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You are painting with an awfully broad brush and presuming guilt before innocence on a large segment of the population.
I am simply stating facts that you continue to run away from. The "real problem" is all these guns. The impacts of the "real problem" are all this needless death and mayhem. But you don't care about any of that.
The NRA has more firearm safety programs now than ever in it's history.
What portion of their budget comes from gun and ammo manufacturers? What portion of that budget is spent on gun safety classes versus lobbying and dishonest propagandizing to promote fear and advance unlimited gun rights?
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Originally Posted by Orlandochuck1
CCW carriers are not the ones responsible for gun crime stats. It is easily tracked be CCW revocations, which is extremely rare.
No one has said that they are. But we still have 30,000 dead and more than six times that number maimed by guns every year. We are all responsible for coming up with ways to reduce that sort of carnage in society, but certain groups shrink from that responsibility, and some go so far as to work energetically against the harm-reduction efforts of the rest.
Despite the stereotypes that we all use to help simplify the world, people are not actually divided up into teams of criminals and law-abiders. As far as guns go, there are gun-owners who have already committed a gun-related crime and gun-owners who have not as of yet. That's really the most you can say for the law-abiders. As a group, you can't trust them. Some of them commit their first gun-related crime every day. You can't predict which ones it will be.
Yes, you do... you do distinguish between 120 million honest law abiding Americans and violent criminals.
Most gun crimes are committed by criminals that are repeat offenders.
The fact that you want to assume all gun owners are criminals or potential criminals, just exposes your agenda to disarm all Americans.
Yes, you do... you do distinguish between 120 million honest law abiding Americans and violent criminals. Most gun crimes are committed by criminals that are repeat offenders. The fact that you want to assume all gun owners are criminals or potential criminals, just exposes your agenda to disarm all Americans.
You're losing it here. People convicted of their first ever gun-crime were all among your cherished "law-abiders" the day before. Despite all your wishful thinking, there is no "bright line" out there, nor is there any way of knowing in advance which law-abiders will flip out today and blow one or more people away. What can be known with confidence is that if fewer guns were out there, fewer flipper-outers would be able to dispatch anyone at all.
Your proposals to date have been worthless. Tougher laws promote injustice, but they do not deter crime, particularly not crime that is heavily based on spur-of-the-moment impulse. Why not admit it: you're just an "I don't care" person. There is no amount of death and mayhem that would actually bother you or move you to do one single meaningful thing about it.
I'll say. In comparison to the US, Japan has virtually eliminated gun-related deaths.
How have they been worthless? Criminals don't give a f*** about the laws, and that is evident. So make an example out of them! You murder someone, you may have to pay with your own life! You commit a violent crime with a gun, you may have to do hard time with no chance of parole! As I've said, actions have consequences! Not to mention your solution will cause more civil unrest like never seen before. So unless you personally going to put your money where your mouth is, and be one of those who actively partakes in any form of confiscation, you're blowing smoke! As for Japan, again we are NOT Japan! They have nowhere near the "diversity" that this country has, and do not cater well to those who are not native. In other words, you move there, you play by their rules, and their culture, and not the other way around where here it's turned into "you must cater to my culture!" I'll give to the Japanese though. In the face of a natural disaster the Japanese people stuck together and helped each other through it. You did not hear much of looting going on there. Not the case here, when Katrina hit the gulf coast 10 years ago, where the law of the jungle took over!
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Originally Posted by Cape Cod Todd
Guns don't kill people. People kill people.
You could say the same about cars.
Most cars today can go 100mph, many can reach 60mph in seconds but where can you drive that car legally at 100mph outside a race track?
The reason we don't have drivers speeding through school zones is because we have laws of the road.
The same applies for guns. A gun can't aim and shoot without someone pulling the trigger.
A car, a gun, a nuclear missile are all inanimate objects until we decide to use them.
Take that fast car to the race track, take the gun to the firing range, aim that nuclear missile at isis and use them the way they were designed to be used. Any other action is criminal.
Indeed.
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Originally Posted by Reynard32
Yes, the worst thing you can do in the million-to-one chance of being confronted by an armed intruder in your home is try to pull a weapon. The intruder did not come to kill you, but as any LEO would do in the same circumstances, if you put the intruder in fear for his own life. he will blow you away without a second thought.
LOL! Those are the same old self-reported nonsense NRA stories as have been debunked already for years and years. Most are tales of some dope hearing a noise in the garage and going out with his GUN to scare off a raccoon. The FBI records about 250 cases of justifiable homicide per year. From all sources.
To your first comment, if you are defenseless there is a greater chance of you getting blown away than not having anything at all.
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Originally Posted by Reynard32
Actually, it's people with guns who kill people. Themselves, others. innocent passers-by. It can be anyone. Absent all these easily available guns, the capacity to kill would still be there of course, but it would be a tiny, tiny fraction of what it is with a gun in hand.
No. Cape Codd Todd had it right. It's people who kill people. Be it a gun, knife, bat, their bare hands...ect... Most people getting killed as innocent passer-bys are shot by those who have alterior motives anyway, like say in a drive by shooting.... Of course we won't address that issue and off the SOB that committed the drive by and use him as an example! Nope. Let's go after those who obey the law, and haven't committed any crimes, because there is a very SMALL chance (or rather you perceive)that they might!
I am simply stating facts that you continue to run away from. The "real problem" is all these guns. The impacts of the "real problem" are all this needless death and mayhem. But you don't care about any of that.
No the REAL problem that you fail to address is the folks who don't obey the laws, are a drain on society, because they can't become productive members of society whether it be due to upbringing (a big part of it) or have no moral compass whatsoever! They are the ones causing all of this needless death and mayhem, but you don't care about that! You'd rather coddle them, and blame others for their short comings!
What portion of their budget comes from gun and ammo manufacturers? What portion of that budget is spent on gun safety classes versus lobbying and dishonest propagandizing to promote fear and advance unlimited gun rights?
No one has said that they are. But we still have 30,000 dead and more than six times that number maimed by guns every year. We are all responsible for coming up with ways to reduce that sort of carnage in society, but certain groups shrink from that responsibility, and some go so far as to work energetically against the harm-reduction efforts of the rest.
Like I said, The NRA offers more firearm safety programs than at anytime in their history. I am an NRA firearms safety instructor, I also teach CCW and advanced firearm self defense classes. I personally qualified over 500 CCW's this year. I am very knowledgeable about the NRA safety programs.
Of the 30,000 firearm deaths, 18,000 were suicides that many would have found another method of killing themselves if there were no gun available. Look at Japan, way more suicides, no guns. To deal with this, you have to take away the will of the individual to kill themselves. We need a better mental health system.
Included in the 30,000 is justifiable homicides that lives were actually saved. Also included are police shootings.
The true total of firearm murders is about 8000. Approximately 60% of this number are gang related, inner city drug war shootings.
Statistically, the chances of being a random victim of gun violence is minimal, unless you are a gang banger or drug dealer in the ghetto.
It's not as if anyone argues that guns get up by themselves and shoot people. Many of us just don't see a reason why so many people need to have the ability to kill people so easily and so MANY of them (as you can with a gun).
As most of us know, there was a recent attack in China on elementary school kids which left 22 wounded. If the guy had a gun, it would have been like Newton, CT. Sure, a knife can also kill (happened in China a few yrs ago), but in general, it takes longer and is harder (which would give others time to stop the attacker).
I really don't see why anyone, other than the cops and military, should have the ability to STOCK UP on guns and ammunition. Sure, I can see having a single gun if you live in a city/suburb if you're scared in your home and maybe a few if you live in a rural area....even in those scenarios, no one really needs to have a gun that can fire many times before re-loading. And only a tiny fraction of people need to be able to have like more than 10 bullets at any given time. I live in TX, a totally gun loving state, which was a bit of a culture shock. I see no reason why people I know should have multiple guns as a HOBBY.
So you agree to let me keep 10 bullets on me at a time for my handgun at home, incase someone breaks in and tries to kill my family ? OK got it, thanks ...
How will I practice shooting ? when I go to the gun range and purchase my 10 bullets, allowed by you, how will he know I don't still have 6 bullets at home ?
By the way, I think you should only be able to keep 3 gallons of gas in your car at a time, and enough food in your house for 3 meals, I don't want you to go crazy and start houses on fire with all that extra gas, like you could totally burn down your neibors house if you have alot of gas ..
After the fact. With the benefit of hindsight, we can all tell who the risky ones were. This of course is not "actionable intelligence."
The only after the fact difference is their mass shootings. All the other factors were present beforehand.
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Among other irrelevant variables, Japan does not have as many McDonalds per capita as we do either. But they do have gun control. The US does not. We pay a steep price for that. For every gun-related homicide in Japan, the US has more than 1,000. We have by far the worst levels of gun-related death and mayhem in the developed world. Some people just don't care.
Since the FBI says that 80-90% of all murders are committed by a prior felon, logic would be for you to immediately keep ALL felons off the street before attempting to disarm law abiding citizens.
Want to eliminate 80-90% of all murders? There you go!...
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