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And the best point made is that decisions have consequences and just because someone wants to do something that might shorten their life, it is their decision.
I have been making various decisions about my health care and I am accepting any consequences that may arise. These decisions are not for my doctor or family to make since they are not living my life.
Exactly and that's why I said that - it was after all, their decision to make. For awhile. Until or unless you expect other people in your circle of loved ones to help you live your life - which can entail a lot of overlap into their lives and how they live their own lives.
As I also pointed out, it eventually ended up being left up to other people, because other people were so enmeshed in what was involved in their care.
That's the watershed point to me. It's fine to live independently - as long as you're living independently. But let's not kid ourselves - when it takes multiple people to help us "live independently" then we're really not doing so, are we?
It often takes a team of people working together to help our elderly loved ones live as comfortably and with as much dignity and respect as possible. At some point, in some families, the center shifts and yet it's STILL a team effort - and the elderly ones in the mix need to think of what's best for everyone, not just their own personal desires or fantasies of "living independently."
That's the sad truth.
Recently I had to move my mother into a senior living apartment. Due to various health issues, she cannot live alone in her own home. And she cannot live with me, and doesn't want to live with me (or any of her kids). So we decided together that the best answer was for her to move to an independent living apartment (with assisted living available when needed in the same complex).
Well, that was fine for awhile, but then when it came to actually listing her home - the home she'd shared with my dad - she got balky and started talking about moving back into it, not selling it, wanting to live there again, etc.
Finally I had to say this:
"Mom, you always talk about us being a team, right?" "Yes," she said. I said, "Then, Mom, it's not fair of you to expect to move back into your home. You can't live independently and we tried the help coming in, etc. etc. You remember that, right?" She said, "Yes."
I said, "So what it boiled down to is that in order for you to live in your own home, I had to do all your maintenance, all your shopping, all your driving around, all your entertainment, etc - it was all on my shoulders. Plus I had to worry constantly about your health and about whether or not you had fallen or were very sick - remember that you often couldn't hear your phone at night, you often didn't wear your alarm, and you sometimes forgot to keep your phone charged? So when no one could reach you, I had to get in my car and drive over to your house to check on you - and sometimes that was at 10 pm at night! You remember all that, right?" She pouted and wouldn't really commit to all that, but she and I both knew it was the truth.
Anyway, the sad truth of the matter is that it was unfair of her to expect that much from me. And I haven't even named the other reasons why it didn't make sense for her to live alone - in fact, it was unsafe for MANY reasons other than the ones I have mentioned.
So yes, I'm all for seniors making their own decisions about how and where to live their last years out - within reason. But for some families, compromises have to be made in order for the TOTAL scenario to work for everyone involved.
Thanks for your testimonials, experience, and understanding.
I'm still up in the air as to what we should do. Just comes down to wanting to get through the day. The people who care for them have feelings about this too. They're the ones who call me at 3 in the morning to tell me my mom has fallen again, but doesn't seem to be hurt too bad, Hospice is on the way.
My mom got moved to the Nursing Home last week and my dad has been staying back at the Assisted Living Facility.
I have a list of at least 50 reasons why this is best for them. I'll write them down in time. Maybe you experienced people can help me add to it.
One reason is because the minute the nurses leave the room, my dad becomes her immediate health care provider. She falls, he goes to help her up, he falls, you know the story.
Well my brother is a very religious, newly, self proclaimed Jesus Freak and he pasted all over Facebook how what God joined together, no man shall part.
In short, he wants my dad to pack up and move in with mom, even if only for a moment.
More to come...
Isn't that up to your father to decide? I wanted to get my mother away from my brother but it was her choice to do everything she could for him.
Thanks for your testimonials, experience, and understanding.
I'm still up in the air as to what we should do. Just comes down to wanting to get through the day. The people who care for them have feelings about this too. They're the ones who call me at 3 in the morning to tell me my mom has fallen again, but doesn't seem to be hurt too bad, Hospice is on the way.
Can you remind us again of who exactly is caring for them, how, where, etc?
That's the watershed point to me. It's fine to live independently - as long as you're living independently. But let's not kid ourselves - when it takes multiple people to help us "live independently" then we're really not doing so, are we?
I've seen you post this about 1,000 times. Yes, everyone knows that. What is meant by independent living is not in an ALF or nursing home. Your mother is still in independent living facility even though it requires your help (at least in your mind; she could live w/o you). We all understand the terminology.
Even in a nursing home with 'total' care many family members still help.
I've seen you post this about 1,000 times. Yes, everyone knows that. What is meant by independent living is not in an ALF or nursing home. Your mother is still in independent living facility even though it requires your help (at least in your mind; she could live w/o you). We all understand the terminology.
Even in a nursing home with 'total' care many family members still help.
Why are you on me about this? It's not just the "regulars" who post or read the posts here. Once upon a time, you and I were both newbies to this forum. So yes, I've discussed it before and you've probably read it before, but if you don't want to read my posts on the topic, please skip over them. Thanks.
I'm not discussing the difference between living in an "independent living facility" and "living independently" so I don't know why you're harping on that by the way.
My point - which I'll make 1,001 times according to you, is that when it takes a team of family members to help an elderly person or couple live with dignity and safety, then the needs of the ENTIRE TEAM, not just the elderly people in question, need to be considered.
Isn't that up to your father to decide? I wanted to get my mother away from my brother but it was her choice to do everything she could for him.
Yeah, I am a big advocate of asking my mom and dad what they want.
My mom wants to come home with and live with us.
That ship sailed years ago.
My dad has onset of dementia, but is adjusted to and living very well at the ALF assisted living facility.
Here, let me throw in some backstory, some details...
Quote:
Please respond to this one, not the one with 5 in it. 3 or 4 could you please forward this to 2? He must have blocked my number or something. We met concerning mom and dad. It looks like we're going to have mom move to a nursing home really soon, and move dad to a smaller room at the LC. Mom cannot continue to live there without around the clock care. It's mostly a safety issue but also behavioral. Mom is getting physically combative with staff and also dad. Dad is so exhausted that he cannot sleep, take a nap, take a shower, go to the bathroom, etc, and he has complained about none of it, but they just see this going on.
The attempt to keep them together has just come and gone. To move dad to a nursing home is not even an option. He would not qualify.
I have much written down describing what we all talked about. Will post more soon. Trying to discuss this with mom and dad now.
...
I've summarized my meeting today with LC (10 & 11) and SHospice (12, 13 and another gentleman)...
Problems for dad:
Never sleeping well anymore, exhausted to the point of not being able to take care of himself, bathe, going to the bathroom, mom sometimes disuades him from going to the cafeteria to eat. Dad is trying to care for and help mom, as he's tried to for years, hard habit to break. But this is dangerous for he and her. He's helped her to shower, dangerous.
Add, he's exhausted because he's trying to care for her. Afraid to go to the bathroom or shower because he's afraid she'll fall and/walk out, get lost, fall. Can't sleep at night because she gets up, falls, moans all night, etc.
Dad, reasons to keep at LC? (Assisted living place)
He recognizes it as home. He knows the people there. Knows his way around. Does well and adjusted to it. Probably would not qualify for Nursing Home, etc.
Problems for mom:
Mom doesn't sleep well at night, so no sleep for dad either, for most of the night, night after night.
Tries to just get up and walk away.
Doesn't recognize it as home.
Tells them she's going home to Lake ...(home town)
Hasn't integrated to staff, treats them all as strangers at times.
Sometimes doesn't recognize dad and has been seen by staff trying to hit him, asking where the Twins are.
She has tried to hit staff, but "not for a while now".
She's a "ball of fire", good and bad connotation obviously.
Falling issues. They cannot practically keep her from falling there.
She falls because of her walk, gate is bad, shuffle. Either leans back too far, or too far forward, bad leg strength, blood pressure sometimes rises when she stands, thus dizziness.
She won't go to cafeteria to eat many times, and won't let dad go. Why? Fear of being alone. Dad fears leaving her alone anyway.
Best and pretty much only option for mom is a nursing home.
...
Dad and I visited mom in room ... and it went pretty well. We were there for about an hour. 6 pm is a pretty busy time for the nurses there at NH nursing Home. I have to work an overtime shift tonight, so 15 hour shift, don't get home until 10 o'clock tonight. Won't be able to take dad there tonight.
...
Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon
My point - which I'll make 1,001 times according to you, is that when it takes a team of family members to help an elderly person or couple live with dignity and safety, then the needs of the ENTIRE TEAM, not just the elderly people in question, need to be considered.
And the best point made is that decisions have consequences and just because someone wants to do something that might shorten their life, it is their decision.
I have been making various decisions about my health care and I am accepting any consequences that may arise. These decisions are not for my doctor or family to make since they are not living my life.
I love this, Sweetana. I'm doing the same. And am trying to not feel guilty about some of my mother's problems which are due to unwise choices that she made, and which I can't fix without ruining my own life.
Yeah, I am a big advocate of asking my mom and dad what they want.
My mom wants to come home with and live with us.
That ship sailed years ago.
My dad has onset of dementia, but is adjusted to and living very well at the ALF assisted living facility.
Here, let me throw in some backstory, some details...
I don't see how your family could do otherwise than move your mom to a facility which offers more caregiving, because she needs it and your father can't do it.
Like another poster wrote, if your brother wants your parents to be together, he could make that happen by becoming their caregiver.
I don't see how your family could do otherwise than move your mom to a facility which offers more caregiving, because she needs it and your father can't do it.
Like another poster wrote, if your brother wants your parents to be together, he could make that happen by becoming their caregiver.
I agree ^^^. The situation of constantly attending to your mother had become dangerous for both of them.
Ignore your brother or ask him if God really would want both of your parents to end up with broken bones (or head injuries) when they both fall down together. I think not.
I really sympathize as I know it is a heartbreaking situation to see parents failing and declining. I've been there as well as many others here. Hang in there and trust in your decisions.
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