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Old 12-03-2016, 06:45 PM
 
599 posts, read 401,431 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikMal View Post
More pictures, pre-fire, here on the Ghostship website: http://www.oaklandghostship.com/
Good grief thanks for posting but I have to say that place looks like a death trap in the making! No wonder firefighters were having so much trouble getting inside the building as they said it was like a maze.
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Old 12-03-2016, 11:18 PM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
42,839 posts, read 26,247,208 times
Reputation: 34039
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicet4 View Post
I am amazed that California of all places did not require fire sprinklers in this warehouse as a retrofit.

NIST Re-creation of "The Station Night Club fire" without sprinklers


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxiOXZ55hbc

One puff of that black smoke you see lowering about 1:20 is super heated air and instant death. Lung tissue does not do well being baked at 1,000 deg F.

NIST Recreation of "The Station Nightclub Fire" with Sprinklers


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gT1EWVR1iP8

Being a two story warehouse it has to be one of the older warehouses in town dating back 60 years or better building of wood with a masonry or brick structure. When these older buildings catch on fire the fire moves so fast you can not outrun it.

Someone (owner of the building) is going to go to jail for this.
From what I've read, nothing in the building was permitted, the owner denies that she knew anyone was living in the building. Inspectors had previously tried to inspect the premises after complaints but were barred from entering. (I think they should have pushed it and gotten the Fire Dept. to get a warrant to allow entry, but I hate second guessing)
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Old 12-03-2016, 11:44 PM
 
15,546 posts, read 12,012,788 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicet4 View Post
The party was taking place on the second floor and looking at the building 1)all the windows have bars or grates and 2)exit doors are far and few between.
I read an article interviewing one of the survivors, and they said that there were exits on the 2nd floor. Except that it was such a maze of stuff on the second floor that unless you had prior knowledge of the exits, you would have never been able to find them. I would think especially in a panic to get out, everyone would be trying to get to a known exit, and not search around in the smoke and fire for a different exit.


Quote:
With wood stud walls the stairs were wood as well... when they get 70 years old, no doubt that building is 70 years old or older the wood gets really dry but it doesn't burn so much as it explodes into flame.
From what I've read, they didn't even have actual stairs in the building. They had make shift stairs created from wood pallets. I've always heard those things are full of chemicals, so I would think they would quickly burn. I had heard on the news that the stairs were completely gone by the time firefighters arrived, and so they had no way of reaching the second floor. The person interviewed for the article had said he had a difficult time getting up the stairs, and injured his ankle coming down them (before the fire). So combined with hidden exits, I would think the stairs would have been one of the main reasons so many people may have died.
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Old 12-04-2016, 01:01 PM
 
Location: Bel Air, California
23,766 posts, read 29,041,688 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
From what I've read, nothing in the building was permitted, the owner denies that she knew anyone was living in the building. Inspectors had previously tried to inspect the premises after complaints but were barred from entering. (I think they should have pushed it and gotten the Fire Dept. to get a warrant to allow entry, but I hate second guessing)
seems like you're second guessing
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Old 12-04-2016, 05:19 PM
 
Location: New Jersey
16,911 posts, read 10,585,453 times
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Looks like a death trap. I see that 33 are now confirmed dead. This was one of those "artists squatting" places. I read that neighbors saw different people living there and coming and going all the time. Hopefully no rescue workers were hurt.
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Old 12-05-2016, 06:05 AM
 
Location: Long Neck , DE
4,902 posts, read 4,213,922 times
Reputation: 8101
These deaths could have been avoided if the code violations of which authorities were aware were enforced.
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Old 12-05-2016, 07:21 AM
 
Location: Texas
4,852 posts, read 3,644,169 times
Reputation: 15374
City is largely responsible for not enforcing zoning violations they knew were being violated. The owners are responsible for violating zoning laws. The squatters were responsible knowing they were in violation of zoning. The party goers were responsible by going to a party in a place that was clearly not inspected or zoned for the party. This will be a lawyers wet dream between whom they can sue the most.
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Old 12-05-2016, 07:50 AM
 
Location: Bel Air, California
23,766 posts, read 29,041,688 times
Reputation: 37337
Quote:
Originally Posted by mschrief View Post
City is largely responsible for not enforcing zoning violations they knew were being violated. The owners are responsible for violating zoning laws. The squatters were responsible knowing they were in violation of zoning. The party goers were responsible by going to a party in a place that was clearly not inspected or zoned for the party. This will be a lawyers wet dream between whom they can sue the most.

the entity with the most money will probably be found to be the most liable
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Old 12-05-2016, 08:35 AM
 
Location: Southern California
12,713 posts, read 15,524,309 times
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The owner seems like a nice guy:

Owner of Oakland warehouse rebuked over post about deadly fire | Fox News
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Old 12-05-2016, 08:38 AM
 
Location: Central Ohio
10,833 posts, read 14,930,697 times
Reputation: 16582
'People want answers': Criminal probe of Oakland fire launched as death toll hits 36

The owner extremely concerned that he doesn't spend a good portion of his life in prison.

Yes, this sort of thing has happened before and is known as the Hamlet chicken processing plant fire

Quote:
A federal investigation was launched. Owner Emmett Roe received a 20-year prison sentence, of which he served only four years. The company received the highest fine in the history of North Carolina, which was less than the federal minimum. As a result, the federal government took over enforcement of much of North Carolina's worker safety laws
Don't try to tell me the owner of the building didn't know what was going on here. He knew damn well what was going on.

Interesting article with classic video of the owner Oakland warehouse fire: Who is the man behind the ‘Ghost Ship’?

But he is an artist, dontcha know? Not a very bright artist but still an artist.
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