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Mike, we are awaiting spiritual bodies, not the rejoining of our spirit with our mortal bodies. You already know I don't believe unbelievers go to eternal torment.
Mike does not know that what he thinks is his physical body already does not really exist separate from his consciousness (Spirit). It is perceived by our sensory systems and interpreted by his and our consciousness. This may go over his (and possibly your) head because we are so conditioned to reality being what our sensory system experiences, but it is our consciousness that interprets it. We are really our consciousness (Spirit), not a physical body. That is only the perceived manifestation that contains us.
Mike does not know that what he thinks is his physical body already does not really exist separate from his consciousness (Spirit). It is perceived by our sensory systems and interpreted by his and our consciousness. This may go over his (and possibly your) head because we are so conditioned to reality being what our sensory system experiences, but it is our consciousness that interprets it. We are really our consciousness (Spirit), not a physical body. That is only the perceived manifestation that contains us.
The soul in which our consciousness, conscience, mentality, volition, and emotions reside is the real person which resides in the body. The physical body is very real and is the house or tent which houses the soul. At death the soul and spirit separates from the body and in the case of the believer goes into the presence of the Lord. The body goes into the grave or is otherwise disposed of.
Don't presume to tell others what someone else does or doesn't know.
Last edited by Michael Way; 09-01-2015 at 06:45 PM..
Where does it say that he was in hell three days witnessing?...
As I'm sure you already know and are just testing the poster, this is one of those weird translations from 1 Peter that much of mainstream Christianity believes. It's where Jesus (through Noah) preached to the antediluvians at the time Noah was building the ark. These people who were 'in the prison house of sin', i.e. those who were disobedient, are (obviously) NOW dead but WERE alive when Jesus (through Noah's ministry) preached to them. However, they didn't listen and turn from their evil ways and so were destroyed. Needless to say, that's an explanation in a tiny nutshell. From this passage of scripture mainstream Christianity erroneously teaches that Jesus preached to the dead in prison (hell?) during the time He spent between crucifixion and resurrection. The mind boggles as to how theologians can get something SO wrong! It really does bring into question as to how accurate they are with regard to others scriptures . . .
Yea, so why don't you go over to the Judaism forum and tell the other Jews that?...I'm quite certain that they would love to have you correct their misunderstandings of their own cultural idioms...
Uh...Seed means descendants (with an "S")...You probably think progeny is one and progenys is more than one descendant...The reason that the nations would be blessed is because G-d was calling them to be a peculiar people, an holy nation and a nation of priests...IOW, a guiding light to the nations...Nowhere in the bible does it say "seeds" unless they are speaking agriculturally...It is not "One of your SEEDS" it is "One of you SEED"...Which is not what G-d said to Avraham...
Here's what the TaNaKh actually says:
18.And through your children (seed) shall be blessed all the nations of the world, because you hearkened to My voice."
That idiom is not hard to understand and I agree with you in what you say it means in as far as you take it but you do not take the meaning far enough. I however take it further to mean that Abrahams Bosom is a real/heavenly place, not just a concept of mind.
Yes, seed more often times means many in the Bible yet when God said He would bless the all the nations through Abraham's /children, He was making reference to the one offspring that alone had the Power to bless the whole earth without fail and of coarse I mean Christ. As an example we have here in Genesis chapter 3 from the Tanach that the seed is he [singular] that will crush the Serpents head.
15."And I [God] shall place hatred between you [the Serpent] and between the woman, and between your seed and between her seed. He will crush your head, and you will bite his heel."
.
Israel as a nation of descendants of Abraham have been a blessing as you say but also have failed miserably several times and given over to there enemies because they did not follow the Old nor the New Covenant even as Moses said would happen. Oh yes, there is a New Covenant with the house of Judah and Israel.
From the Tanach Jeremiah 31:30-31."Behold, days are coming, says the Lord, and I will form a covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, a new covenant. Not like the covenant that I formed with their forefathers on the day I took them by the hand to take them out of the land of Egypt, that they broke My covenant, although I was a lord over them, says the Lord."
Mike does not know that what he thinks is his physical body already does not really exist separate from his consciousness (Spirit). It is perceived by our sensory systems and interpreted by his and our consciousness. This may go over his (and possibly your) head because we are so conditioned to reality being what our sensory system experiences, but it is our consciousness that interprets it. We are really our consciousness (Spirit), not a physical body. That is only the perceived manifestation that contains us.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike555
The soul in which our consciousness, conscience, mentality, volition, and emotions reside is the real person which resides in the body. The physical body is very real and is the house or tent which houses the soul. At death the soul and spirit separates from the body and in the case of the believer goes into the presence of the Lord. The body goes into the grave or is otherwise disposed of.
Don't presume to tell others what someone else does or doesn't know.
Is there an experiment we could run to determine which view is correct?
At no time did the Roman Catholic Church ever have its hands on all of the New Testament manuscripts which have been translated into many different languages. Not just Latin. There is no way that the Roman Catholic Church which didn't even really come into it's own, so to speak, until around the 6th century A.D. could have 'tampered' with every single manuscript.
Again, Hebrews 1:6 which quotes Psalm 97:7 (in the Septuagint) as well as Deut. 32:43, also in the Septuagint, refers to the angels worshiping Jesus who is God the Son.
Jesus was not in 'hell' for three days witnessing to unsaved members of the human race. It was probably after His resurrection that He went to Tartarus (2 Peter 2:4) and made a proclamation to the group of fallen angels who are currently imprisoned there. Compare 2 Peter 2:4 with 1 Peter 3:19-20. Jesus went to Tartarus (2 Peter 2:4) and made a proclamation to the spirits now imprisoned there who disobeyed God in the days of Noah (1 Peter 3:19-20). This refers back to the Genesis 6 account of the sons of God (a reference to the angels) who did not keep their first estate (Jude 1:6) and are now being kept in chains of darkness (in Tartarus) until the day of their judgment.
The only way you can hold on to your beliefs is by maintaining that the Roman Catholic church doctored all the New Testament manuscript by inserting Trinity doctrine. And such was not the case.
You believe what you want. I am not going to keep going back and forth on the issue. Your constant refrain that the Jehovah's Witnesses are the only true teachers and all others are false teachers smacks of a cult mentality. But if that's what floats your boat . . .
No trinity was taught at the first council of Nicea--it was added later at another council. Made up false doctrine. Misleading all who serve it to break Gods #1 commandment daily.
This proves every trinity religion on earth as false--Mark 3:24-26-- a house divided will not stand. Fact--Gods house will stand.
Jesus' teachings prove the JW teachers are correct--learn them. there is no need to believe me--believe Jesus.
Where does it say that he was in hell three days witnessing?...
It was symbolism, Jesus was in the grave. I am not sure of the exact location, I will check.
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