MARTA News (Atlanta, Buckhead: power lines, pollution, light-rail)

[aries4118]

Originally Posted by JMatl

I hope they do yank it, they just need to extend the Red Line to Alpharetta and call it a day.

Amen.

[MattCW]

Originally Posted by JMatl

How do you come to this conclusion so quickly? Norfolk Southern sounds like they are being unreasonable.

Originally Posted by Gulch

I don't think Norfolk Southern is being unreasonable more than them just not wanting to deal with MARTA trains, period.

Experience. For one, MARTA is not a well-run agency, they have a strong "my way or the highway" and strong "not invented here" stance. They're always pitching strange new solutions for things that are pretty standard. I've always felt the decision to use a separate track in the NS right of way was a huge mistake. The only two other commuter lines that do that are UTA in Salt Lake City and Denver's RTD. Both have fare more space than the Clayton corridor. I admit, I'm guessing, and I don't know who originated this stupid idea for a separate track. But a separate track constrains NS. If they decided they needed a second track (even just a new siding) in places, they would be constrained by the MARTA track next to it. However, if MARTA was proposing to fully double track the line with requisite signal upgrades, NS would be stupid to refuse. I believe the line currently sees four through trains each day and a handful of local trains, it's not a busy line at all. Upgrading the line to be handle commuter traffic would give NS significantly more capacity, even with having to deal with commuter trains. In fact they wouldn't just be giving NS capacity, they'd be giving them the capacity, then still paying to use it! Other states don't have the incessant problems Georgia and MARTA seem to have in negotiations with the freight railroads. I see the pattern here.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by MattCW

Experience. For one, MARTA is not a well-run agency, they have a strong "my way or the highway" and strong "not invented here" stance. They're always pitching strange new solutions for things that are pretty standard. I've always felt the decision to use a separate track in the NS right of way was a huge mistake. The only two other commuter lines that do that are UTA in Salt Lake City and Denver's RTD. Both have fare more space than the Clayton corridor. I admit, I'm guessing, and I don't know who originated this stupid idea for a separate track. But a separate track constrains NS. If they decided they needed a second track (even just a new siding) in places, they would be constrained by the MARTA track next to it. However, if MARTA was proposing to fully double track the line with requisite signal upgrades, NS would be stupid to refuse. I believe the line currently sees four through trains each day and a handful of local trains, it's not a busy line at all. Upgrading the line to be handle commuter traffic would give NS significantly more capacity, even with having to deal with commuter trains. In fact they wouldn't just be giving NS capacity, they'd be giving them the capacity, then still paying to use it! Other states don't have the incessant problems Georgia and MARTA seem to have in negotiations with the freight railroads. I see the pattern here.

Interesting. Seems like MARTA would want to get along with the railroads, and vice versa.

[cparker73]

Originally Posted by arjay57

Interesting. Seems like MARTA would want to get along with the railroads, and vice versa.

Also, wouldn't NS want to play nice in the hometown of their new HQ? I'd be curious to see how many people getting off at the North Avenue Marta station are going to be NS employees. I hope they foster a corporate culture that supports rail transit.

[bryantm3]

Idek what to think. MARTA is just a complete fail at this point. Having lived in East Point for a while, I have only used it a handful of times. It doesn't go to Greenbriar, doesn't go to Cascade, doesn't go to Old National, doesn't go to Hapeville, Forest Park or Morrow, and when I have ridden it, it feels like it's going to fall apart.

Agree with you, MattCW, about their "my way or the highway" approach to doing things. They don't want public input— even when they ask for it, they only want opinions on frivilous things like paint colors after they've already designed 98% of the project. And continue to do things like removing benches and making the buses and stations uncomfortable to discourage new riders. They have done a couple of things right— the new signs outside of the stations announcing train times for example. Just wish they could come up with something worthwhile for once.

[Need4Camaro]

Originally Posted by bryantm3

Idek what to think. MARTA is just a complete fail at this point. Having lived in East Point for a while, I have only used it a handful of times. It doesn't go to Greenbriar, doesn't go to Cascade, doesn't go to Old National, doesn't go to Hapeville, Forest Park or Morrow, and when I have ridden it, it feels like it's going to fall apart.

Agree with you, MattCW, about their "my way or the highway" approach to doing things. They don't want public input— even when they ask for it, they only want opinions on frivilous things like paint colors after they've already designed 98% of the project. And continue to do things like removing benches and making the buses and stations uncomfortable to discourage new riders. They have done a couple of things right— the new signs outside of the stations announcing train times for example. Just wish they could come up with something worthwhile for once.

Ages and ages ago I used to live in East Point and at that time MARTA had a bus that went to Greenbriar, but it has been a LONG time ago. I’m guessing this has changed? How is Greenbriar doing right now anyway?

[bryantm3]

Originally Posted by Need4Camaro

Ages and ages ago I used to live in East Point and at that time MARTA had a bus that went to Greenbriar, but it has been a LONG time ago. I’m guessing this has changed? How is Greenbriar doing right now anyway?

There's still a bus that goes out there but the bus for our neighborhood goes to the East Point MARTA station, I'd have to ride up there and then go to Lakewood and take the bus out to Greenbriar. The mall still has a good number of stores and food, but both the anchors are closed now, Macy's left either earlier this year or last, I don't remember when. Somebody put out a plan for Greenbriar in the past year, but I don't remember a whole lot about it.

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by MattCW

Experience. For one, MARTA is not a well-run agency, they have a strong "my way or the highway" and strong "not invented here" stance. They're always pitching strange new solutions for things that are pretty standard. I've always felt the decision to use a separate track in the NS right of way was a huge mistake. The only two other commuter lines that do that are UTA in Salt Lake City and Denver's RTD. Both have fare more space than the Clayton corridor. I admit, I'm guessing, and I don't know who originated this stupid idea for a separate track. But a separate track constrains NS. If they decided they needed a second track (even just a new siding) in places, they would be constrained by the MARTA track next to it. However, if MARTA was proposing to fully double track the line with requisite signal upgrades, NS would be stupid to refuse. I believe the line currently sees four through trains each day and a handful of local trains, it's not a busy line at all. Upgrading the line to be handle commuter traffic would give NS significantly more capacity, even with having to deal with commuter trains. In fact they wouldn't just be giving NS capacity, they'd be giving them the capacity, then still paying to use it! Other states don't have the incessant problems Georgia and MARTA seem to have in negotiations with the freight railroads. I see the pattern here.

Thanks for the detailed response.

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by cparker73

Also, wouldn't NS want to play nice in the hometown of their new HQ? I'd be curious to see how many people getting off at the North Avenue Marta station are going to be NS employees. I hope they foster a corporate culture that supports rail transit.

They definitely do, many employees at their existing Ops Center take the train to Arts Center. I believe they subsidize some of the cost as well.

[SEAandATL]

Well this is disappointing news even though I probably was never going to ride it myself, but just the principle of Atlanta/MARTA making it impossible to expand rail while other cities make it look so easy. Looks like we won't have any rail expansion this decade, and CRT ever. Even projects that are so close to reality end up not happening, like the MMPT (also because of NS not wanting to share their ROW).