Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Some STEM majors are more employable than others. All of the liberal arts majors are more employable than information systems (part of the T in STEM) if you're using unemployment as your measurement. For the years Georgetown looked at, information systems majors (recent graduates) had an unemployment rate of 14.7%. Computer science had an unemployment rate of 8.7%; that's higher than the recent graduates in common foreign langues (8.1%). It's also higher than the unemployment rate for general liberal arts majors (8.1%) and music (8.6%). It's just a little higher than psychology (9.2%). https://georgetown.app.box.com/s/9t0p5tm0qhejyy8t8hub
Government and economics majors make more than all of the natural science majors except for physics (unless you also count applied mathematics). International relations majors make more than geology, chemistry, and almost all of the other natural sciences. Political sciences majors make more than almost all of the life science (biology, environmental science, etc.) majors. These are all people without graduate degrees. Majors That Pay You Back - 2013-2014 College Salary Report
Sciences are part of the liberal arts. Engineering is a profession that uses quite a bit of science and mathematics. In general terms, the liberal arts are the disciplines that seek to understand the world from both a natural and human centered perspective. There is quite a bit of overlap between the subject matter studied by someone in a vocational or technical program and a liberal arts program, but the subjects themselves are part of the liberal arts.
The majority of the coursework required for many technical and vocational programs lies in the realm of liberal arts. In fact, ALL of the requirements for a student to go to medical school, pharmacy school, law school, and most graduate programs can be met with 100% liberal arts classes. Engineering and nursing are the only programs that I know of that require significant vocation specific coursework prior to study at the graduate level.
I think a lot of people just get worked up about the words "liberal" and "arts".
I find that an easy, but not 100% full proof, way to distinguish between the professions and liberal arts is to look at whether or not the field is regulated or semi-regulated. Most of the professions require a license, registration, and/or certification by law or practice. In my state, engineers are licensed. If you want to be a public accountant, you need pass the CPA exam. Almost all of the health care professions are licensed. Lawyers have to be admitted to their state's Bar. The DoD requires IT certifications for contract workers. Even though IT certification is not required by law outside of the federal government, it is often required by employers. Teachers need to be licensed or certified.
When someone makes up their own methodology, the burden is on them to support it, not on me to disprove it.
Given that they haven't explained their methodology, there are no conclusions that can be drawn. As I said, it is worthless.
Sorry that you are having such a difficult time with this, but the concept really isn't that difficult to understand.
When the data that is provided supports other data points that are published elsewhere then the burden is absolutely on you to disprove what has already been proven to be true...
As for their "methodology" its a salary survey, it isn't rocket science and the NACE survey is universally accepted by educational institutions and employers nationwide.
But since YOU have a problem with the study clearly employers and academia should simply ignore the findings.
I guess this is all over your head, maybe you would have benefited from a liberal arts education
When the data that is provided supports other data points that are published elsewhere then the burden is absolutely on you to disprove what has already been proven to be true...
They provided summary conclusions, they didn't provide the data that drove those conclusions.
Standard statistical tests are used for a lot of reasons. That others are able to evaluate the work that was done is a pretty important reason. When non-standard tests are used (and the methodology isn't even disclosed), it is impossible for ANYONE outside of the inner circle to evaluate the information. And yes, the burden is on those doing the non-standard work to justify what they have done. I really am sorry that you aren't understanding that.
As for their "methodology" its a salary survey, it isn't rocket science and the NACE survey is universally accepted by educational institutions and employers nationwide.
Entire courses are dedicated to survey methodologies at the graduate level, both masters and doctoral. While not "rocket science" there is a lot more to it than the uninformed realize. Maybe you should look into it.
Quote:
But since YOU have a problem with the study clearly employers and academia should simply ignore the findings.
I guess this is all over your head, maybe you would have benefited from a liberal arts education
It's pretty clear who is having a difficult time understanding some pretty basic issues. I wish you good luck in your future educational endeavors.
In a few months, the next generation of college students are going to begin classes. We all need to do our part to ensure that they don't waste time or money pursuing worthless degrees which will leave them with huge debts and low wage jobs that provide them with no hopes of repaying those debts.
Remember kids. Think engineering, medical doctor, accounting and other such fruitful career paths.
Check the links below for more information on avoiding financial ruin.
And therein lies the fundamental problem with YouTube. Years ago, you'd meet a hump like this guy drunk at a party, promptly determine he was an a##h%%%, and move on. Now, we have to actually be confronted with his opinions enshrined forever in video. Thanks for posting this, not. Complete waste of DNA and time.
It never ceases to amaze me how the vocal minority can't seem to comprehend that not everyone is cut out to be an engineer or a doctor and, if they were, you would find significant unemployment in those fields, a devaluation of the degree and, in all probability, a reduction in salary.
Remember kids, don't listen to people who try to force their misguided agendas and personal biases down your throat.
Considering the number of threads the OP posts on this subject, I'm wondering if Wavelength is:
A) an engineer, doctor or accountant and truly wants to help future students
B) a holder of a degree in the liberal arts (non STEM) and has a good job from this degree and wants to maintain his/her hold on the market
C) a holder of a degree in the liberal arts (non STEM) and does not have a job in his/her chosen field and thus disgruntled and wants to hate on these majors
D) a non degreed person who just doesn't understand the value of any degree that s/he doesn't come directly in contact with
E) a non degreed person who just hates on the college educated
F) someone who really does care about any of it but really likes pushing buttons
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Worthless degree awareness month
