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Location: Austin, TX/Chicago, IL/Houston, TX/Washington, DC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee
I would think this fact alone would place Houston a cut above San Francisco. Facebook and Google are nice things to have, but I did without those things for most of my life. My life would have been very difficult without oil, though. At this point, I think innovations in energy are just as important, if not more, than innovations in computer technologies. So I don't think you can say that the Bay Area is more important than Houston because of the presence of Silicon Valley.
There are only two "important" cities in my mind, and all of the others are pretty much interchangeable. By important, I mean "cities that people care about." Steven Hawking is arguably more important than Barack Obama, but you don't see a cadre of trained killers escorting the former to and fro, do you? I would argue that Obama is more "important" because people care about him and the things he does. Although Hawking is brilliant, nobody really cares what the hell he does on any given day of the week.
That said, I'd put the Bay Area no higher than number 5. Granted, you could ask where the country would be without computers, etc, but a Houstonian could ask where the country would be without energy. It's hard to say which industry is more important than another. Because of Chicago and LA's size, I think they are more important than SF. I think it's also telling that Los Angeles and Chicago, particularly Los Angeles, are the focus of media attention more often than San Francisco.
I can agree with a lot of your points. Despite being a major Los Angeles, Chicago, & Anything in Texas booster I have to give props where it deserves to go though.
Bay Area also has involvement in energy and is leading an innovation for new energy. It is also the global headquarters for Chevron, one of the largest energy companies.
Houston is the focal point for it and is the center of gravity for energy.
But Bay Area is far beyond that, Bay Area is a revolutionary media capital. All the new means for media which are internet based, things like Yahoo!, Google, YouTube, Facebook are the new media.
My flat panel television has YouTube integrated within its hardware, and my PS3 even has Google & YouTube calling the shots.
A lot of how we today see media is through the internet like right now. All these Forbes lists and all these articles. All come via Internet media.
The Bay Area is exponentially increasing port activity, it has its hands on finance and rank as one of the top for that.
The Bay Area has its hands on higher education and can only be surpassed by Boston for that and maybe Oxford in UK but that is it.
The Bay Area is where all the most innovative technology comes from.
The Bay Area is also the focal point for a lot of progressive movements, particularly political sight on human rights and environmentalism. It influences directly via media a lot of policies our government has to go through.
I'm not saying that presently its more important than Chicago & Los Angeles but in a few years it very much will be. Los Angeles is seeing a stall, the old method for media and entertainment is diminishing and the Bay Area has inherited innovative new media, and is IMO more competitive form of it than Los Angeles. Bay Area also has a faster growing port than Los Angeles now, even Houston has a faster growing port than Los Angeles now.
Bay Area is also one of the most diverse economies in the country only after Chicago, New York City, Boston (in that order), and Los Angeles does not have that crutch to help it out of economic crisis. The more things you have your hands on the better off you are.
Anyways I would make more points for the Bay Area, but it would be repetitive, to see my entire argument that has been demonstrated before, here is a link for it: http://www.city-data.com/forum/city-...york-city.html
Here is the focal point of the argument I have made before in the past:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Awesome Danny
It may just be the difference in how the two of us perceive the area.
I know California in general has been a hard hit area economically. But from what Lifeshadower said about other posters drawing lines of connection of Bay Area to Detroit is something I can never believe. No way.
From everything that I can visually see that Bay Area has got it's hands on nearly everything I can think of and it's increasing it's potential in a lot of other sectors as well.
Port activity increasing. Finance it is one of the best cities for that in the country despite trailing New York City & Chicago on that but it is still a top city in that regard and I can see it potentially getting better. It can establish connections with energy, mega influential Chevron is headquartered there in the Bay Area. It is an educational stronghold and that is something only Boston can match in this country. They control the most modern methods of media- I will explain below.
Media how we perceive it is evolving, I can even use my PS3 to surf the net via my flat panel television, YouTube (Google) makes some major bank off that. A lot of technology is evolving, handhelds, cellular devices, all of these things are increasing in popularity and all of them serve one purpose: Getting information faster.
Everyone here uses the internet (obviously) many of us really rely on sites like Yahoo! or Google, and I know that for a fact, I always see people making threads about "this city tops this list" and when I go to the home page for Yahoo! the same thing is the front article news. That is a modern method of media, getting information from one corner of the world to another, one part of the country to another. I do not see that going anywhere, I can see it evolving to become more effective but that is it. Yahoo! is a Bay Area company, and a Bay Area influence, dare I say nothing in Los Angeles in modern times has that same level of media influence. Using the internet or going to see popular flicks at the theater? There are news stations and things of that sort but the internet is a connection every corner of this world is drawing to each other. It's how people can get information from point one to point two.
The presidential election in 2008 a lot of it was broadcasted by YouTube and sponsored by them as well, that is the effectiveness of modern media. In which people would make videos with questions to the candidates of choice to answer. That is the common connection one average man can make to the most influential people on Earth via Bay Area media (stream sites & channeling sites).
Buy a Blu Ray player and it has YouTube already integrated within the system, crazy huh? These things are going everywhere and every corner of the world is hearing about Google or anything else that comes from innovative perspective all brought to you by the Bay Area. IMO that is revolutionizing not only the economy but the world.
iPad anyone? It came out, what do you see now? All these Korean companies and Japanese companies trying to play catch up and out do it, can they out number those sales? Not with the hype the iPad got.
That is like saying Creative Zen versions out did the iPod. Which they tried but could not do.
All these products, from Apple, Adobe, HP, Google, all of these are Bay Area relevant.
IMO the Bay Area will in time control more media strongholds in the future than Los Angeles, modern media can be pressed from innovative technology, revolutionizing gadgets.
Movies are made in 3D but where do most of those animation experts reside? A lot of them are web based designers and creative individuals that do graphics all coming from the Bay Area.
There are so many things in an economical aspect that the Bay Area touches in which I would go on a limb to say is second to none, on par influentially with New York City & Wall Street.
I can look around my bedroom at home and see things that have effective connections to Bay Area, my cell phone, my laptop, my Blu Ray Player, my TV (has internet and Google integrated in), my printer, my iPod, etc...
I can't think of many or at the present moment any industry not represented in the Bay Area, they have their hands on literally everything.
IMO they are among the most influential economic areas in the world, draw parallels to YouKu or any other rip off companies that have tried competing with those.
Everyday life affected by things that do come out of the Bay Area? I would say hell yes, way more than anything coming out of Chicago & Los Angeles combined.
I think on economic relevance Chicago has a great future it has got it's hands on so much and has the most diverse economy in the country, CME & Transportation are epicenters for Chicago like wise Entertainment and Port activities for Los Angeles.
But there is only one place in our country that has it's hands on everything, and literally not just that, it is the birth place to some of the most influential companies in the world and that is the Bay Area. Apple, Google, Adobe, Yahoo!, GAP (the clothing store), CNET, Live Journal, HP, among others-
Check this out for everything headquartered there: List of companies headquartered in San Francisco - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Bay Area literally has got it's hands on everything you can think of. Any kind of company for any kind of industry.
And on top of that, I cannot name one if any other region of our country if not the world that is more socially involved in the environment and social progression as the Bay Area. That does influence legislation on local, state, & national level. Those trends do appear in other nations that adapt and follow them as well.
Washington DC, ahhhh the place with so much story and stability presently. They have a prosperous economy and they are most effectively one of the highest cities on a rise right now. Politically influential to the world, the power to reel in major investors from other nations and the power to combine politics with economics.
Who signs those checks when it comes to loaning money and bailing out Wall Street or sending money overseas and regulating it? Washington DC does.
IMHO, Bay Area/New York City/DMV are the new Chicago/New York City/Los Angeles.
And this is what I mean when I say, GDP doesn't tell the whole story. Even in your city of Charlotte, Bank of America is an example of something the Bay Area has once touched and still may have a large hand on, I am sure there are still ties to Bay Area from Charlotte.
So IMHO, I do not in anyway shape or form see the Bay Area going down the same road as Detroit. yeah there will be speed bumps here and there, but a place as influential and innovative as that can pull itself out of it.
That is why I am saying Chicago & Los Angeles will both be stepping down from their power and influence (regardless of an overtaking of their GDP) as the Bay Area & DMV will swiftly replace them in a smooth transitional manner. Chicago & Los Angeles have had their heyday. And honestly I just realized I didn't have to include New York City in this thread, LOL it was not the center for any discussion as it has and always will be number one!
And PS- I am not trying to boost Bay Area, well not too much anyways, it's just been the focal point of a lot of influential thoughts lately.
Does anyone else view it the way I do? Or am I alone in this?
While the Bay Area has given us a lot of great things, I still don't see it eclipsing Los Angeles, Chicago, Houston, Boston, or Atlanta because those places also give us important things. Again, I really appreciate my iPhone, but I appreciate my car just as much (thanks, Detroit!).
At the end of the day, I just don't think people care about the Bay Area the way they do about NYC, DC, and to a lesser extent, Los Angeles. I didn't grow up in NYC or DC, but yet the NYT is my home page on my PC. That's saying a lot. Even many of my friends on the West Coast have the NYT or the Washington Post as their home page. I've never met anyone who had the SF Chronicle or the San Jose Mercury News as a home page. And I've never seen a segment of the nightly news televised from the Bay Area. You could dismiss that as irrelevant, but I find it hard to believe that a city could be so important without ever being a national news hub.
I would think this fact alone would place Houston a cut above San Francisco. Facebook and Google are nice things to have, but I did without those things for most of my life. My life would have been very difficult without oil, though. At this point, I think innovations in energy are just as important, if not more, than innovations in computer technologies. So I don't think you can say that the Bay Area is more important than Houston because of the presence of Silicon Valley.
There are only two "important" cities in my mind, and all of the others are pretty much interchangeable. By important, I mean "cities that people care about." Steven Hawking is arguably more important than Barack Obama, but you don't see a cadre of trained killers escorting the former to and fro, do you? I would argue that Obama is more "important" because people care about him and the things he does. Although Hawking is brilliant, nobody really cares what the hell he does on any given day of the week.
That said, I'd put the Bay Area no higher than number 5. Granted, you could ask where the country would be without computers, etc, but a Houstonian could ask where the country would be without energy. It's hard to say that one industry is more important than another. Because of Chicago and LA's size, I think they are more important than SF. I think it's also telling that Los Angeles and Chicago, particularly Los Angeles, are the focus of media attention more often than San Francisco.
This isn't just about computers though. Much of our energy research, the actual R&D is and has been done in the Bay Area. You know the popular names behind certain big sites like facebook and google, but that is a drop in the bucket behind what is actually done behind the scenes with the information shared and how information is organized. The very basic media content that many of us now use in our lives that inform our day to day decisions and perceptions have been subtly shaped by ideas that have come out of the Bay Area. These are only part of it though, because the Bay Area allows other ideas to go forward as well from biotechnology to politics to cuisine (and possibly the automotive industry). The ideas are made there--the work can be done anywhere. To turn the Bay Area into just iphones, facebook, and google is way off the mark.
This isn't just about computers though. Much of our energy research, the actual R&D is and has been done in the Bay Area. You know the popular names behind certain big sites like facebook and google, but that is a drop in the bucket behind what is actually done behind the scenes with the information shared and how information is organized. The very basic media content that many of us now use in our lives that inform our day to day decisions and perceptions have been subtly shaped by ideas that have come out of the Bay Area. These are only part of it though, because the Bay Area allows other ideas to go forward as well from biotechnology to politics to cuisine (and possibly the automotive industry). The ideas are made there--the work can be done anywhere.
But you could say that about many other cities as well. Boston, for example, is not the "center of gravity" for computer technology, but there are a number of companies there that focus on it. After all, you don't have to be in Silicon Valley to write a software program. You could do that in a living room in Racine, Wisconsin. San Francisco touches other industries like finance, transportation, etc, but Boston, Houston and Atlanta touch other things, too.
But you could say that about many other cities as well. Boston, for example, is not the "center of gravity" for computer technology, but there are a number of companies there that focus on it. After all, you don't have to be in Silicon Valley to write a software program. You could do that in a living room in Racine, Wisconsin. San Francisco touches other industries like finance, transportation, etc, but Boston, Houston and Atlanta touch other things, too.
It does help to actually have a concentration of people who can easily bounce and develop ideas off of each other and who can easily get the resources necessary. It's true for any industry that you can point to another city and say they do it, too, but the scale and corporate culture can be completely different (NYC fashion industry versus Miami fashion industry for example). The Bay Area is the big one.
However, this isn't just about computers. This is about research and development in many sectors which has influence on very basic levels.
It does help to actually have a concentration of people who can easily bounce and develop ideas off of each other and who can easily get the resources necessary. It's true for any industry that you can point to another city and say they do it, too, but the scale and corporate culture can be completely different (NYC fashion industry versus Miami fashion industry for example). The Bay Area is the big one.
However, this isn't just about computers. This is about research and development in many sectors which has influence on very basic levels.
Point taken. But I don't see the Bay Area blowing cities like Boston and Houston away when you look at a variety of other industries. The only two cities that completely dominate any one industry seem to be New York and Washington (Actually, NYC runs up the score in several different industries). Even Washington, DC seems to be very competitive in the finance, tech, and consulting sectors. San Francisco may outpace Boston in tech and finance, but Boston has a huge margin on the Bay Area when it comes to education and has considerably more "white shoe" law firms.
Philadelphia being the fourth largest urban area and the fourth largest media market should be in the discussion for the four spot. 30 years ago it would have been at least number four, but DC has caught up and the federal government has given it an edge. So DC is fourth.
Nah, there's not enough going on in Philly. Philly is more of a place where people end up rather than a place they actively try to get to. It's not a city for strivers.
Nah, there's not enough going on in Philly. Philly is more of a place where people end up rather than a place they actively try to get to. It's not a city for strivers.
Though it is the best city on earth to be FROM.
People don't end up in Philly. People start off in Philly.
Location: Austin, TX/Chicago, IL/Houston, TX/Washington, DC
10,138 posts, read 16,035,535 times
Reputation: 4047
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee
^^Awesome Danny,
While the Bay Area has given us a lot of great things, I still don't see it eclipsing Los Angeles, Chicago, Houston, Boston, or Atlanta because those places also give us important things. Again, I really appreciate my iPhone, but I appreciate my car just as much (thanks, Detroit!).
At the end of the day, I just don't think people care about the Bay Area the way they do about NYC, DC, and to a lesser extent, Los Angeles. I didn't grow up in NYC or DC, but yet the NYT is my home page on my PC. That's saying a lot. Even many of my friends on the West Coast have the NYT or the Washington Post as their home page. I've never met anyone who had the SF Chronicle or the San Jose Mercury News as a home page. And I've never seen a segment of the nightly news televised from the Bay Area. You could dismiss that as irrelevant, but I find it hard to believe that a city could be so important without ever being a national news hub.
I think we'll just have to agree to disagree here.
One thing we can agree with would probably be this: that the top 8 most important areas of the country are (in no particular order)- New York City, Los Angeles, Chicago, Washington DC, Bay Area, Boston, Houston, & Atlanta.
I think we'll just have to agree to disagree here.
One thing we can agree with would probably be this: that the top 8 most important areas of the country are (in no particular order)- New York City, Los Angeles, Chicago, Washington DC, Bay Area, Boston, Houston, & Atlanta.
So I'm curious...why are national news programs televised from New York, Washington and Los Angeles, but not from San Francisco?
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