U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Pets > Dogs
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 08-31-2008, 12:56 PM
 
Location: Texas
8,062 posts, read 16,186,770 times
Reputation: 3701

Advertisements

Movin' on,
I think I'm safe in saying that NO ONE here wants you "to feel guilty" about purchasing a puppy. If this is what you want to do, then we simply want to make sure you get one from a reputable breeder and that your puppy is healthy and genetically sound.

Here are the concerns I had about that web site:
1. Puppies are available all of the time.
2. There is NO mention of the puppies' parents, let alone info on the breeding, pedigrees, etc. This really makes me wonder!
3. Reputable breeders screen people who want their puppies; they don't just promise puppies to the first folks who send them money.
4. Good breeders sell with limited rights and sometimes a spay/neuter contract. They don't want the potential for their puppies to be used for careless breeding.

I know you simply want a great pet, so why does all of this matter? Inbreeding and careless breeding can enhance genetic defects. The pup could have serious health problems show up throughout its life. Or it may not. But do you really want to take that risk?

I'm going to be brutally honest now -- that website is pretty slick but it doesn't provide much REAL info about the breeding stock. I have a suspicion that this is either a puppy mill or a puppy broker who purchases and sells puppies from a variety of puppy mills. That's why they can have pups available all of the time! Good breeders are PROUD of the championships their dogs have won and their pedigrees. That's why they choose to breed them! I don't know how much you agreed to pay for this puppy but wouldn't you rather pay a little bit more (and you might not even have to!) to buy a puppy with sound parents who are recognized champions with excellent health and temperament?

Google the national shih-tzu club or a state/local club for good breeder recommendations.

 
Old 08-31-2008, 01:00 PM
 
Location: in purgurtory in London
3,721 posts, read 3,476,718 times
Reputation: 1292
It's your perogative to do want you want, but I know there are "small little fluffies" out there just waiting to be adopted. Rescues just aren't shelters, a lot of small breed dogs end up at foster homes ran by a collective of people and in many cases are breed specific. A friend of mine reluctantly gave his Maltese up to a rescue in Florida, before he moved back to the UK and that pup went straight to a foster home. In fact last year I was a foster mum to two Shih Tzu's one for 4 months the other for 6 until they were adopted, so I know shelters have them. Just before them I had a puppy (3 month old Cocker Spaniel pup) but he was adopted in less than two weeks.

Frankly I think too many people look at cute little fluffies as accessories or substitutes for things not right in their lives.

There again maybe I shouldn't preach so much.
 
Old 08-31-2008, 01:03 PM
 
Location: in purgurtory in London
3,721 posts, read 3,476,718 times
Reputation: 1292
Quote:
Originally Posted by teatime View Post
Movin' on,
I think I'm safe in saying that NO ONE here wants you "to feel guilty" about purchasing a puppy. If this is what you want to do, then we simply want to make sure you get one from a reputable breeder and that your puppy is healthy and genetically sound.

Here are the concerns I had about that web site:
1. Puppies are available all of the time.
2. There is NO mention of the puppies' parents, let alone info on the breeding, pedigrees, etc. This really makes me wonder!
3. Reputable breeders screen people who want their puppies; they don't just promise puppies to the first folks who send them money.
4. Good breeders sell with limited rights and sometimes a spay/neuter contract. They don't want the potential for their puppies to be used for careless breeding.

I know you simply want a great pet, so why does all of this matter? Inbreeding and careless breeding can enhance genetic defects. The pup could have serious health problems show up throughout its life. Or it may not. But do you really want to take that risk?

I'm going to be brutally honest now -- that website is pretty slick but it doesn't provide much REAL info about the breeding stock. I have a suspicion that this is either a puppy mill or a puppy broker who purchases and sells puppies from a variety of puppy mills. That's why they can have pups available all of the time! Good breeders are PROUD of the championships their dogs have won and their pedigrees. That's why they choose to breed them! I don't know how much you agreed to pay for this puppy but wouldn't you rather pay a little bit more (and you might not even have to!) to buy a puppy with sound parents who are recognized champions with excellent health and temperament?

Google the national shih-tzu club or a state/local club for good breeder recommendations.
Exactly. I'm sure it's a puppy farm or a broker.
 
Old 08-31-2008, 04:46 PM
 
4,247 posts, read 9,353,015 times
Reputation: 1461
Quote:
Originally Posted by teatime View Post
Movin' on,
I think I'm safe in saying that NO ONE here wants you "to feel guilty" about purchasing a puppy. If this is what you want to do, then we simply want to make sure you get one from a reputable breeder and that your puppy is healthy and genetically sound.

Here are the concerns I had about that web site:
1. Puppies are available all of the time.
2. There is NO mention of the puppies' parents, let alone info on the breeding, pedigrees, etc. This really makes me wonder!
3. Reputable breeders screen people who want their puppies; they don't just promise puppies to the first folks who send them money.
4. Good breeders sell with limited rights and sometimes a spay/neuter contract. They don't want the potential for their puppies to be used for careless breeding.

I know you simply want a great pet, so why does all of this matter? Inbreeding and careless breeding can enhance genetic defects. The pup could have serious health problems show up throughout its life. Or it may not. But do you really want to take that risk?

I'm going to be brutally honest now -- that website is pretty slick but it doesn't provide much REAL info about the breeding stock. I have a suspicion that this is either a puppy mill or a puppy broker who purchases and sells puppies from a variety of puppy mills. That's why they can have pups available all of the time! Good breeders are PROUD of the championships their dogs have won and their pedigrees. That's why they choose to breed them! I don't know how much you agreed to pay for this puppy but wouldn't you rather pay a little bit more (and you might not even have to!) to buy a puppy with sound parents who are recognized champions with excellent health and temperament?

Google the national shih-tzu club or a state/local club for good breeder recommendations.
Yes, you are right, and it is bothering me. I spent $10K in March/April to save my dog's life. I'd do it again, but it isn't something I would want to do, not to mention the costs of three Vets at the end and the cremation service, etc. However, he was the light of my life, so whatever. I would prefer not to get into that situation again.

You guys know more than I do. The breeder said she'd send me pics today and so far no pics. There was a puppy at the puppy store I fell in love with and they guaranteed health for two to four years and no puppy mills. He was $2K. Considering what I've gone through, mental health wise, I'd gladly pay it. I saw the AKC papers.

As I've said, I am very picky. Sorry if this is a defect of my character, but it is what it is. I have no kids and my angel was a doll. I only want the same this time around.
 
Old 08-31-2008, 05:32 PM
 
Location: Wilmington, NC
261 posts, read 1,100,975 times
Reputation: 340
Quote:
Originally Posted by movin'on View Post
I lost my Maltese three years ago to drowning. There wasn't a day that went by I didn't think of her. My grief over her was only superceded by Teddy Bear's death.
Do you mind me asking how your Maltese drowned?

My little beloved Spikey is a Maltese and I hope to keep him out of harms way as much as possible....but we can't think of every possible danger can we?
 
Old 08-31-2008, 06:02 PM
 
4,247 posts, read 9,353,015 times
Reputation: 1461
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyNCGirl View Post
Do you mind me asking how your Maltese drowned?

My little beloved Spikey is a Maltese and I hope to keep him out of harms way as much as possible....but we can't think of every possible danger can we?
Yes, I do mind you asking, as it's very painful. The only thing I can say is to make sure you have narrow slots in your fence and watch your dog at every second. Never let him/her off a leash.
 
Old 08-31-2008, 06:06 PM
 
Location: The Great State of Arkansas
5,981 posts, read 16,287,868 times
Reputation: 7572
Quote:
Originally Posted by movin'on View Post
The breeder said she'd send me pics today and so far no pics. There was a puppy at the puppy store I fell in love with and they guaranteed health for two to four years and no puppy mills. He was $2K. Considering what I've gone through, mental health wise, I'd gladly pay it. I saw the AKC papers.

Movin, we want you to be happy and buy wisely if that is the route you choose to go. I don't want to upset you or break your heart, but I'm not entirely sure that all puppy stores know where their puppies come from...and AKC papers are issued to puppy mill dogs, too. Two alleged parents who pair up produce an AKC pup, but there's no guarantees.

I'd suggest you talk to a reputable breeder with Shih Tzus, and it may take some time to find one, or Shih Tzu rescue may be able to help you. Talk with them about their pet quality pups from their litters. Yes, you may pay more...and pet quality may mean nothing more than it's just not a good candidate for the show ring.

Look for this when you are wandering around the sites - COE breeder. Code of Ethics. These are the ones who stand behind their litters 100%. If there is ever a time you are unable or unwilling to care for the dog, they take them back with no questions asked. Breeders who are producing quality lines will have planned breedings - very planned - and you may have to wait a little while, but your dog will come with certificates referable to eyes, bone structure (OFA numbers) and general overall health. It's truly the way you want to go - a general AKC breeding is only as good as the mom and dad, and you really have no way of knowing anything without intense research more than a generation back. A COE breeder can provide you with names and health histories for generations back that can be verified.

Here's a quick look at COE for Shih Tzu breeders by the American Shih Tzu club - and you will note #5...which would immediately rule out your prospect at the "puppy store".

American Shih Tzu Club

Here's their info and guidelines on breeding:

Shih Tzu Breeder Guidelines


Please be careful and be wise. I'm so glad you've decided to open your heart and home to another pet! Go slowly and I'm sure you'll find the perfect companion!
 
Old 08-31-2008, 06:25 PM
 
Location: Swamps of Florida
3,412 posts, read 9,198,999 times
Reputation: 1993
I am too sorry for your loss and i understand how much you want the dog that you want.
Buying for the store = buying from the puppy mill/BYB (that's where pups are coming from to the store) I tell you one thing, NO reputable breeder will give/sell their pup to the store. NONE!!

If it was up to me, i would close all the stores that sell puppies.
Find a reputable breeder who will guarantee EVERYTHING from the health to the taking puppy back if any issues arise. AKC papers mean NOTHING!!!! Absolutely NOTHING!! I can register pound purebred at AKC. AKC is a biggest unreliable source, i have a purebred proof at home!


Please, avoid the stores at all cost. If you want to spend 2K for a good dog, you need to find a good breeder, simple as that. Anything less is contributing to BYBs, and i hate to see anyone doing this.

Good luck!
 
Old 08-31-2008, 07:02 PM
 
4,247 posts, read 9,353,015 times
Reputation: 1461
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShepsMom View Post
I am too sorry for your loss and i understand how much you want the dog that you want.
Buying for the store = buying from the puppy mill/BYB (that's where pups are coming from to the store) I tell you one thing, NO reputable breeder will give/sell their pup to the store. NONE!!

If it was up to me, i would close all the stores that sell puppies.
Find a reputable breeder who will guarantee EVERYTHING from the health to the taking puppy back if any issues arise. AKC papers mean NOTHING!!!! Absolutely NOTHING!! I can register pound purebred at AKC. AKC is a biggest unreliable source, i have a purebred proof at home!


Please, avoid the stores at all cost. If you want to spend 2K for a good dog, you need to find a good breeder, simple as that. Anything less is contributing to BYBs, and i hate to see anyone doing this.

Good luck!
What everyone seems to forget, is that these puppies only want the best. They are lost without us. So why should I feel guilty over adopting a puppy/
 
Old 08-31-2008, 07:35 PM
 
Location: Deep in the Heart of Texas
1,479 posts, read 7,016,563 times
Reputation: 1908
Quote:
Originally Posted by movin'on View Post
What everyone seems to forget, is that these puppies only want the best. They are lost without us. So why should I feel guilty over adopting a puppy/
There's no question that every puppy deserves the best home possible and no one should feel guilty for giving a puppy a home.

I think what people are trying to say is this: You've been through hell with the recent illness and death of your beloved dog. Shih Tzu's are prone to a number of hereditary problems that can be heartwrenching and expensive to treat. If you really want a puppy, by going to a reputable breeder you will be doing everything possible to ensure that your new pup doesn't have a genetic predisposition to issues such as luxating patellas, eye problems, etc. that will cause you heartache and your dog immeasurable misery. With an older rescue dog you will pretty much know what you are getting.

I wish you well.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Pets > Dogs
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:01 PM.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top