SEAandATL

Well this is disappointing news even though I probably was never going to ride it myself, but just the principle of Atlanta/MARTA making it impossible to expand rail while other cities make it look so easy. Looks like we won't have any rail expansion this decade, and CRT ever. Even projects that are so close to reality end up not happening, like the MMPT (also because of NS not wanting to share their ROW).

Transit planning in the ATL is a multi-generational process. Things that are being discussed today are not for our own lifetimes or maybe even for our children to use. However, future generations may well continue these plans and studies, and 50-100 years from now it is conceivable that there could be some degree of implementation.

[SEAandATL]

Originally Posted by arjay57

Transit planning in the ATL is a multi-generational process. Things that are being discussed today are not for our own lifetimes or maybe even for our children to use. However, future generations may well continue these plans and studies, and 50-100 years from now it is conceivable that there could be some degree of implementation.

A scary and sad thought is that 50-100 years from now, or even 20 years from now, transit or lack thereof might become the least of our problems. It already felt that way during the pandemic which also may hindered transit expansion as teleworking has become the new normal, but now many companies are returning to the "suits and ties in the office" approach so now we have the traffic/transportation issues again.

[primaltech]

Originally Posted by arjay57

Transit planning in the ATL is a multi-generational process. Things that are being discussed today are not for our own lifetimes or maybe even for our children to use. However, future generations may well continue these plans and studies, and 50-100 years from now it is conceivable that there could be some degree of implementation.

Humans will colonize other planets before Jimmy Carter Blvd gets a MARTA station.

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by arjay57

Transit planning in the ATL is a multi-generational process. Things that are being discussed today are not for our own lifetimes or maybe even for our children to use. However, future generations may well continue these plans and studies, and 50-100 years from now it is conceivable that there could be some degree of implementation.

Lol. Sounds about right.

For what it's worth I have become more wary of heavy rail versus light rail, maybe all this time waiting will be a shift towards light rail. I like the fact that it can be high capacity and fast, but could be much quieter, without requiring big stations. In retrospect the only places the heavy rail is really appropriate is in downtown/midtown and the CBD of Buckhead. I am okay if they want to build more subway lines, maybe one under North Avenue, in West Midtown, and the Buckhead triangle. Maybe Cumberland and Perimeter Center if they keep developing in the same direction. Everywhere else it's noisy and the stations are excessively large and take forever to get in and out of...

[bu2]

Originally Posted by Gulch

I wonder if it would be worth it just to make it HRT.

I have always wondered about that project. MARTA heavy rail does not serve the area outside 285. This would open its use to the entire south metro. Commuter rail forcing a transfer simply would not have the same impact.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

Lol. Sounds about right.

For what it's worth I have become more wary of heavy rail versus light rail, maybe all this time waiting will be a shift towards light rail. I like the fact that it can be high capacity and fast, but could be much quieter, without requiring big stations. In retrospect the only places the heavy rail is really appropriate is in downtown/midtown and the CBD of Buckhead. I am okay if they want to build more subway lines, maybe one under North Avenue, in West Midtown, and the Buckhead triangle. Maybe Cumberland and Perimeter Center if they keep developing in the same direction. Everywhere else it's noisy and the stations are excessively large and take forever to get in and out of...

If you started from scratch, anybody but NYC, Chicago, SF and DC should do light rail. Its cheaper and more flexible. But when you already have the core like MARTA does, light rail either requires duplication or forces transfers which kill ridership. And much of the light rail planned is simply streetcar, in which case, you might as well just do a cool looking bus with nice colors. It would be as fast with a fraction of the cost.

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by bu2

If you started from scratch, anybody but NYC, Chicago, SF and DC should do light rail. Its cheaper and more flexible. But when you already have the core like MARTA does, light rail either requires duplication or forces transfers which kill ridership. And much of the light rail planned is simply streetcar, in which case, you might as well just do a cool looking bus with nice colors. It would be as fast with a fraction of the cost.

What if they did something big like convert the east-west line to light rail and made 5 points the transfer station? Then you'd have 2 core lines, one heavy and one light rail that you could build off of. Lindbergh could be the heavy rail yard and Avondale could be the light rail yard.

[T Block]

The difference between light-rail and heavy-rail is that light-rail goes on routes of tighter maneuvering, makes more transit stops, likely stops at red lights, possibly holds with traffic, and runs at lower speeds.

But light-rail running on city streets can be horrendous with metal wheels rolling on metal tracks, with overhead powerlines, and if holding with traffic.

So the light-rail that I propose is dedicated bus lanes with the buses having a steering tongue. But then with just a few sidetrack areas the buses could run in both directions in one dedicated bus lane. Also, the buses could pull-up their steering tongues and leave the bus lanes. Finally, the buses could run on compressed hydrogen for zero-local-air-pollution and no overhead power lines. Of course buses can use centralized fueling.

Now running buses on compressed hydrogen at 5000 psi is not very much different from running on compressed natural-gas at 3000 psi. And the compressed hydrogen can fuel hydrogen-fuel-cells to run electric motors or it can be burned in internal-combustion engines.

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Or monorail light-rail can be setup overhead on columns just set next to the curb line. Then only some amount of tree-clearing and powerpole relocation is needed. A monorail doesn't stop for red lights or for traffic. However, the monorail stations need elevators and that situation is not practical for a large number of stops.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

What if they did something big like convert the east-west line to light rail and made 5 points the transfer station? Then you'd have 2 core lines, one heavy and one light rail that you could build off of. Lindbergh could be the heavy rail yard and Avondale could be the light rail yard.

That's not a bad thought the next time E/W requires major renovation. I imagine it will be real expensive.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by T Block

The difference between light-rail and heavy-rail is that light-rail goes on routes of tighter maneuvering, makes more transit stops, likely stops at red lights, possibly holds with traffic, and runs at lower speeds.

But light-rail running on city streets can be horrendous with metal wheels rolling on metal tracks, with overhead powerlines, and if holding with traffic.

So the light-rail that I propose is dedicated bus lanes with the buses having a steering tongue. But then with just a few sidetrack areas the buses could run in both directions in one dedicated bus lane. Also, the buses could pull-up their steering tongues and leave the bus lanes. Finally, the buses could run on compressed hydrogen for zero-local-air-pollution and no overhead power lines. Of course buses can use centralized fueling.

Now running buses on compressed hydrogen at 5000 psi is not very much different from running on compressed natural-gas at 3000 psi. And the compressed hydrogen can fuel hydrogen-fuel-cells to run electric motors or it can be burned in internal-combustion engines.

----------

Or monorail light-rail can be setup overhead on columns just set next to the curb line. Then only some amount of tree-clearing and powerpole relocation is needed. A monorail doesn't stop for red lights or for traffic. However, the monorail stations need elevators and that situation is not practical for a large number of stops.

That's kind of the idea of BRT.