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I don’t know much about NH’s claims, but usually large companies want to move to a large metro due to talent pool, amenities and mass transit. NH has none of that.
There are several small hedge funds that are now headquartered in Palm Beach and the rest of South FL that I know of, one very large one, and a few non-financial firms that recently moved. Skybridge, Universa, I Squared Capital, Network Capital, Tudor are just a few DW named off the top of her head. She worked at a major CT hedge fund and noted how many of the smaller ones, with high net worth, have left for FL. The CEO of her former hedge fund has a home in “The Palm Beaches” and is wondering if as he ages, he’ll also move that firm.
It’s not some conspiracy, Jay.
I did not say it was a conspiracy but it could be an exaggeration. I looked up the companies you mentioned and this is what I found:
Skybridge Capital lists its headquarters on Madison Avenue in New York. They also list offices in Palm Beach Gardens, London and Seoul, South Korea. Their Press address is also listed as New York City.
I Squared Capital also lists Miami as its headquarters but has offices in Hong Kong, Houston, London, New Delhi, New York and Singapore. I can't find any reference where the company originated.
Tudor Investment Group lists its headquarters in Stamford and New York City. It says it has offices in Connecticut, New York, Palm Beach, London, Singapore and Sydney.
So yes, a few investment firms are based in Florida. Makes sense since it is a major jumping off point for South America and the Caribbean for the US. Still is it stealing a lot of financial companies from New York and Connecticut? Questionable at best. Jay
Your story is admirable , and there are many people that are similar to you. However you can’t deny the overwhelming evidence of the decline of the middle class in CT and America. What has made America the envy of the world economically is the movement within the socio economic strata . I have researched this extensively, an I am telling you that the movements are no longer similar to the time period when you started out. As admirable as your experience is, it is limited to your personal interactions and behavior.
It is not only my opinion, but those of many others that see the middle class in CT, and the country . The economic climate for America for the different groups no longer represents that of the past.It is documented over and over again. The lack of wages keeping up with the cost of living. The skyrocketing cost of higher education that hits the middle class with an impact far greater than the other groups. That’s just a few. Then we get into the taxation increases in this state. The proliferation of 21st Century sweatshops here disguised as “ good jobs “. You do know what those Elite institutes of higher education are now teaching, correct? That the shareholder is more important then the worker.
The future of the economic climate here in CT , and the country, rests not upon the shoulders of the upper tiers, but of the 65 % of those here that do not have a degree. And that’s the profound difference from years past. That group was more able to achieve their goals, their dreams, their advancement through the economic climate because it was more affordable for them. Take a good hard look at the income/wealth gap in CT. It is heading to a “ have and have not” environment , which actually exists in other parts of the country. gated communities where the haves reside, and the rest on thee outside looking in. Their policies and ideology keep the poor sequestered , while the middle class struggles to keep up.
Liberal Progressive policies have time after time promoted policies and agenda changes to support and grant more entitlements to lower groups, and the upper growths benefit more from their achieved wealth and accumulated assets. The middle class is left out for the most part.
Your last statement has some ring of truth.But you are incorrect about the middle class. And I will add that CT can not survive economically without good jobs, opportunity and hope for those without degrees. The 35 % with degrees can only survive if the 65% get what is needed , or else the future is a return to a Middle Ages economic climate.
After all, what made CT a great state in the past, what made it a destination was the opportunity for those 65 % to prosper and grow. You can’t deny history. When you have an atmosphere of ideology to have the middle class work their jobs to pay for the disgraces of foolish spending, the importation of low educated, low skilled illegals numbering over 100,000 , you beat the middle class down.
And the results are quite clear in the present economic climate of this state. Wage growth lowest in New England. Economic growth lowest in New England. Percentage of population loss highest in New England. Taxation levels highest in New England. Connect the dots.
Beautiful and succinct. One of best posts I have read in a long time. I can only add that it is the deadly mixture of liberal AND conservative policies that has middle class in America squeezed. Liberals with giveaways to poor and conservatives with tax breaks to wealthy. CT is wealthy state and many previous generations did well as assets continued to gain value and growth expanded. 12 years ago, wealthy asset holders were bailed out as govt put a floor under housing and blew biggest stock bubble ever. People who bought houses in 1988 - 1999 still have major appreciation while 2003 onwards are sucking wind. It is akin to starting one ladder step down and then wondering why people are upset living here. It is timing. Also globalization and H1B have decimated competition for skilled labor in Northeast. I deal with it everyday. Cheap labor rules and neither party will step up for American workers. I mentioned a Pew study that showed 40% of all H1B who entered US bw 2010-2016 ended up between Philly, NJ, NYC, CT, Mass. That is 350k jobs and people think they are all techies in a back room. They are taking IT, Acctg, HR, Ops, Project roles..you name it. It is a game to classify someone as engineer when their true role in doing business work. Pay them 65k while it would normly cost 100k or more for than skill in NYC area. People just don't see the game and impact on wages.
I did not say it was a conspiracy but it could be an exaggeration. I looked up the companies you mentioned and this is what I found:
Skybridge Capital lists its headquarters on Madison Avenue in New York. They also list offices in Palm Beach Gardens, London and Seoul, South Korea. Their Press address is also listed as New York City.
I Squared Capital also lists Miami as its headquarters but has offices in Hong Kong, Houston, London, New Delhi, New York and Singapore. I can't find any reference where the company originated.
Tudor Investment Group lists its headquarters in Stamford and New York City. It says it has offices in Connecticut, New York, Palm Beach, London, Singapore and Sydney.
So yes, a few investment firms are based in Florida. Makes sense since it is a major jumping off point for South America and the Caribbean for the US. Still is it stealing a lot of financial companies from New York and Connecticut? Questionable at best. Jay
I’m not sure what your outlining of these companies pasts have to do with what’s happening at the present. Did you look up the amount of employees at each location? Tudor moved his entire management team to FL and left the lower level employees in Greenwich. I believe Appaloosa did the same. But what’s a HQ if the vast majority of its big salary employees are located in FL?
The point here is FL is aggressively attempting to recruit, and in many cases, is doing so successfully. You can’t deny that.
Out of curiosity, what grounds do you have to claim “questionable”? Is it based on actual knowledge or assumptions based on whatever the NH governor stated? Because this isn’t the governor’s claim - this is the media (several different outlets) reporting what’s actually happening.
And that all being said, one has to wonder - why are all of these hedge funds opening up large offices in south FL? What’s to come?
Did you even read the article? What’s illegal about it?
These campaigns aren’t offering monetary incentives to x company over y company. They are approaching certain firms and outlining the tax benefits that are already in place, which benefit everyone equally.
70 financial companies is a lot, especially seeing how much these companies, and their employees, are worth. Who wouldn’t want to recruit them?
Florida is not gaining anything by recruiting these companies since Florida doesn't have an income tax. Other states can not compete with zero.
Also, hedge funds do not pay taxes at any Govt level, they are pass thru vehicles. The owners (shareholders of the funds) pay the taxes.
The only taxes Florida could get from these companies would be sales taxes on local purchases and local property taxes from their employees spending their salaries in the local economy.
Florida is not gaining anything by recruiting these companies since Florida doesn't have an income tax. Other states can not compete with zero.
Also, hedge funds do not pay taxes at any Govt level, they are pass thru vehicles. The owners (shareholders of the funds) pay the taxes.
The only taxes Florida could get from these companies would be sales taxes on local purchases and local property taxes from their employees spending their salaries in the local economy.
Uh - thousands of millionaire incomes is certainly something, adding to your last point. That’s an incredible advantage.
Florida is not gaining anything by recruiting these companies since Florida doesn't have an income tax. Other states can not compete with zero.
Also, hedge funds do not pay taxes at any Govt level, they are pass thru vehicles. The owners (shareholders of the funds) pay the taxes.
The only taxes Florida could get from these companies would be sales taxes on local purchases and local property taxes from their employees spending their salaries in the local economy.
For starters they gain jobs. And they get their taxes other ways, sales taxes, property taxes, corporate taxes, usage fees, and on and on. They gain A LOT.
For starters they gain jobs. And they get their taxes other ways, sales taxes, property taxes, corporate taxes, usage fees, and on and on. They gain A LOT.
Jonathan Guzman and Mayra Finol earn about $130,000 a year, combined, in technology jobs. Though that is more than double the median, debt from their years at St. John’s University in New York has been hard to overcome.
The two 28-year-olds in West Hartford, Conn., have about $51,000 in student debt, plus $18,000 in auto loans and $50,000 across eight credit cards. Adding financial pressure are a baby daughter and a mortgage of around $270,000.
“I’m normally a worrier, but this is next-level stuff. I’ve never been more stressed,” Mr. Guzman said. “Never would I have thought with the amount we make I would have these problems.”
They no longer dine out several times a week. Other hits to their budget were hard to avoid, such as a wrecked car that forced them to borrow more.
Ms. Finol hasn’t used her T.J. Maxx credit card in more than a year. She makes the minimum monthly payment on its balance of approximately $7,500. Her monthly statement says if she continues at this pace, she will need about 23 years to pay it off.
Earlier this year, Mr. Guzman put his credit cards in a Ziploc bag with water and placed it in the freezer. In May, however, they went to two weddings, and needed a card to cover the cost of a gift and a rental car.
Mr. Guzman removed one of the credit cards from the freezer. “A lot of things came at once,” he said. Since then, he’s taken the rest of them out, too.
Cry me a river! $7500 on a TJMaxx card? I'd be more impressed with Home Depot if they needed to make repairs to the house, but TJMaxx? There is nothing in there that one needs. And you can get killer deals (i.e. work-appropriate ladies tops for under $10).
If you can't afford to go to a wedding - don't! Sounds like a classic case of keeping up with the Joneses - and that's from someone who complains about the high COL here often.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuele
The tax charged in some CT towns can be outrageous . Do they even pick up the trash and yard waste, or do you have to pay extra for it ?
For starters they gain jobs. And they get their taxes other ways, sales taxes, property taxes, corporate taxes, usage fees, and on and on. They gain A LOT.
I'm going to write this again "hedge funds do not pay taxes at any level of Govt" They are pass thru vehicles and their shareholders pay the taxes. Those taxes would also be paid in the state in which those shareholders live.
Changing a hedge fund HQ to Florida doesn't mean anything. I can register a business in Florida today and they won't gain a single employee. Only thing they will gain is the fee I paid to register the business.
When entire firms like Bridgewater close their operations and relocate to Florida with all their employees I will pay attention. Nothing of the kind is happening.
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