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I agree with you. There needs to be an "anti-Education" sub forum on City Data.
Career success has nothing to do with education, interpersonal skills, friendships, character, or compassion.
The student debt crises is mainly concentrated on in low end, for profit, "career schools". They should NOT be eligible for federal financial aid.
"Career Schools" are the problem, not the solution.
The debt is also concentrated among people who have gone to graduate school, and they usually make more money anyway. A lot more people are choosing to go to graduate school now that it's easier with online programs, so that's helping to drive up student loan debt.
Those wanting to go to college can always live at home. Earn an associate's degree at a junior college and then earn a bachelor's degree at their local state college.
It's a joke to be taking on major debt because of choices to enroll in out of state schools with dorm and/or apartment living.
Additionally students living at home can work part time if necessary. This would also allow them to work locally in their field of study and possibly gain full employment after graduation.
What about people living in rural areas far from any sort of junior college or university? Some people have no choice but to live away from home thus they need student loans. Sometimes going out of state is necessary if the colleges in their state don't have the degree they're looking for. Most sane people don't take out loans if they don't need to.
What about people living in rural areas far from any sort of junior college or university? Some people have no choice but to live away from home thus they need student loans. Sometimes going out of state is necessary if the colleges in their state don't have the degree they're looking for. Most sane people don't take out loans if they don't need to.
Take a job and work for your living costs? Like everyone else in the world
Being a college student doesn't mean you can live on loans with no effort to minimize it
And the excuse that they can't work and be a full time student isn't a real excuse. If they worked full time and studied part time and took 6 years instead of 4, it is still worth the 2 additional years. How many years would the 4 year grad spend paying off the loans? Likely more than the 2 years.
Take a job and work for your living costs? Like everyone else in the world
Being a college student doesn't mean you can live on loans with no effort to minimize it
And the excuse that they can't work and be a full time student isn't a real excuse. If they worked full time and studied part time and took 6 years instead of 4, it is still worth the 2 additional years. How many years would the 4 year grad spend paying off the loans? Likely more than the 2 years.
I'm not sure it's a trend but I like what my daughter in law and prospective son in law did and it seems to be a growing phenomenon both finished their BS degrees in 3 years.
I see your point but among the many facing longer educational paths those two "extra" years can be phenomenally expensive.
Take a job and work for your living costs? Like everyone else in the world
Being a college student doesn't mean you can live on loans with no effort to minimize it
And the excuse that they can't work and be a full time student isn't a real excuse. If they worked full time and studied part time and took 6 years instead of 4, it is still worth the 2 additional years. How many years would the 4 year grad spend paying off the loans? Likely more than the 2 years.
Yeah no, I would not recommend adding 2 more years. Either you finish early, 3 to 3.5 years, or you plan ahead and work summers as soon as you can. This builds strong work and savings habits, and reduces debt accumulation habits.
Those wanting to go to college can always live at home. Earn an associate's degree at a junior college and then earn a bachelor's degree at their local state college.
It's a joke to be taking on major debt because of choices to enroll in out of state schools with dorm and/or apartment living.
Additionally students living at home can work part time if necessary. This would also allow them to work locally in their field of study and possibly gain full employment after graduation.
You can do that as a residential student, as well. I worked part-time as an undergraduate, and I didn't live at home. Additionally, I worked as an RA, and received room and board as part of my compensation package for that. I also did internship practicum as part of my course of study, both for undergrad and graduate school, which gave me practical experience in the field. All of these things can be accomplished whether one lives on campus or at home.
I also received scholarships and grants that covered about 75% of my undergraduate tuition, so loans comprised a minimal portion of my total cost. For graduate school, I was 80% grant-funded.
You can go to a cheap state school and get a degree for 1/5th what the elite schools pay, and get the same jobs
Nobody wants to do that because then they can't graduate and impress their friends with their UCLA degree
You may.
Or you may get different jobs, based on name recognition of prestigious or specialized programs and perception of better training, due to connections made through alumni networks and internship opportunities, and due to internship placements received via school connections.
The problem is government involvement. These colleges charge what they do because they assume zero risk. This is in addition to the fact that people make poor financial decisions all the time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by boxus;
Of course, it is just a huge coincidence that college cost increases has outpaced about everything else it can compare to.
IDK about all colleges, but state universities have been forced to raise tuition to very high levels by state legislatures, that eliminated most support for higher ed. This began in the 80's in Washington State, and at the end of the 70's in California, when CA's taxpayer-revolt initiative, Proposition 13, was passed, which related to how property taxation was handled. The state gov't had to slash costs overnight, and support for the state higher ed system was one of the first things to go. And the cutbacks in allocations to the universities kept coming.
So it's actually about state government DIS-involvement; the abandonment of higher ed by some state legislatures.
I don't know why state governments, in the absence of a monumental tax policy change like CA had, would gradually undermine their state universities by cutting their budgets time and time again. Have state economies been declining decade after decade, since the 80's? And if so, why?
This doesn't address sharply rising costs at private colleges, which presumably have pretty solid endowments. This has been discussed here before, and some point out, that universities have added to the administrative hierarchy over the years, adding deans, raising the pay of university Presidents to cushy levels, and so on. There's some truth to that.
You can go to a cheap state school and get a degree for 1/5th what the elite schools pay, and get the same jobs
Nobody wants to do that because then they can't graduate and impress their friends with their UCLA degree
The problem is, that in some states, the "cheap state schools" are no longer cheap. They're no longer subsidized by their state budget, hardly at all.
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