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Well, call me naive, but I kind of think it means we're not supposed to judge each other. We obviously need to use discernment in making choices for our own lives. This involves judging certain doctrines to be true or false, certain behaviors to be right or wrong, etc. As far as judging one another, and particularly condemning one another, I strongly believe that it's in all of our best interests to leave that up to God. I'm pretty sure He is capable of judging all of us without anyone else's help.
Amen! . . . can't rep you yet, Katz. God needs no help from us either to judge anyone or to coerce, sanction or chastise anyone. Each individual is responsible to God for his/her OWN position, period. If your opinion is sought . . . give it freely and sincerely . . . otherwise mind your own soul. It is sufficient work for the day.
Clearly the bolded part is telling us to JUDGE our brother. I surely hope my brother Judges me.
The bold is telling us no such thing . . . it is a figure of speech to point up a comparative . . . not a command or permission.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
I hope my pastor, or fellow believer would help me get back on the narrow path if/when I fall off. That is one of the benefits of being a part of a church, -to receive help and instruction from your brothers and sisters in Christ.
Quote:
Originally Posted by trettep
It is neither help nor instruction if it is not REQUESTED . . . it is self-righteous "busybodiness" and imposition.
Amen! . . . can't rep you yet, Katz. God needs no help from us either to judge anyone or to coerce, sanction or chastise anyone. Each individual is responsible to God for his/her OWN position, period. If your opinion is sought . . . give it freely and sincerely . . . otherwise mind your own soul. It is sufficient work for the day.
LOL! I couldn't rep you either, Mystic. I guess we'll both have to just go with "it's the thought that counts," huh?
Jesus was not giving us a "figure of speech". He was giving us instruction just as He did here:
Joh 7:24 Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment.
Mystic, are you going to tell me that we are not to Judge when Jesus says we are to?
I will not (and couldn't possibly in this short space) impart an extensive lesson in the use of idiom, figures of speech, and the many differences and difficulties in translating them from one language to another (especially when they don't always have equivalents in the other language). Using our sophisticated and very nuanced language you naturally assume He means to judge others . . . but He means to judge Good and Evil righteously, period. We are each accountable for ourselves on our own before God. Our success or failure in making those judgments correctly (about Good and evil) should be our concern in this life.
Truly helping our brothers and sisters does NOT involve judging them. That is for God and God alone. It is in helping them see what you believe Good and Evil are and why. Two or more sets of eyes are likely to see the world more clearly than one set alone. But we are NOT to judge each other.
That has nothing to do with what we are talking about. Have you fallen off the path? Are you living in sin? Actually I don't even know if you are a believer, and if you are not, then I would not attempt to help you get back on the path.
One final time, it is not about 'passing judgment', it is about helping.
Whether or not you agree, but it is a duty of a Christian to try to help other believers in such situations.
I already explained how I understood your comment about self control, and it still sounds like you are saying that one should exercise self control to keep oneself from helping another believer, but it only makes sense if you fail to see judgment in a positive light.
Remember: I do not have an "us" and "them" mentality. Therefore, I doubt you will comprehend, until you see things in the same light.
I will not (and couldn't possibly in this short space) impart an extensive lesson in the use of idiom, figures of speech, and the many differences and difficulties in translating them from one language to another (especially when they don't always have equivalents in the other language). Using our sophisticated and very nuanced language you naturally assume He means to judge others . . . but He means to judge Good and Evil righteously, period. We are each accountable for ourselves on our own before God. Our success or failure in making those judgments correctly (about Good and evil) should be our concern in this life.
Truly helping our brothers and sisters does NOT involve judging them. That is for God and God alone. It is in helping them see what you believe Good and Evil are and why. Two or more sets of eyes are likely to see the world more clearly than one set alone. But we are NOT to judge each other.
To the contrary. Righteous Judgement is a loving thing. And Love is meant for others.
It is neither help nor instruction if it is not REQUESTED . . . it is self-righteous "busybodiness" and imposition.
There has been countless attempts on this thread to explain that there are two kinds of judgment, - negative and positive, but you and some others continue see it all as self-righteous imposition. Do you ever accept help from anyone, or do you always reject it as self-righteous imposition?
Remember: I do not have an "us" and "them" mentality.
I don't know why you brought it up, because no one on this thread has demontrated that attitude.
Quote:
Therefore, I doubt you will comprehend, until you see things in the same light.
I thought you just said you do not have "us and "them" mentality. Now it sounds like you suggest that I will not see it like you unless I become one of "you".
What are you trying to say?
PS You post does not answer the points I made, or trettep has made.
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We obviously need to use discernment in making choices for our own lives. This involves judging certain doctrines to be true or false, certain behaviors to be right or wrong, etc. As far as judging one another, and particularly condemning one another, I strongly believe that it's in all of our best interests to leave that up to God. I'm pretty sure He is capable of judging all of us without anyone else's help.
